[x RELIC x]

BobFiggins, I received my DAC-19 this summer and since listening to it I wanted to try its bigger brothers... The Master 11 and Master 7. The DAC-19 is very good but I want even more of it. I've been going back and forth in my mind about getting an all in one or just grabbing the Master 7. Always there has been the little nagging voice also wondering about the Yggy. Well, at least you've helped me with that little nagging voice. Good impressions, thanks!

 

[BobFiggins]

@BobFiggins, I received my DAC-19 this summer and since listening to it I wanted to try its bigger brothers... The Master 11 and Master 7. The DAC-19 is very good but I want even more of it. I've been going back and forth in my mind about getting an all in one or just grabbing the Master 7. Always there has been the little nagging voice also wondering about the Yggy. Well, at least you've helped me with that little nagging voice. Good impressions, thanks!

 
Thanks! Yeah I'm still really upset at my ears for not being able to experience what others find so great about the Yggy. I know that when I first started listening with the HD800 it was very sharp. After months of listening it has toned down for me, which must be my ears getting used to it. Most other people have 10+ years of ears being blasted by music, so all the sharpness I experience is probably heard as just detail for them.
 
I think for those that would consider the Yggy a beautiful sound, perhaps they also think the M11/DAC19 is too warm?
 
Also Relic, I was also thinking about DAC19 + Liquid Carbon. How is that pairing? I've never heard the LC before, but it sounds like something I'd like to try.
 
Would love to look up the M7, but work internet prevents it. Have to wait till I get home, blah.

 

[x RELIC x]

Thanks! Yeah I'm still really upset at my ears for not being able to experience what others find so great about the Yggy. I know that when I first started listening with the HD800 it was very sharp. After months of listening it has toned down for me, which must be my ears getting used to it. Most other people have 10+ years of ears being blasted by music, so all the sharpness I experience is probably heard as just detail for them.

I think for those that would consider the Yggy a beautiful sound, perhaps they also think the M11/DAC19 is too warm?

Also Relic, I was also thinking about DAC19 + Liquid Carbon. How is that pairing? I've never heard the LC before, but it sounds like something I'd like to try.

I don't get the whole too warm thing with the AGD PCM1704 implementations. I have an Oppo HA-1 (which many have called the DAC section overly bright) and compared with the DAC-19 (stock configuration) listening through the HA-1 balanced headphone out they don't sound vastly different on a macro tonality scale. They do sound vastly different on a detail and timbre scale. The DAC-19 sounds like real instruments and the HA-1 has 'digititus'.

With regard to the Liquid Carbon I'm patiently waiting for a shipping notice so I can't quite comment yet. Stillhart feels it's a great pairing and his comments are one of the reasons I picked up the DAC-19 to go with the LC in the first place.

 

[Currawong]

  Thanks! Yeah I'm still really upset at my ears for not being able to experience what others find so great about the Yggy. I know that when I first started listening with the HD800 it was very sharp. After months of listening it has toned down for me, which must be my ears getting used to it. Most other people have 10+ years of ears being blasted by music, so all the sharpness I experience is probably heard as just detail for them.
 
I think for those that would consider the Yggy a beautiful sound, perhaps they also think the M11/DAC19 is too warm?
 
Also Relic, I was also thinking about DAC19 + Liquid Carbon. How is that pairing? I've never heard the LC before, but it sounds like something I'd like to try.
 
Would love to look up the M7, but work internet prevents it. Have to wait till I get home, blah.

 
Like the Audio-gd gear, the Yggy is notorious for requiring at least a solid week of run-in. I thought the RYgg sounded good at SoCal CanJam with the Ethers, but didn't like it with the HE1000s (which were still in the prototype stage). I am using a Hugo as a DAC at the moment (with a very good S/PDIF transport, not USB) and I can imagine some people finding it too thin as well. It is hooked up to a warmer-tuned amp which balances things out perfectly. 
 
The Master 7 fairly nailed it for me at one point as well, and the current Audio-gd DAC I use is the NOS1704, which is a DAC19 without the DSP. It has been set up specifically for NOS use, so wouldn't sound the same as a DAC19 switched to NOS mode I think.
 
I think what it comes down to is system synergy. I've experienced some great DACs, but when I was checking out speakers and mixing and matching components, it was very easy to make even a combination of top-of-the-line components sound awful. 

 

[x RELIC x]

Currawong, would you mind sharing why you went from the Master 7 to the NOS1704?

