[Javierelizondo]

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I still have the pre-production HD 700 here, and it is, overall, an outstanding headphone (and my opinions expressed in the first post of this thread still stand).

Have you ever power them with the Fostex HP-P1?   Is the amplifier power enough for the HD-700's?

 
 

 

[Sniperbombers]

What i'm more curious about for the HD700's is their ability to reproduce the lower frequencies. I just want a bit of oomph while still being very clear .

 

[Currawong]

Quote:

Quote:

I still have the pre-production HD 700 here, and it is, overall, an outstanding headphone (and my opinions expressed in the first post of this thread still stand).

Have you ever power them with the Fostex HP-P1?   Is the amplifier power enough for the HD-700's?

I was using mine pre-production pair out of a HP-P1 and I felt the result was fine, as far as driving them goes. The 150 Ohm impedance was intended so that they would less demanding on amps. However I think a good OTL tube amp will be the best match for them sonically. 

 
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What i'm more curious about for the HD700's is their ability to reproduce the lower frequencies. I just want a bit of oomph while still being very clear .

This is one area that I felt the prototypes were lacking. I gave fairly detailed feedback, which I hope they've taken into account. However what I think would be ideal might compromise other goals they had in the design. We wont know until we hear the production versions, however.
 

 

[jrkong]

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This is one area that I felt the prototypes were lacking. I gave fairly detailed feedback, which I hope they've taken into account. However what I think would be ideal might compromise other goals they had in the design. We wont know until we hear the production versions, however.
 

I find that Sennheiser has been leaning a bit more towards a bass light sound signature with their audiophile line in the recent years
 
 

 

[John Willett]

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I find that Sennheiser has been leaning a bit more towards a bass light sound signature with their audiophile line in the recent years
 
 

I find that it is more of an accurate and natural bass, rather than a hyped or over-heavy bass,
 
If you are used to headphones with a bass emphasis, it could sound "bass light" when it isn't.
 

 

[project86]

I find the bass to be pretty darn good on the pre-production unit. It obviously doesn't have the rumble of my LA7000, nor the midbass slam of my W1000x, but it hits fast and seems quite accurate. In quantity, there is more to be heard than a K701, which was exactly what I was hoping for. 
 
They certainly aren't bass monsters, and I can see being a tad disappointed with the bass with some music. Most of the time it is great though.

 

[maverickronin]

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I find that it is more of an accurate and natural bass, rather than a hyped or over-heavy bass,
 
If you are used to headphones with a bass emphasis, it could sound "bass light" when it isn't.

Well the HD800 doesn't even meet that ideal either.  Depending on your perspective it either has a mild mid bass hump or a mild bass roll off.  I'd call it rolled off and on the bass light side by a bit.
 
You can complain about the level of the treble and you could even be right, but the LCD-2/3 have almost perfectly flat bass extension and a better relative levels of bass and midrange.

 

[ac500]

Obviously measurements show the LCD2 to have incredible bass extension, however you cannot judge any FR in sub-parts, you MUST look at the whole thing. The reason for this is because if a headphone has treble roll-off and flat bass, then you're more likely to turn the volume up to hear the treble, effectively resulting in a MASSIVE bass boost. In other words, where you consider the "0db" point on an FR graph is very important, and I don't think an arbitrary point really works accurately. A weighted average of the amplitudes based on human perception of loudness would be far better IMO at choosing the 0db point of an FR graph.
 
Graphs of the HD800 show it being pretty flat down to 20hz too, and I read that Sennheiser may have updated them with a bit more sub-bass as well. All I can say regarding bass is, the HD800s strike me as having the most perfectly balanced bass I've heard. I am not a basshead... I do not find the HD800s bass quantity lacking in any way, and if anything it might have too much for some things. To my ears, my HD800 has more actual bass than my HD650, while the HD650 has more of a midbass hump giving it a muffled thumpy sound. It's been a while since I heard an LCD2, but I remember that I turn it up a lot because there's almost no treble (wow according to innerfidelity, it's -20db for 10khz-20khz)
 
Anyway... I think Sennheiser got bass perfect with the HD800 unless you're a basshead. Hip hop is the only thing that wants boosted bass, and I don't really listen to that anyway.

 

[TMRaven]

HD800 can't be more flat than the LCD-2 I imagine.  Although I havn't heard the LCD2 I have heard the HD800, and it plays the same trick a lot of other audiophile headphones do.  It has a treble spike to help bring out details within a song, resulting in the bass and mids being drowned out a little.  Sounds nothing like a pair of speakers at all, which are able to get the same amount of crisp and clear treble without making it loud.  I also really didn't think much of the HD800's bass as well-- not its sub bass anyways.  I'm not as much of a basshead as I'm a person who just likes comparing headphones to speakers.

 

[ac500]

It depends where you look. LCD2 is all bass and mids, and lacks any treble to speak of. In that sense the HD800 is much more neutral -- granted "more" being the key. It does have more treble than neutral but that can be fixed with a dark amp or EQ.

 

[Saintly]

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Obviously measurements show the LCD2 to have incredible bass extension, however you cannot judge any FR in sub-parts, you MUST look at the whole thing. The reason for this is because if a headphone has treble roll-off and flat bass, then you're more likely to turn the volume up to hear the treble, effectively resulting in a MASSIVE bass boost. In other words, where you consider the "0db" point on an FR graph is very important, and I don't think an arbitrary point really works accurately. A weighted average of the amplitudes based on human perception of loudness would be far better IMO at choosing the 0db point of an FR graph.
 
 

Great post!
 
Regarding the bass boost to HD 800 beyond SN 10xxx, I remember seeing some posts claiming that Jan Meier confirmed the bass boost.  I emailed Mr. Meier about this a few days ago and he said there has not been any sonic changes that he's aware of.

 

[Olias of Sunhillow]

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It depends where you look. LCD2 is all bass and mids, and lacks any treble to speak of. In that sense the HD800 is much more neutral -- granted "more" being the key. It does have more treble than neutral but that can be fixed with a dark amp or EQ.

To my ears, this is a mischaracterization. If anything, the LCD-2.2 suffered from inconsistent treble that sometimes seemed rolled off and other times seemed peaky and excessive. To the HD800's credit, they are very consistent in the way they add an unnatural brightness to nearly everything.
 
Of course, this disagreement on the fundamental character of the HD800 and the LCD series has been voiced a thousand times on Head-Fi.
 

 

[olor1n]

nvm.

 

[John Willett]

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Well the HD800 doesn't even meet that ideal either.  Depending on your perspective it either has a mild mid bass hump or a mild bass roll off.  I'd call it rolled off and on the bass light side by a bit.
 
You can complain about the level of the treble and you could even be right, but the LCD-2/3 have almost perfectly flat bass extension and a better relative levels of bass and midrange.

I don't call -3dB at 14Hz lacking in bass.

 

[jax]

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I don't call -3dB at 14Hz lacking in bass.

What the graphs read, and how it actually occurs to you when you actually listen to it on a system with music do not always coincide in my experience.  6 months with HD800's and I would never think they had a substantial bass delivery.  In comparison with LCD-2's I would say from strictly my own listening experiences, that the HD800 does occur to me to be lacking in bass in the light of that comparison regardless what the graph says.  I have heard the HD800 bass described as being "more accurate".  Well, as far as headphones go, I don't know about "accurate".  Certainly they do not allow you to experience bass the way you might in a live performance given any and all visceral impact is absent.  Perhaps more accurate in the numbers, but then it will come down to what it always does - what does an individual prefer.