[haloxt]

Just my opinion, but the reference one with dsp-1 v5 should have a more "serious" sound than dac19df. When matched to an equally neutral and detailed balanced amp, it won't add musicality like the dac19 does, but it does resolve more detail, mostly microdetail and ambience.

 

[quicksound]

Are you recommending staying with the dac19 DF? Also, my Sonett is single ended - regardless, I still would notice large improvements in detail and soundstage with the reference one, right? 

 

[haloxt]

If you only use the ref 1 single-ended, you will probably notice some improvement, primarily due to the dsp-1, and a little due to better psu, but using it fully balanced would make the biggest difference. If you intend to stay single-ended, it makes a lot more sense to just stay with the dac19, because balanced requires double of some circuitry, and that's the main reason the ref 1 costs over twice as much as the dac19. If you really want more faithfulness to recording, which isn't automatically more pleasant to listen to as you'd know if you got a lot of experience with live performance, then you would prefer ref 1. But in that case I would also suggest later upgrading amp, headphones, transport, cables (I like premium monoprice cables ), and this can get expensive!
 
Kingwa used to ask people who emailed about buying a ref 1 if it really was what they wanted, because it doesn't pair well with all gear, and when paired properly may not be what people are looking for sound-signature-wise. I think its got very nice technical ability, but still think their mid-tier is the sweet spot for most audiophiles, especially with their constant budget upgrades like using SMD.

 

[FauDrei]

I currently own an Audio-gd DAC19 DF and will soon be upgrading to the Audio-gd Reference One - from what I can tell, it sounds like I should bite the bullet and buy a Audiophilleo 2 on top of it, would you all agree? Initially I was going to get the m2tech, then the Audio-gd DI, and now I'm beginning to convince myself that the Audiophilleo 2 is worth it based on everyone's reviews. 

If you can afford it - get audiophilleo2. Although I think it is somewhat overpriced, it IMO audibly betters DI and hiFace.
 
As for RE-1... It seems you fancy the 1704 sound and you will like additional detail, ambiance and microdynamics... but as haloxt put it in his words, if the rest of your chain does not follow - you might be underwhelmed with the magnitude of the change. Not to scare you of - you will still DBT RE-1 from DacMagics, Benchmarks and the likes in almost any chain, you just will not approach the limits of this machine... and scaling up in direction of those limits gets rather expensive.

 

[quicksound]

Thanks for the advice guys. But for only an additional $400, wouldn't it be worth it to upgrade from the DAC19 DF to the Reference One? That way I'll be set if I plan to go fully balanced in the future. Plus I'm sure I'll notice some improvement in detail and soundstage. 

In regards to going fully balanced, simply swapping my Sonett for a Sonett with a balanced output wouldn't utilize the Reference One any better because the amp would still be single ended, right? 

I noticed Donald North says on his DNA Audio website:

"I am frequently asked why the balanced output version does not include balanced inputs. This is because balanced inputs are not necessary to provide balanced headphone drive. Being a single ended amplifier, all it needs for input is a single ended (unbalanced) signal. The Sonett operates single ended triode with transformer loading the plate of the 6H30 amplification tube. The secondary windings on the output transformers are center tapped (and grounded for safety), thereby providing a true, differential, balanced output. Thus, you get balanced drive without the complexity from additional balanced input circuitry or input transformers. Again, the simpler - the better."
 
I guess you guys would disagree with his last line - you would say that simpler is not better, but rather fully balanced inputs are better. 
 
So you highly recommend going fully balanced? What fully balanced tube amps would give my DNA Sonett a run for its money? 

 

[quicksound]

I'll preface this by saying I realize that individual opinions vary greatly, and that when users modify their own equipment they might develop a natural tendency to prefer their modified equipment over other equipment.
 
That being said, I noticed that fellow head-fier budx3385 uses a balanced Meridian 808.2i source, yet he still prefers his modded Sonett over his WES maxxed-out and Rudistor RP010B (both of which are amps with balanced inputs). If going fully balanced makes as big of a difference as many have indicated, wouldn't budx3385's amps with balanced inputs (easily) outperform the Sonett with a single ended input?  
 
