[kwekeugene]

Those who just ordered, you'll be in for a longer wait.

They are having the Chinese New Year celebrations till 15th February. No postal workers will be working during that period

 

[aural1ty]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penchum /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hi Alfred, When I got my first Zero, I did compare it to the headphone jack on my X-FI extreme music I/O drive. The X-FI is stock and so was the Zero. The difference was night and day. The X-FI was boomy and not detailed, with some noise I really hadn't noticed before. Once I went Optical out the Zero, wow! No noise, full spectrum, great sound stage, accurate bass, mids and highs. It really was SO different, I kept saying to myself, "why didn't I do this before?". So, I find it easy to say you are in for a treat when you get yours together.

I'm curious, could it be a sucky Creative headphone jack contributing? The ones on my Creative Decoder DDTS-100 are poor quality and huge hissing

This is what brings me to this great thread

Zero seems to be my ticket to a quality DAC with a proper headphone jack!

So, could the stereo line output on the X-Fi card be superior to the headphone jack on the I/O drive?

There's also the issue of 50 vs 300 Ohm

 

[pincellone]

Thanks Penchum. It would also be interesting to hear some other opinions on that.

After all, I believe this is the most straightforward test any Zero owner can perform.

For instance, the X-FI D/A converter is quite good as it is either the Cirrus Logic CS4392 (192 KHz, 114 dB) or the CS4398(192 KHz, 116 dB) depending on the model (more details here: ImageShack - Hosting :: xficomparisonchart3jh.jpg).

The Zero uses an AD1852. Here you can find some benchmarks with the CS4398:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f7/cs4...arison-213448/

I will of course give you all my thoughts as soon as I get my Zero. So far, I can only say that direct output from my Audigy 2 ZS (gold plated sockets) is excellent, and still better then what I can hear when I connect it to my amplifier through optical spdif (of course this might also depend on my amplifier and its internal DAC).

 

[Henmyr]

Just to get clarification:

To use the zero as pre-amp, I should connect my other amp via the "line out" on the back of the zero (rca-out) and the "phone" LED should not be lit right?

When used as pre-amp, only the dac op-amp matters right? The op-amps in the internal amp should not change the sound of the pre-amp?

If this is the case, is the Zero a "real" pre-amp? Isn't it just used as a dac that way?

EDIT: BTW, I'm now using the LT1057 in the dac, and LME49720 x2 in the amp, and with the dt880, the sound is very euphoric and carry a lot of emotion. My favorite for dt880 so far.

LT1364 in dac and LT1469 x2 in amp was also quite good, a bit more laid back and neutral maybe, but not as enjoyable to listen to.

EDIT2: My zero isn't completely breaked in yet, only got around 100h, so the final op-amp decision is still to come.

EDIT3: LT1057 + LME9720 x2 works very well for ms2i also.

 

[Penchum]

Quote:

Originally Posted by aural1ty /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm curious, could it be a sucky Creative headphone jack contributing? The ones on my Creative Decoder DDTS-100 are poor quality and huge hissing This is what brings me to this great thread Zero seems to be my ticket to a quality DAC with a proper headphone jack! So, could the stereo line output on the X-Fi card be superior to the headphone jack on the I/O drive? There's also the issue of 50 vs 300 Ohm

I always thought the I/O drive's headphone jack/amp was better than the line out on the card. However, when I got better headphones (HD-580s), it was more apparent to me that the signal had issues in both situations, most likely due to the common circuitry they both use. No matter how you look at it, dirty amping gets you dirty output.

I still recommend the I/O drive, for all it's other features. Having the Optical, Coaxial, analog and midi inputs and outputs handy on the front, is worth the extra coin IMHO. I still use the headphone jack on occasion, like when I want to listen to the audio from a small clip or video. It's handy and quick that way.

Many here believe the X-Fi stock has audio issues anyway. There are mods to fix much of it, but the mods don't help for gaming. The alternative to the mods, is to use the card as a transport for digital audio, out to a DAC/Amp like the Zero. Then, when ever you feel like gaming, just do it. You at least get the best of both worlds this way.

The Zero's ability as a DAC and headphone amp, is superior to anything the stock card can do. Several folks who had modded their card, ordered a Zero and reported their music was improved in almost every detail. The headphone amp in the Zero is independent and built on a separate board. It is powerful and you have the option of changing Opamps in it, to customize the sound to your taste. It will drive headphones rated from 32-600ohms with ease.

On top of all this, there is an upgrade path being started by getting a Zero. Later on, if you decide to purchase a separate headphone or speaker amplifier, just drive it from the Zero's DAC output. I do this with my Sonic Super-T amplifier and speakers, and love it. Lossless WAVS played this way are so nice!

This should give you something to think about.

The Zero's excellent price point opens up possibilities where none existed.

 

[Penchum]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pincellone /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks Penchum. It would also be interesting to hear some other opinions on that. After all, I believe this is the most straightforward test any Zero owner can perform. For instance, the X-FI D/A converter is quite good as it is either the Cirrus Logic CS4392 (192 KHz, 114 dB) or the CS4398(192 KHz, 116 dB) depending on the model (more details here: ImageShack - Hosting :: xficomparisonchart3jh.jpg). The Zero uses an AD1852. Here you can find some benchmarks with the CS4398: http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f7/cs4...arison-213448/ I will of course give you all my thoughts as soon as I get my Zero. So far, I can only say that direct output from my Audigy 2 ZS (gold plated sockets) is excellent, and still better then what I can hear when I connect it to my amplifier through optical spdif (of course this might also depend on my amplifier and its internal DAC).

