[TWerk]

Yea, I'm also interested to hear what suddenly changed. A few days ago, you said you liked them for electronic music.

 

[CoiL]

  Low-end sounds like it wants to become a sub-woofer when it grows up. There is this sort of pinch lacking in the upper-mids... no crunch... sometimes it sounded like a low-q lowpass filter at 8khz was applied. I felt like an 80 year old basshead. Got bored of my music fast.

That`s weird description of X1 bass. Never even considered X1 as subwoofer-like bassy cans. I guess it is about Your more analytical/neutral sound taste and maybe also mismatch with Your CS4398 DAC and headphone amp? And also that fit problem may cause sound issues. How long have You been burning-in your cans and did you try other cable than stock?
*Edit: Yes I read back and You did try another cable and it improved sound. But it`s been only 8 days since You got those cans. Let them burn-in for longer.*
For me, at the beginning they also sounded littlebit "muffled" and lacked in bass tightness & kick. After cable change and amping with at least 150-200h playtime, it "opened" up properly. Now bass&kick is tight. Also soundstage, separation and transparency much better. Totally in love with that sound they provide. The soundstage depth towards front-middle is just amazing. 
Yes, they are warmish sounding cans with only little emphasis on bass but FAR away from sub-woofer like basshead cans.
These cans are more meant for enjoying music while still being able to easily listen all the detail if wanted.
To make them sound better, they need exactly what Mike said in his headfonia review about them:

The 1840 is still more refined, and the mids and highs are smoother, but I find that a good tube amp can help the X1 in those departments. 

This headphone has a good speed and attack by default, so I won’t be needing a solid state. What it needs, however is a little smoother treble and a little boost in the mids body. The ALO Pan Am is the best pairing I’ve heard with the X1 especially with the smooth Siemens tube upgrade.

And I agree with that... based on Aune T1 + Siemens E88CC and iBasso DX50. Both smoothen littlebit X1 treble and boost up mids section. Also bass is brought down tad, making them little more neutral. Result is very very enjoyable, at least for me

 

[TWerk]

CoiL, I agree with your description above. Just a great musical, relaxing warmish listen that really open up with some hours on them and a cable switch. 
 
Also, I've said this before, but they are probably the most comfortable headphone I've ever owned. So, I find a lack of comfort to be surprising.
 
If you want to feel lacking comfort, try a Grado, then you might change your mind.

 

[NinjaQuick]

  Let it go, folks. The discussion ended with Benbenkr stopped. This thread isn't about arguing if Dolby Headphone is any good or not.

Exactly. I said my bits. Children are free to take what I said an twist it in whatever way they want, or apply prejudices to it. Not an issue to me. Their immaturity and continued ignorance is their problem.
 

   
"audiophile" and "wanker" sometimes go hand in hand though, it would seem...
 
why are you even in this thread? by your logic, any bass-emphasised headphone (such as the X1) is a "bad product".
 
i'll enjoy my "bad product", while you enjoy what is "appropriate"...

I own the X1, which is why I am in this thread.
 
Nice try with Monty Python logic, there. I chose the X1 because I bought them for 125 dollars (my budget for headphones is 125 per year, and I had already bought stuff last year, depleting that fund). They are more colored than, say, AKG 702s, which would have cost me 235 at the time, but I opted for the X1 on the merits of I can tune the sound to be flat if need be, since they X1s are actually extremely clear headphones (internal resonance).
 
There is a chasm of definitions between "this software effect is the polar opposite of accurate in what it sets out to do" from "this hardware neatly produces the sound I hope for and want". This thread taught me that there are people that appear to actively look for not only what sound good to them, but also look for solutions that take sound, make it terrible, and then pipe it through their headphones, rendering in subjective clarity, all the garbled noise their source is putting out.
 
 

  Razer Surround clearer?
 
H.A.H.A.H.A.H.A.H.A [hahahahaha]
interjection
 
The spleen bursting response from a person who is especially interested in high-fidelity sound reproduction, but thinks your argument is complete bollocks. Music is another matter of course, obviously.
 
 
****s aside.... we ALL know here that binaural sound will, by it's very nature, degrade sound quality; but we're perfectly willing to trade off that edge for sound positioning and ambience in our games and movies. 'Nuff said.
 