 

[Currawong]

@Currawong, would you mind sharing why you went from the Master 7 to the NOS1704?

To the Hugo actually. The reason was a 1+ hour warm-up time and subsequent $100 power bills, partially the fault the summer heat and air conditioning.

 

[Youth]

   
Thanks! Yeah I'm still really upset at my ears for not being able to experience what others find so great about the Yggy. I know that when I first started listening with the HD800 it was very sharp. After months of listening it has toned down for me, which must be my ears getting used to it. Most other people have 10+ years of ears being blasted by music, so all the sharpness I experience is probably heard as just detail for them.
 
I think for those that would consider the Yggy a beautiful sound, perhaps they also think the M11/DAC19 is too warm?
 
Also Relic, I was also thinking about DAC19 + Liquid Carbon. How is that pairing? I've never heard the LC before, but it sounds like something I'd like to try.
 
Would love to look up the M7, but work internet prevents it. Have to wait till I get home, blah.

 
I have the DAC 19 and have pre-ordered the Liquid Carbon. All I can say is that after hearing some Cavalli amplifiers at a meet I'm not gonna bother with anything else than Audio-gd DACs and Cavalli amplifiers.

 

[conquerator2]

Sounds like a plan
Is the Carbon really that good? Also hearing good things about the upcoming ' portable '

 

[Jozurr]

Now if only some the LC could drive the HE-6 

. All the components seem to change in my cycle, except for the DAC-19 which will stay till I get the M7 or M11. My quest to look for DACs has come to a halt.

 

[manishex]

Anyone compare the dac19, 10th ani with bifrost multibit?

 

[bimmer100]

  Lucky me, get here right as the subject is in the same area as my thoughts as well. 
 
Thanks to Bimmer, I was able to listen to his Master 11 last night, as well as using the Master 11's amp with the Yggdrasil and Bifrost Multibit. I learned a lot, and it certainly helped steer me closer to my goal of knowing what I actually want. Why am I in the DAC19 thread? Well, Bimmer said the DAC19 had a similar DAC in it. So I'm here to gush about how fantastic AudioGD is and how I will soon join your ranks.
 
I don't pretend to have the thesaurus warming audiophile terms most of you are comfortable with. So I'll bring you down to my level and hear it as I think about it. Laugh if you want, it's alright. I will be making my comparisons with only one headphone, my HD 800. I will quickly say though that Bimmer's modded HE-560 is the greatest thing I have ever heard connected to the Master 11. I still don't really prefer that sound over the HD 800, but it was still a wonderful pairing. 
 
M11 + Bimbi (7/10 Enjoyable)
I found this to be quite a great combination, especially from expecting the Schiit dacs to be overly bright. Soundstage and detail retrieval was adequate, not thrilling. It was pleasant on the ears, but still suffered from digititus. I made up that word. What it means is, I feel like I'm listening to something digital and not analog. I will be using this term more often. I normally only notice it in the highs, but sometimes it can reach the bass where I can hear that same etched response from the sound where you can hear the DAC struggling to figure out what to do with a particular sound. Is that particular sound too detailed, too powerful in contrast to the rest of the spectrum? I have no idea, but Schiit dacs are notorious for it. I'm not 50 and losing my hearing, so I seem to get hit by this from most dacs, but especially Schiit dacs.
 
M11 + Yggdrasil (5/10 Why does this cost so much?)
I was immediately surprised at the amount of detail, the width of the soundstage, and how every note had more life to it. I can say that it was the closest I've felt to floating with the music surrounding me. Though my happiness was quickly ended soon as the high notes started to kick in. There it was, digititus. Sadly, because of the Yggy's excellent detail retrieval, it was worse to my ears, sounding sibilant. Even the Bifrost Multibit wasn't sibilant, but still rather digital sounding. For the record, I was testing the same song through all three dacs to compare more closely. I'm still shocked and a bit let down that something I thought would be the best dac, was not even close. I have sensitive hearing because I got into audio late. I'm 29 years old and only started to listen to music as a hobby two years ago. My ears have not burned in yet. So while I may be rather upset at the Yggy's performance, to many others it's probably a very enjoyable experience.
 