Yes, very dependant on your amplifier and it's internal DAC. When you get your Zero and burn it in, I honestly believe you are in for a treat!!

 

[Penchum]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Henmyr /img/forum/go_quote.gif Just to get clarification: To use the zero as pre-amp, I should connect my other amp via the "line out" on the back of the zero (rca-out) and the "phone" LED should not be lit right? When used as pre-amp, only the dac op-amp matters right? The op-amps in the internal amp should not change the sound of the pre-amp? If this is the case, is the Zero a "real" pre-amp? Isn't it just used as a dac that way? EDIT: BTW, I'm now using the LT1057 in the dac, and LME49720 x2 in the amp, and with the dt880, the sound is very euphoric and carry a lot of emotion. My favorite for dt880 so far. LT1364 in dac and LT1469 x2 in amp was also quite good, a bit more laid back and neutral maybe, but not as enjoyable to listen to. EDIT2: My zero isn't completely breaked in yet, only got around 100h, so the final op-amp decision is still to come. EDIT3: LT1057 + LME9720 x2 works very well for ms2i also.

Looks like you have it figured out.

I think the use of the term pre-amp is odd, but applies if you had just a CD player, optical out to the Zero, then RCA out to an amp. Other than that, it is a DAC by any other name.

The headphone amp Opamps only effect the headphone output.
The mainboard Opamp has an effect on DAC output and headphone output.

I'm glad you are finding additional combinations! Some others where asking about the Zero and the DT880 working together, so this is a good thing!

 

[jona.p]

Quote:

You have one coming, don't you?

A zero? Naw.

Already have the DV336i. I find it hard to believe the zero amp beats it, allthough everyone perceives sound differently.

Maybe it's that davve just likes solidstate better, or that maybe the zero just has a better amp. Don't know.

I do know that Im happy with my darkvoice 336i :>.

 

[coredump]

Will the X-Fi do analog output at the same time this is connected to the optical?

 

[Henmyr]

Quote:

Originally Posted by coredump /img/forum/go_quote.gif Will the X-Fi do analog output at the same time this is connected to the optical?

Just checked. Yes it will.

 

[coredump]

Thanks.

I'm trying to decide between the Zero and something with USB like the KECES DA-151. I already have an MKIII so I just need a good DAC.

I just finished reading this thread from the beginning. It only took a couple of hours.

 

[Henmyr]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Allure /img/forum/go_quote.gif Can someone please describe the sound signature of the LT1057?

I'm doing a rather large op-amp test with the zero, but the preliminary on lt1057 is that it is a good sounding one for the dac for ms2i and dt880 and okey for dt990. I haven't tested it much in the amp, but the preliminary is that it does not work as well there.

In the dac, from some testing, I find it rather neutral and natural, not harsh at all if not the amp op-amp is harsh (found LT1361 rather sharp in the edges). It's midrange is rather pronounced and a bit more wet then dry, works very well with dt880 and ms2i. I find it to have good euphoric sound in the midrange also. It is not extremely airy, and rather thick with some op-amps like LT1469 and LME49720, but airy with LT1361 and average airy with LT1364 . This is just the preliminary though.

 

[Henmyr]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Allure /img/forum/go_quote.gif Great insight, thanks! I would have to try the LT1057 then - not in the Zero but in another DAC I'm awaiting, the "SUPER Pro DAC 707". Should also try it in a headphone amp I have. I really like thick sounding opamps with warm euphonic mids. BTW, which is softer sounding between the LT1364 and LT1361 to your ears?

I have only tried them both in the amp while using LT1057 in the dac, and while doing this the LT1364 is softer than LT1361.

I do not think that LT1057 is the best to use for a stand alone dac if the amp is not very clear. I want to have the zero with headphone out to sound as good as possible with my headphones, so I'm not trying to find the absolute best dac op-amp, but instead the best combination of dac+amp op-amps, and that is where LT1057 fits. I do not think it's the best to use as a stand alone dac.

It is not the best when it comes to the hights and bass, but rather mellow sounding but with a nice sounding midrange, thats why it fits well with ms2 and dt880. I would probably not use it with sennheiser headphones.

 

[Henmyr]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Allure /img/forum/go_quote.gif And Sennheisers are what I have. Ok, I might leave the stock LT1364 in. But anyway I want to try the LT1057 somewhere because I love a nice midrange.

Oh:

"It is not the best when it comes to the hights and bass, but rather mellow sounding but with a nice sounding midrange, thats why it fits well with ms2 and dt880. I would probably not use it with sennheiser headphones."

..was directed at the LT1057, but do try it as it might very well work anyway. LT1364 will probably, as Penchum already tested, sound very good with Sennheisers.

 

[Kake]

Anyone tested the DY2000 metal in the amp section?

I have a pair but thy have separated from their socket, and therefor I'm not sure if it's worth the risk (for a n00b like me) to assemble them in the amp since there are a chance that i fu## it up.

Although if some one has test them with an "great" result it might actually be worth the risk...