Razer Surround... lol.

How is "[DH and RS] are clearer and truer to the source [than DH]." in any way indicative of:
 
1. Actual recommendation.
2. Implicitly or Explicitly indicative of degrees of proximity, or faithfulness, to the source sound.
 
Because, quite frankly, I'm not seeing it.
 
The scale is (an imaginary list of 2500 Binarual/Expanded Stereo/HRTF solutions):
 
1. Actual Binaural recordings or full sound processing with no shortcuts taken.
<...>
75. CMSS-3D - EAX 5.0
<...>
182. CMSS-3D with 7.1/5.1 Virtual Headphone channels.
<...>
653. Razer Surround
<...>
2034. Dolby Headphone
<...>
2500. A series of tubes, running through a sewer, up the anus of an elephant, and then through the brass section of the boston taps.
 
Note: That is just an example of how what I said can be implicitly or implicitly understood. The numbers, degrees of separation and everything are made up. If you in earnest believe DH is within 10 points of a real stereo/binaural field, then obviously the whole range will be compressed, but in that eventuality I recommend you get your ears checked.

 

[caprimulgus]

Originally Posted by NinjaQuick /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
This thread taught me that there are people that appear to actively look for not only what sound good to them, but also look for solutions that take sound, make it terrible, and then pipe it through their headphones, rendering in subjective clarity, all the garbled noise their source is putting out.
 

 
look, the problem is, you are judging a product against YOUR needs/preferences (as an audiophile snob - which you clearly are). i actually probably agree with your factual findings on DH (just the same as one of the other posters has already said). but what you clearly fail to appreciate is that other people have different needs in a product - different preferences, different trade-offs they are willing to accept. it doesn't suit YOUR needs or fit in with YOUR views of what a product should be, so it's a "bad product"...according to you.
 
 
THAT is immaturity my friend.
 
there is a reason why pretty much every person in this thread that has responded (whether they agree with you that DH is not the best solution for them or not), thinks you are being a snob/wanker.

but hey, if you want to call me a child, you go for it champ!
 
i'll leave it at that.
 
[/end further contribution to this discussion]
 
 
now, can we please go back to discussing the X1...if you want to discuss the merits of surround/positional technologies, please find an appropriate thread.

 

[DrikTheTroll]

  CoiL, I agree with your description above. Just a great musical, relaxing warmish listen that really open up with some hours on them and a cable switch. 
 
Also, I've said this before, but they are probably the most comfortable headphone I've ever owned. So, I find a lack of comfort to be surprising.
 
If you want to feel lacking comfort, try a Grado, then you might change your mind.

 
I tried a pair of Grados at the Washington DC Canmania for the 1st time recently  - I don't know where they are built, but wherever it is foam must sell for the price of gold given how stingy they are with it.
 
X1s get 90% of my head time - wonderful extremely comfortable headphones.

 

[caprimulgus]

   
I tried a pair of Grados at the Washington DC Canmania for the 1st time recently  - I don't know where they are built, but wherever it is foam must sell for the price of gold given how stingy they are with it.
 
X1s get 90% of my head time - wonderful extremely comfortable headphones.

^ aha, very accurate!
 
 
i own a number of headphones known for their comfort, and the X1 are definitely the ones i find the most comfortable! Having said that, I've read enough people saying they experienced comfort issues with the X1 that i accept that it must not suit / be comfortable for some people...different shaped/sized heads maybe?
 
i was actually scared about the comfort before i opened the box, from what i had read...but that was immediately resolved the moment i put them on for the first time!

 

[NinjaQuick]

   
look, the problem is, you are judging a product against YOUR needs/preferences (as an audiophile snob - which you clearly are). i actually probably agree with your factual findings on DH (just the same as one of the other posters has already said). but what you clearly fail to appreciate is that other people have different needs in a product - different preferences, different trade-offs they are willing to accept. it doesn't suit YOUR needs or fit in with YOUR views of what a product should be, so it's a "bad product"...according to you.
 
