RME ADI-2 DAC Thread

[oqvist]

Interesting. I can relate a lot to the THX 789 vs my RME ADI-2 so they 887 is perhaps quite similar to the THX 789

 

[blockchainhero]

Cross-posting this here in case anyone is interested:

"For those who had been asking about RME ADI-2 DAC AMP portion vs THX 887, after some further blind testing + listening sessions + comparing:
The performance/difference between the two is easily identifiable.

• The RME has a tighter stage and more forward delivery. The 887 has a larger, wider, more expansive, stage that makes the amp feel more powerful. To summarize this thought; Powerful because the brain is hearing the same volume from a source that feels further away, which equates to a more powerful source creating the sound.
• The RME has more engaging mids. My biggest complaint about the 887 is the dull mids, I believe this to be a result of the bigger stage and the mids feeling further away. The mids of the 887 also possess less body than those from the RME AMP. This can be translated as the 887 is actually cleaner, or alternatively, it's drier in the mids.
• The RME has more prominent bass, while the 887 is more precise/tight. This again can make the 887 feel dry, now in the bass, because it is simply so clean. I don't think the bass performance of the RME is bad on its own measure, but the 887 is simply faster and cleaner.
• The 887 does separation and layering better than the RME, easily. The RME can feel congested at times while the 887 feels open, airy, and individual instruments are easier to pick out.
• The 887 emphasizes treble better than the RME, not by increased volume/brightness, but rather via air and speed.
• Both amps offer excellent detail and resolution, the RME pushing details a little more forward (think Focal Elex/Clear), with the 887 favoring dynamic range due to its larger stage and ability to properly place instruments/sounds further away from the listener (think ZMF Auteur, HD800s).

Overall the RME feels like the more engaging amp, and the 887 feels like the more technically capable.

All listening/testing was done with ZMF Verite Cocobolo + Verite lambskin pads."

I (personally) don’t believe there are audible differences between competent DACs but do nonetheless appreciate you writing up and presenting your impressions.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

Is that an apples and apples comparison? If I understand things the THX 887 is only an amp, and only takes analog in. The RME DAC has no analog in. I don't understand how you can narrow things down just to the amp portion since by necessity, anything you listen to on the RME is going through the DAC and on the THX 887 it's an analog signal that went through some other DAC. I guess you could loop the RME into the THX 887

 

[bryceu]

That is correct, the THX 887 is strictly an amp. The RME ADI-2 DAC is a DAC and an amp.

Perhaps it clears things up that I mention I am feeding the THX 887 with the RME DAC using the same settings via XLR outputs.

Assuming the only difference between the RME DAC + RME AMP vs the RME DAC + THX 887 AMP is the internal circuitry of the RME vs the external circuitry connecting the RME to the 887 (XLR cables);
The conclusion posted was for the purpose of comparing the performance of the THX 887 amp as an additional amp/feature, being fed from the RME, versus the performance of the RME ADI-2 as an AIO.

@oqvist I owned the 789 previously and found the same differences between the RME amp and the 789 amp, as I recently discovered with the RME amp vs the 887 amp. Unfortunately I don't have the 789 and 887 in hand to directly compare, and I don't even have the same headphones I compared them with at the time. I will say that the Verite open makes the differences between RME/887 more easily noticeable than did any previous headphones (Clear, Ether 2, Auteur, Andromeda) when I was using RME/789.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

That is correct, the THX 887 is strictly an amp. The RME ADI-2 DAC is a DAC and an amp.

Perhaps it clears things up that I mention I am feeding the THX 887 with the RME DAC using the same settings via XLR outputs.

Assuming the only difference between the RME DAC + RME AMP vs the RME DAC + THX 887 AMP is the internal circuitry of the RME vs the external circuitry connecting the RME to the 887 (XLR cables);
The conclusion posted was for the purpose of comparing the performance of the THX 887 amp as an additional amp/feature, being fed from the RME, versus the performance of the RME ADI-2 as an AIO.

@oqvist I owned the 789 previously and found the same differences between the RME amp and the 789 amp, as I recently discovered with the RME amp vs the 887 amp. Unfortunately I don't have the 789 and 887 in hand to directly compare, and I don't even have the same headphones I compared them with at the time. I will say that the Verite open makes the differences between RME/887 more easily noticeable than did any previous headphones (Clear, Ether 2, Auteur, Andromeda) when I was using RME/789.