I'm bringing this up because I'm curious if swapping my Sonett with a Sonett with balanced outputs would be essentially as good as going fully balanced. 
 
Thanks for your help! I'm relatively new here and I appreciate all your feedback. 

 

[Currawong]

The Ref 1 was designed to be used with the balanced outputs. It works fine from the SE outputs, but, very slightly, doesn't perform as well.

 

[FauDrei]

Well, I'll put it this way...
 
RE-1 through X-Can V2 is really nice - musical, detailed and "creamy" (X-Can V2 SE inputs; SE TRS output).
 
Through Roc SE inputs and SE output RE-1 is more detailed, clear and dynamic. You begin to understand here what "blacker background" stands for.
 
Througt Roc SE inputs and differential (balanced, 4-pin XLR) output (Roc in its input stage "creates inverted copy" of SE RCA input and always amplifies and outputs fully differential 4 channel signal) you experience additional separation, details, dynamics and yet "blacker" background.
 
Hook RE-1 with XLR cables to Roc XLR inputs and you gain some more micro details and micro dynamics. That "micro thingies" were the real discovery for me and could properly enjoy them only after I got my first orthodynamic headphone (HE-5).
 
Oh, and there is also ACSS differential connection between A-GD DACs and amps... Before DSP-1 V5 and "overhaul" of my RE-1, ACSS removed a subtle "whiteness layer" from music... there was slightly clearer music "ambiance" and "presence". Now, I'm not so sure... Now I can hardly distinguish XLR from ACSS (but keep using ACSS because of the "peace of mind" of less conversion stages music signal goes through).
 
There. Those are my findings. Hope they help.

 

[bobxxxbob]

Don't know if you have noticed but Audio GD is selling DAC19-DSP again. If you want a great  dac in the price range I suggest you act fast.

 

[TRiN]

Quote:

Don't know if you have noticed but Audio GD is selling DAC19-DSP again. If you want a great  dac in the price range I suggest you act fast.

How does the DAC19-DSP compare with other current offerings nowadays? Does it still hold it's own?

 

[Mad Max]

Looks like the NFB2 is using the same output stage and power supply as DAC19.

 

[krumme]

The dac19 have 4 class A power supply, and 4 liniar for the digital parts. The nfb2 have 6 class A and one liniar if i remember corectly...

 

[aspenx]

I read half the thread trying to find out about the C2.2 (or C2) that I might want to upgrade to.

I have a NFB2 (which is a somewhat updated version of the DAC19?) and would like to get it hooked up to a C2.2 via ACSS instead of RCA to the BCL clone that I'm using now.
 
Any comments on what I should be expecting? It seems that the C2.2 is the only amp from A-Gd that I can consider. Is this correct? I'm looking for a non-balanced dedicated headphones desktop amp for my Audio-Technica headphones.

 

 

[Tom W]

Quote:

It seems that the C2.2 is the only amp from A-Gd that I can consider. Is this correct? I'm looking for a non-balanced dedicated headphones desktop amp for my Audio-Technica headphones.

 

 
You are correct...the C2.2 is the only Single Ended (non-balanced) headphone amp that Audio-GD is currently making.
 
I can't comment on the BCL clone as I have not heard one.
 
I have the C-2.1 and it can make the Senn HD-650's sing.
 
If you order one make sure you tell Audio-GD which ACSS connectors are on your DAC so you get the correct cable. (The ACSS connectors changed about a year ago)
 
I thought I saw a C-2x in the FS forum listed with a DAC recently....not mine and I don't know the seller.

 

[petemac110]

 
Quote:

How does the DAC19-DSP compare with other current offerings nowadays? Does it still hold it's own?

Good question that! I've recently bought a new DAC19DSP and will have clocked up 300 hours on it by the end of the weekend, so it's just about ready for some serious listening. I've already got a NFB3 and an Emotiva XDA-1. Initial impressions prior to burn-in were that the DAC19 was more detailed/resolving and slightly less coloured than the NFB3. It will be interesting to see whether the burn-in period has changed anything.
 
A friend has a NFB2.1 and a Schiit Bifrost. I think a big listening session involving all of these DACs is in order!