 
THAT is immaturity my friend.
 
there is a reason why pretty much every person in this thread that has responded (whether they agree with you that DH is not the best solution for them or not), thinks you are being a snob/wanker.

but hey, if you want to call me a child, you go for it champ!
 
i'll leave it at that.
 
[/end further contribution to this discussion]
 
 
now, can we please go back to discussing the X1...if you want to discuss the merits of surround/positional technologies, please find an appropriate thread.

Well, I have clearly stated my views are based on data/measurements. If other people prefer some other form of taste, that is up to them. If they disagree, then they should disagree in a form that adds to the discussion rather than reducing the conversation to insult driven rhetoric. 
 
As I said, there seem to be people who prefer bad sound. That is something I do not understand. Not as a snob or a wanker, but as a person who would rather not use anything over using something that isn't good. That is just how I choose to operate.
 
From where I am sitting, the use of "don't derail the thread", in this situation, is nothing more than a weak minded cop-out of responsibility for what has been said. I am sure there is proof on the internet that there are people who in earnest enjoy eating scat. That is their prerogative. My interest in Head-Fi, however, is to make recommendations, and receive insight and feedback based on broad experience and experimentation, in the area of listening.
 
Hence my opting to, when the discussion entered into a topic where I have considerable experience, share knowledge. I do not filter or strive for any form of political correctness or dilution of what I find to be facts. Arguing that, by its merits and design, Dolby Headphone is the better design, beyond subjective reasoning and personal taste, is sophomoric at best. The same can be said about arguing the merits of staying on subject in the thread. Yes, this is the X1 thread, but the conversation went in a specific direction, and the entire purpose of language is to communicate ideas, and respond the the context and situation.
 
I realize this is a dead horse to yourself and the other poets this thread seems to attract, but I feel that this must be said.
 
I am not an audiophile snob, not by any stretch of the imagination. As I said earlier in this post. I would rather not listen, than to listen poorly. This does not mean that anyone listening poorly is inferior. I understand there are people that like how Beats sound, or that there are people who cannot afford the luxury of good source and cans. However, my stance on all things pertinent to recommendations, reviews, insight, etc. is inflexibly data driven. The ideal for audio sources is to be 1:1. That is a fact. 1:1 is the designer output. This means that if a game has, for example, integrated Dolby Headphone for their HRTF 3D Stereo sound, then that is their 1:1 design. The sound engineers will have tuned all their environmental effects to suit the limitations of their platform.
 
If you paid attention you would have seen a list that I made. The best solution is a true Binaural Rendering solution (with a handful of head models to best fit the listener), which is something that would require dedicated hardware ASIC to do. The list is in order of what most closely approximates that absolute. That is the frame of reference.
 
I too, have said everything I can on the subject. Keep it civil.

 

[CoiL]

Can somebody please clean up this thread? 

 

[rwpritchett]

I swear, if one more post comes up about DH, etc... I'm unsubscribing to this thread. Let it go people.

 

[benbenkr]

Calling people "kids" is not a snob. Yeah, ooh mr.ancestor that we must all obey. 

 

[MarcelE]

Enjoying my X1 every day.
Did not had a lot of time to play them last week but this week it's been on my head almost non-stop.
I'll be getting a new cable in a few days. It will probably be on my head non-stop then too.

 

[ImperiumDX]

Is there anyone who can shine a conclusive light on the X1 vs X2?
In the Netherlands the X1 available for 189 and X2 for 299 EUR.

 

[Funambulistic]

  Is there anyone who can shine a conclusive light on the X1 vs X2?
In the Netherlands the X1 available for 189 and X2 for 299 EUR.

It appears one person has purchased the X2 over on the X2 thread and has shared some impressions: http://www.head-fi.org/t/723025/philips-fidelio-x2 

 

[CoiL]

  Is there anyone who can shine a conclusive light on the X1 vs X2?
In the Netherlands the X1 available for 189 and X2 for 299 EUR.

I think if You are not dead-neutral/flat lover and respect littlebit bass emphasised warmish sound with neutral mids and good highs, then for 189€ I would go with X1.
Here is some early impressions from X2 thread: http://www.head-fi.org/t/723025/philips-fidelio-x2/135#post_10750761
 
Personally, I find X1 looks also better.