Thanks for explaining, that sounds like a reasonable comparison.

 

[mixman]

Cross-posting this here in case anyone is interested:

"For those who had been asking about RME ADI-2 DAC AMP portion vs THX 887, after some further blind testing + listening sessions + comparing:
The performance/difference between the two is easily identifiable.

• The RME has a tighter stage and more forward delivery. The 887 has a larger, wider, more expansive, stage that makes the amp feel more powerful. To summarize this thought; Powerful because the brain is hearing the same volume from a source that feels further away, which equates to a more powerful source creating the sound.
• The RME has more engaging mids. My biggest complaint about the 887 is the dull mids, I believe this to be a result of the bigger stage and the mids feeling further away. The mids of the 887 also possess less body than those from the RME AMP. This can be translated as the 887 is actually cleaner, or alternatively, it's drier in the mids.
• The RME has more prominent bass, while the 887 is more precise/tight. This again can make the 887 feel dry, now in the bass, because it is simply so clean. I don't think the bass performance of the RME is bad on its own measure, but the 887 is simply faster and cleaner.
• The 887 does separation and layering better than the RME, easily. The RME can feel congested at times while the 887 feels open, airy, and individual instruments are easier to pick out.
• The 887 emphasizes treble better than the RME, not by increased volume/brightness, but rather via air and speed.
• Both amps offer excellent detail and resolution, the RME pushing details a little more forward (think Focal Elex/Clear), with the 887 favoring dynamic range due to its larger stage and ability to properly place instruments/sounds further away from the listener (think ZMF Auteur, HD800s).

Overall the RME feels like the more engaging amp, and the 887 feels like the more technically capable.

All listening/testing was done with ZMF Verite Cocobolo + Verite lambskin pads."

Dude, this exactly sums up my feelings of the differences between the RME and THX 789 amps. I generally prefer the THX since it is more airy and has a roomier feel. Also, I feel the THX is more dynamic too.

 

[bryceu]

Dude, this exactly sums up my feelings of the differences between the RME and THX 789 amps. I generally prefer the THX since it is more airy and has a roomier feel. Also, I feel the THX is more dynamic too.

Yea my memory of the RME vs 789 is exactly the same as RME vs 887.

Also this:

PCB shots are up, only change is opamp from the 789.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...dphone-amp-new-champ.8942/page-30#post-270229

No hiding they are basically the same amp.

 

[mixman]

Yea my memory of the RME vs 789 is exactly the same as RME vs 887.

Also this:



No hiding they are basically the same amp.

So what do you think now vs the MJ2? Any favorites?

 

[bryceu]

So what do you think now vs the MJ2? Any favorites?

Going back and forth between 887 and Mj2 I find it to be pretty even on a song to song basis, preferring the 887 only slightly more often.

However I'm quite strongly favoring the 887. It's most notably more linear, slightly wider, and cleaner details. The Mj2 does have slightly more depth, different (not better or worse) imaging, and even more dynamics than the 887.

The draw of the Mj2 to me is that it offers the tube rolling option which is a very big plus if you don't want the same exact tonal balance and sound characteristics forever.

I will also mention though, that the improvements feel more substantial going from the RME amp portion to the THX 887, than when going from the RME amp to the Mjolnir 2. Going from the RME amp to the Mj2 I notice improvements but also trade-offs (like the lack of linearity and dynamics that are so good sometimes detail is lost). Where as going from the RME amp to the 887 the only negative is that the mids are slightly less engaging on the 887.

At this point if I could keep just one amp I would probably go with the 887, but I will wait till the Verite Closed arrives to have an alternative lens to view the amps through before getting rid of all the tubes.

I think it's fair to say that I am leaning more towards SS characteristics in my search for the most optimal amp.

I do think I will build a BHC+SB whenever kits go on sale again or I find a deal on one, that amp just had an appeal to the emotions for me. Only reason I got rid of it was to build my own.

 

[butch111]

I hope someone can explain me , what I have to do when I want to connect 2 balanced Headphones hearing the same content (Movies) over my ADI2DAC - one 789 is coming , do I need 2 789? . And how to connect? THX

 

[bryceu]

You would need an amp with 2x balanced headphone outputs.

