[jasonb]

better? maybe, thats up to personal preference.
 
different? very much so.
 
the frequency response and color of the HD65o will be more similar to the denon than the grado's.
 

 
i would love to try a pair of grados, but i'm already pretty sure it wouldn't be my cup of tea.
 
Quote:

Are the 650's really that much better than Grado's?
 
I dont really have much of a point of reference since they are pretty much all I've ever listened to. I got the SR60's and thought they were great. Upgraded to a pair of SR225's and thought they were an improvement over the SR60. Tried some Denon d2000's and preferred the Grado's, so I bought a pair of MS2's. Now I have apair of HF2's that I wasnt totsally enamoured with when I first got them but have since determined that they sound much better burned in (actually the sound great). Not really looking to replace them but pssibly looking for a pair to complement them. The Fostex T50RP has been the leading contender and might be the eventual purchase. Although I'm not sure I really want a tinker toy. Just curious what the 650 brings to the table that makes it preferrable to some versus the Grado's.

 

[Raddler]

Quote:

i have never personally heard the 600's, but the 600's are known to be brighter and more extended up top and are also known to have less bass quantity and less bass punch. the added top end sounds like it may be nice, but i wouldn't want to sacrifice bass to do so. but thats just me.
 
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@ jasonb, are you saying that the 600's are brighter?? How's the bass compared to the 650's?? That's kinda hopefull, because i can get them for a great price.Muffled, kinda like not up front in your face, but again that's probably something i'm not used to. I run the headphones out of an apogee duet. They have 100 hours on them, i bought them used.

Interesting, thanx anyways.No i don't want to give up the bass either!! Gonna take some time with the 650's and see how it goes. I don't thimk i've given them a chance.

 

[Raddler]

Quote:

better? maybe, thats up to personal preference.
 
different? very much so.
 
the frequency response and color of the HD65o will be more similar to the denon than the grado's.
 

 
i would love to try a pair of grados, but i'm already pretty sure it wouldn't be my cup of tea.
 
Quote:

Are the 650's really that much better than Grado's?
 
I dont really have much of a point of reference since they are pretty much all I've ever listened to. I got the SR60's and thought they were great. Upgraded to a pair of SR225's and thought they were an improvement over the SR60. Tried some Denon d2000's and preferred the Grado's, so I bought a pair of MS2's. Now I have apair of HF2's that I wasnt totsally enamoured with when I first got them but have since determined that they sound much better burned in (actually the sound great). Not really looking to replace them but pssibly looking for a pair to complement them. The Fostex T50RP has been the leading contender and might be the eventual purchase. Although I'm not sure I really want a tinker toy. Just curious what the 650 brings to the table that makes it preferrable to some versus the Grado's.

Would i be right in saying that based upon that graph that the grado 325's have much less bass than the 650's??

 

[Yuceka]

I have a pair of SR225i and I use them whenever I listen to fast pace rock/metal. HD650 and SR225 are completely different phones. I wouldn't call one better than the other. They are good with different musics and purposes. That's why I keep them both to use with different types of music. One thing to add though, occasionally I can listen to rock with Senns but I have never liked listening to classical music with my Grados. Sometimes you just miss having a wider soundstage that Grados fail to give and Senns are good at! 

 

[jasonb]

according to the graph alone yes, but i have read that the graph is misleading, maybe even wrong. once again i have not heard a pair of grados, so i cant say for sure. if you can audition a pair of HD650's then i'd say go for it. you might be surprised, or you may hate them since they seem to be quite different from what you're used to.
 
Quote:

Would i be right in saying that based upon that graph that the grado 325's have much less bass than the 650's??

 

[jasonb]

can you compare bass quantity for us? does headrooms graph look right or is it misleading in terms of bass?
 
Quote:

I have a pair of SR225i and I use them whenever I listen to fast pace rock/metal. HD650 and SR225 are completely different phones. I wouldn't call one better than the other. They are good with different musics and purposes. That's why I keep them both to use with different types of music. One thing to add though, occasionally I can listen to rock with Senns but I have never liked listening to classical music with my Grados. Sometimes you just miss having a wider soundstage that Grados fail to give and Senns are good at! 

 

[Raddler]

Quote:

I have a pair of SR225i and I use them whenever I listen to fast pace rock/metal. HD650 and SR225 are completely different phones. I wouldn't call one better than the other. They are good with different musics and purposes. That's why I keep them both to use with different types of music. One thing to add though, occasionally I can listen to rock with Senns but I have never liked listening to classical music with my Grados. Sometimes you just miss having a wider soundstage that Grados fail to give and Senns are good at! 

Could you describe to me how the grado 225 and senn 650's differ in bass? Amount, depth, detail....etc

 

[NapalmK]

Quote:

Would i be right in saying that based upon that graph that the grado 325's have much less bass than the 650's??

Probably not. FR graphs are hard to read and can't tell you exactly how a headphone sounds. For instance.