M11 + M11 (10/10 Why don't more people own this?)
I've listened to a lot of dacs. Well, maybe depends who I'm comparing to. I've been to 5+ large headphone meets, and have listened to more dacs than I can count. I mean, I probably could but it would require thinking really hard, and the last time I thought really hard I got a headache, so let's avoid that. I've listened to expensive dacs, inexpensive dacs, good dacs (wolfson comes to mind), and absurdly expensive dacs. The DAC in the M11 wins, hands down, no contest. Detail retrieval is excellent, soundstage is excellent, tone is natural, everything has a body to it. Never once did I encounter sibilance unless the track was deserving of it, which Bimmer had an excellent set of tracks picked out which didn't highlight that. Though still, the Bifrost sounded digital, the Yggy sounded digital, but why doesn't the M11? What sorcery is this? Sure the soundstage might be less euphoric than Yggy, sure the detail retrieval might not make my hairs stand on edge. Though this is the first DAC I've ever heard that didn't suffer from digititus. I really think that's more special than all the rest because of that.
 
So while it remains one of the greatest things I've heard as a whole, the price is not something I want to dive immediately at. There are other things I want to try, such as getting some of that DAC experience with the DAC19, and trying other amps. This is the part where Bimmer cringes and thinks I'm nuts. I want the DAC19 + Valhalla 2. Perhaps it was because I was just beginning my adventure, but I had the HD 700 + Valhalla 2, and to me it was an excellent combo. To this day, the only amp that has wowed me. I returned it because at the time I was stressed for money, and I had Vali which did an excellent job as well, while being more smooth. At the time I was really into drum & bass, which made keeping Vali an easy option. At the end of the day, I'm in it for my ears, not other people's ears. So while someone might think the Valhalla 2 is an underwhelming amp, it's the only thing I want right now. Perhaps when I get it again I will end up agreeing. I guess it's like your first car. It was super awesome when you got it and you will always remember how great it was, though in reality it's not really that good. We'll see.
 
Wow I wrote a lot, and I haven't even had my coffee yet.

 
 
For those who wonder, the Yggdrasil had ample time to warm up. about 60-72hours. I noticed it being bright during the first 24 hours and really didn't change much after the 3rd day of warm up. Bob's raiting of 5/10 seems a bit harsh from my point of view. I would give it a good 8-8.5/10 and the Bimbo about 6.5-7/10.
 
 
 
First and foremost, everything was powered by the M11, which is more than sufficient and would give every dac a chance to shine and sound it's best. The amp section of the M11 is nothing short of fantastic. As everyone that evening that listened to their dac through the M11 could agree that the sound quality was quite amazing and their headphones sung a song they have rarely get to sing. (tons of power)
 
Another important factor is that ALL amps and dacs for this evening were powered by PS Audio's P300 AC Regenerator. This allows for the cleanest power posssible for each source. This will allow for the best conditions possible for each dac to shine and sound it's best. Amongst the M11's amp sounding it's best.
The M11 was powered by a Cryo'd PS Audio Lab Cable (8gauge). The dac's all were plugged directly into the Paul Pang V3 OCXO usb 3.0 PCIE card. Again, an ideal source for the least jitter. The Yggy had ideal conditions in all aspects. The bimbi had the same treatment etc. We also tested a LH Labs Pulse X Infinity +LH Labs LPS4..FYI.
 
Bimbi (powered by M11) - this was hooked up with some short/directional quality Audio-gd RCA cables. It obviousl affected the overall signal compared to using Balanced XLR's like with the Yggdrasil. The sound was slightly warmer due to the cable, yet remained detailed with bits of digititus here and there. Overall it's what I expected. About on par with the Gumby's SE output... as in...sounds exactly the same. The Gumby's Balanced outputs are far better than it's SE or the bimby in general. BUT, if you must buy Schiit than the Bimby is a good entry level choice as it provides an overall decent performance level for the money. Yet the amp paired with it would be critical to get the most ouf of it! 
 