Or two amps with balanced headphone outputs, and an XLR splitter like this: https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/YXM121--hosa-yxm-121-y-cable-xlr3f-to-dual-xlr3m-6-inch (Never personally used one so might want to double check what the cable does to line voltage)

Or, you can toggle your RME to "Mute Line OFF" and have one balanced headphone plugged into the 789, and another directly into your RME ADI-2 Phones output via an adapter like this: https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=4768 (I use this type of cable frequently to convert my balanced headphone cables into 1/4")

 

[butch111]

You would need an amp with 2x balanced headphone outputs.

Or two amps with balanced headphone outputs, and an XLR splitter like this: https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/YXM121--hosa-yxm-121-y-cable-xlr3f-to-dual-xlr3m-6-inch (Never personally used one so might want to double check what the cable does to line voltage)

Or, you can toggle your RME to "Mute Line OFF" and have one balanced headphone plugged into the 789, and another directly into your RME ADI-2 Phones output via an adapter like this: https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=4768 (I use this type of cable frequently to convert my balanced headphone cables into 1/4")

Thank you very much for this perfect answer!!

 

[sysyphos]

Cross-posting this here in case anyone is interested:

"For those who had been asking about RME ADI-2 DAC AMP portion vs THX 887, after some further blind testing + listening sessions + comparing:
The performance/difference between the two is easily identifiable.

• The RME has a tighter stage and more forward delivery. The 887 has a larger, wider, more expansive, stage that makes the amp feel more powerful. To summarize this thought; Powerful because the brain is hearing the same volume from a source that feels further away, which equates to a more powerful source creating the sound.
• The RME has more engaging mids. My biggest complaint about the 887 is the dull mids, I believe this to be a result of the bigger stage and the mids feeling further away. The mids of the 887 also possess less body than those from the RME AMP. This can be translated as the 887 is actually cleaner, or alternatively, it's drier in the mids.
• The RME has more prominent bass, while the 887 is more precise/tight. This again can make the 887 feel dry, now in the bass, because it is simply so clean. I don't think the bass performance of the RME is bad on its own measure, but the 887 is simply faster and cleaner.
• The 887 does separation and layering better than the RME, easily. The RME can feel congested at times while the 887 feels open, airy, and individual instruments are easier to pick out.
• The 887 emphasizes treble better than the RME, not by increased volume/brightness, but rather via air and speed.
• Both amps offer excellent detail and resolution, the RME pushing details a little more forward (think Focal Elex/Clear), with the 887 favoring dynamic range due to its larger stage and ability to properly place instruments/sounds further away from the listener (think ZMF Auteur, HD800s).

Overall the RME feels like the more engaging amp, and the 887 feels like the more technically capable.

All listening/testing was done with ZMF Verite Cocobolo + Verite lambskin pads."

Thank you very much for your detailed comparison. I am also looking for an amp to pair with ADI-2 DAC-HD800S combo and one of the amps that I am considering is THX 887. Do you have any experience with RNHP or Vioelectric VA200? I will be very appreciated if I could learn your ideas and thoughts about suitability of these amps with this combo.

 

[bryceu]

Thank you very much for your detailed comparison. I am also looking for an amp to pair with ADI-2 DAC-HD800S combo and one of the amps that I am considering is THX 887. Do you have any experience with RNHP or Vioelectric VA200? I will be very appreciated if I could learn your ideas and thoughts about suitability of these amps with this combo.

I don’t have any experience with either of those amps I’m sorry. I will say though, if I were to guess the HD 800 S would be a bit on the overly analytical side with the THX887. It’s not a headphone I am familiar with from a personal ownership standpoint, but there’s plenty of information out there to assume that the pairing would not be very musical. Personally I would probably recommend either a ZDT Jr or bottle head crack with speedball to go with HD800s. But again I’ve never owned the 800s or heard those pairings, but I have owned both the ZDT Jr and the BHC+SB.

 

[oqvist]

I don´t mind my hd 800S at all on the THx 789 AAA. Use it as much as my Trafomatic Audio Head One. It just plays to it´s strength may be just as good focus on that. But Kennerton Magni is absolutely awesome straight out of the RME ADI-2. HD 800S plus Kennerton Magni and not a worry in the world it feels like now. RME ADI-2 seem to match Kennerton Magni particularly well. I tend to favour the THX 789 AAA but I am still confused regarding this one.