 
From my experience the HD280 which appears to have pretty powerful bass is anything but in fact bass-light would be the best description while the DT990 has a lot of bass. However, the RS1 is also far from bassless and has a fairly healthy amount of bass. Sorry probably not the the best example but it's the best I could do before bed.

 

[Yuceka]

I wish I could just pretend to know how to read that graph but I am not going to From my experience I think both SR225 and HD650 have different kinds of bass qualities. SR225 (after a good burn-in) have a really sweet, punchy and a controlled bass but it's not really deep and plus you're so taken in with the sweet midrange that unless you are a basshead, you don't mind their bass quantity or quality at all. HD650 ... hmmm I don't find them quite bassy like some Audio Technicas or DT770 that I owned in the past that just give tickle your eardrums with their bass. I think HD650's bass is more controlled and balanced and not muffled. Again this has to do with what kind of music you prefer. I listen to Progressive Metal, guitar virtuosos, classical and fusion jazz and they are not all that bass based music genres. So to answer your question, yes HD650 has more bass but SR225's midrange is better than HD650. Sometimes the brightness of Grados can be really fatiguing for me and that's one thing I've never had with my Senns. I can listen to HD650s for hours but I need to take a good break when I listen to Grados. In the end I am happy with both and I see them as complementing each other, not better or worse. 
 
I agree with OP's excitement about HD650s though. Some people may call them mid-fi or overrated but for that price... they are just awesome! 

 

[Raddler]

Quote:

I wish I could just pretend to know how to read that graph but I am not going to From my experience I think both SR225 and HD650 have different kinds of bass qualities. SR225 (after a good burn-in) have a really sweet, punchy and a controlled bass but it's not really deep and plus you're so taken in with the sweet midrange that unless you are a basshead, you don't mind their bass quantity or quality at all. HD650 ... hmmm I don't find them quite bassy like some Audio Technicas or DT770 that I owned in the past that just give tickle your eardrums with their bass. I think HD650's bass is more controlled and balanced and not muffled. Again this has to do with what kind of music you prefer. I listen to Progressive Metal, guitar virtuosos, classical and fusion jazz and they are not all that bass based music genres. So to answer your question, yes HD650 has more bass but SR225's midrange is better than HD650. Sometimes the brightness of Grados can be really fatiguing for me and that's one thing I've never had with my Senns. I can listen to HD650s for hours but I need to take a good break when I listen to Grados. In the end I am happy with both and I see them as complementing each other, not better or worse. 
 
I agree with OP's excitement about HD650s though. Some people may call them mid-fi or overrated but for that price... they are just awesome! 

Very detailed answer, thanx alot. I think i'm gonna go demo them tmrw.

 

[jasonb]

so it's safe to say that Grado's would suck for electronic music with deep bass? they are punchy and have good mid-bass, but the bottom end isn't really there?

 

[Yuceka]

Quote:

so it's safe to say that Grado's would suck for electronic music with deep bass? they are punchy and have good mid-bass, but the bottom end isn't really there?

I would assume so but I can't speak for PS-1000 or GS1000i. There may be others who have tried other Grados that can give you a more detailed answer than me on electronic music. 

 

[dayamax]

I bought my HD 650s about 20 days ago and was running them straight from my laptop headphone out, and they still sounded better than my HD555s. 
Today I got the Schiit Valhalla, and it was a huge step up in SQ. I can now better understand just how much better the 650 is than the 555. I'm all set for the next few years (equipment wise). I'm going to spend more money on music now.
 
Overall my new setup (Laptop - Musiland Monitor US 01 - Schiit Valhalla - HD 650) is a big upgrade from Laptop - HD 555.

 

[Chimera-se]

To the OP: congrats! you have a great set of cans, there.  I've read through this thread and am a little disturbed by some of the responses...I know better than anyone about "upgrade-itus" but c'mon, let him enjoy his new cans!! Sheesh! I'm listening to my HD 600's now, and although I own some T1's and D7000's, the Senn's will have a secure place in my line-up because they do so much, SO well.  So, enjoy and thanks for telling us of your epiphany! That's what it's all about, right? 

 
Quote:

 I'm all set for the next few years (equipment wise). 

Yikes, I wish I could say that! LOL!

 

[jasonb]

Nice. nice to see you're enjoying them. i've had mine about a month now and i am still excited to come home from work everyday just to put my HD650's on and enjoy some tunes.
 
Quote:

I bought my HD 650s about 20 days ago and was running them straight from my laptop headphone out, and they still sounded better than my HD555s. 
Today I got the Schiit Valhalla, and it was a huge step up in SQ. I can now better understand just how much better the 650 is than the 555. I'm all set for the next few years (equipment wise). I'm going to spend more money on music now.
 
Overall my new setup (Laptop - Musiland Monitor US 01 - Schiit Valhalla - HD 650) is a big upgrade from Laptop - HD 555.