Yggy (powered by M11) - This Yggy was hooked up with some high end balanced XLR's with TECU core/Rhodium plated connectors etc. The amp was powered by a Blueberry audio power cable. I'm not going to lie. The Yggy is definitely one of the better dac's on the market today. It's detail retrieval is quite impressive. The first thing I noticed when it was just turned on was that this dac is very bright and on the virge of obnoxious to the ears with about 10%-15% of the tracks I listened to. I understand with time this improves. About three days later the Yggy settled down a bit and sounded more relaxed yet still has a subtle amount of sibilance and over exaggerated high frequencies IMHO. The M11 has ever bit the same of detail retrieval but without the exaggerated sound or forward and aggressive in your face sound. Personally my listening sessions with the Yggy were from 1-2 hours on average before I felt the need to take a break. It definitely sounds better were reducing the volume a bit for more casual listening, but to me, that's leaves a lot to be desired for an emotional connection to the music that makes you want to tap your foot etc. The M11 tends to grab my attention and get me addicted to the sound all while having longer listening sessions of 4-5 hours or even almost all day even. The Yggy's strongest point against the M11 was it's sound stage. It's a touch wider than the M11's dac. And I mean only a touch. It's enough to notice and be more of a subtle difference that can be heard. I am still impressed with the Yggdrasil and understand why so many people love it's sound. The hype is justified, but in my mind the price is not. To build a system comparable to the M11 it would likely end up containing a Yggdrasil/Ragnarok combo or approx 4000usd! or the price of a M11 @ around 2000usd. My point of view is that it's a no brainer to pickup a Master 11. 
 
 
So where does the Dac19 come in? Well I view it in a sort like a mini Master 11. It's not quite the same level but it's got a very similar sound. Similar enough that most people wouldn't really know the difference. The Detail retrieval is spectacular in the DAC19. I owned one for a while and was very impressed with this Dac19. The new owner is likely even more happy than I was to receive it. I don't regret selling it as it went to fund my purchase of the Master 11. But If the M11 was not avail, I would still have the Dac19 without a question.  The main difference I noticed from the DAC19 and M11 was also soundstage. The M11 has a slight improvement on soundstage over the Dac19.  Does this make the Dac19 sound dated or no good? absolutely not. The DAC19 is every bit as exciting to listen to when you choose a proper amp. I've unfortunatley not had the chance to hear it with the Liquid Carbon but many people I trust have sworn it's a combination that synergizes. I suppose it all depends on your headphones. When Bob Figgins mentioned the Vahalla 2, I somewhat cringed as it's a tube amp and personally i'm not much of a fan of tube amps since they introduce harmonization or distortion into the signal to some extent. Maybe the Vahallla 2 would work since it apparently handles 600ohm headphones fairly well? But I won't recommend it as i've not heard it myself to know what i'm talking about.
 
The M11 pushes pure class A at about 650mw per channel @ 600ohm, vahalla 2 does 450mw @600ohm, and the audio-gd C2 11th Aniv does pure class A @ 150mw/600ohm or not pure class A @ 600mw/600ohm.
 
 
I just hope the Liquid Carbon can drive the HD800 well. I really don't know and the specs i've found don't clearly state much. But most headphones likely do well. Anyone actually have a liquid carbon and HD800 that they can honestly say have good synergy? 

 

[Stillhart]

I mentioned it in the Liquid Carbon thread... Heard the HD800 with LC and DAC19 at RMAF. Normally I can't stand the HD800 for more than about 30s. I find it way too bright and it literally can hurt my ears. On this setup, though, I actually liked the 800. I was very surprised! Evshrug heard something similar.

Honestly, I'm thinking about getting one now.

 

[conquerator2]

I am thinking about getting a Carbon 

 

[bimmer100]

I mentioned it in the Liquid Carbon thread... Heard the HD800 with LC and DAC19 at RMAF. Normally I can't stand the HD800 for more than about 30s. I find it way too bright and it literally can hurt my ears. On this setup, though, I actually liked the 800. I was very surprised! Evshrug heard something similar.

Honestly, I'm thinking about getting one now.

Thank you for commenting on this and giving your impressions of the hd800 and liquid carbon. I do not like the hd800 either, except with my master 11 it's actually quite nice. Otherwise it's too bright and too picky to power properly from most Amps.

 

[Evshrug]

It probably wasn't a fair first-impression of the HD800, because it sounded so good One of the two "Woah!" moments of RMAF for me was the DAC19+LC+HD800. Song was "Diamonds on the Soles of her Shoes," in a high-res FLAC. The HD800 totally didn't respond how I expected: imaging was very good, but I was surprised at how reenforced the bass was, the treble was sparkly but not brittle or harsh, mids had a bit of air/dust but overall the experience was very musical while also being shockingly detailed. The HD800 had some super $500 cables and a partial Anaxulus mod (I think), so maybe a bit deviated from stock, but it didn't seem compromised. Haunted me through the night.

The other "ooh WOAH!" moment was on Fostex's TOTL setup (with their $8,000 amp, and I missed what DAC, and the TH900). DAC19 Magic was much more affordable/attainable lol!