New Audio-gd DAC-19 [10th Anniversary Edition]
Nov 13, 2015 at 1:12 PM Post #1,066 of 1,962
Kingwa made the master11! That is the giant killer right there. It's a step up from the dac19.ive owned the dac19 and loved the sound so much I had to get the master11. It further improved the sound stage and overall the signature is approximately the same yet now it's paired with a pure class A monster amplifier that truly is impressive. A master11 needs an audition to truly appreciate its sound. Since you have heard the dac19+liquid carbon then you can imagine that but a bit better
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I believe it's well worth the price and compares to other setups 5000-15,000 easily.

 
But the M11 has an integrated amp which isn't necessarily desirable (not necessarily bad, but not necessarily desirable), and also has many run of the mill parts in the signal path.  An upgraded DAC-19 would be more to my liking.  Replace all those $.25 WIMA metallized polystyrene caps, $.50 resistors, cheap plated connecters, upgrade to discrete regulators, etc...
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 1:36 PM Post #1,067 of 1,962
Kingwa made the master11! That is the giant killer right there. It's a step up from the dac19.ive owned the dac19 and loved the sound so much I had to get the master11. It further improved the sound stage and overall the signature is approximately the same yet now it's paired with a pure class A monster amplifier that truly is impressive. A master11 needs an audition to truly appreciate its sound. Since you have heard the dac19+liquid carbon then you can imagine that but a bit better
wink.gif

I believe it's well worth the price and compares to other setups 5000-15,000 easily.


+1!  also the M11 works superb as pre-amp
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 1:54 PM Post #1,068 of 1,962
   
But the M11 has an integrated amp which isn't necessarily desirable (not necessarily bad, but not necessarily desirable), and also has many run of the mill parts in the signal path.  An upgraded DAC-19 would be more to my liking.  Replace all those $.25 WIMA metallized polystyrene caps, $.50 resistors, cheap plated connecters, upgrade to discrete regulators, etc...

 
I've seen this comment parroted elsewhere (not that you are necessarily parroting).
 
Can you list / show the bad parts in the signal path?
 
How do they differ from other offerings at a similar price point?
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 2:35 PM Post #1,069 of 1,962
   
I've seen this comment parroted elsewhere (not that you are necessarily parroting).
 
Can you list / show the bad parts in the signal path?
 
How do they differ from other offerings at a similar price point?

 
Hmmm, I did list specific parts.  And you can see them in the open-case pictures on their website.  Those red rectangles are cheapo $0.25 caps.  Those resistors near the circuit boards are cheapo $0.50 resistors.  The regulators are IC regulators, not discrete.
 
I haven't drawn any comparisons of its components to those in offerings at a similar price point.  That's not the point.  I think you missed my point.  It's a very decent DAC in many ways, but with some audiophile component upgrades it could be even better and even more appealing (albeit at an elevated price point).  Maybe you don't think a DAC-19SE is an interesting idea.  I do.  That's all.
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 3:47 PM Post #1,070 of 1,962
   
But the M11 has an integrated amp which isn't necessarily desirable (not necessarily bad, but not necessarily desirable), and also has many run of the mill parts in the signal path.  An upgraded DAC-19 would be more to my liking.  Replace all those $.25 WIMA metallized polystyrene caps, $.50 resistors, cheap plated connecters, upgrade to discrete regulators, etc...

I've never considered Wima as a cheap cap...let alone anything in the Audio-GD builds as being cheap. Listing the prices of all the components to build an amp anywhere near these price points is unheard of in the USA or Europe etc. Many other companies use the same components yet charge much more. Yes, the company is in China, but they actually pay their employees quite well so they can't really give away the farm any more than they already do. They may be able to potentailly build better amps and dacs, in fact I don't doubt that they could build a potential DAC-19SE. Most people are jaw dropping happy to hear the results of their current line of amps/dacs. They have a 10 year warranty! and in most people's opinions, excellent build of parts which equal a well implemented house sound that audio-gd is known for. 
 
The Master-11 has a desireable AIO or All in One package. Doing so keeps the pathway from the dac to the amp as short as possible. This is an advantage in some ways, and disadvantage in other ways if it's design is flawed. Fortunately Kingwa is a brilliant amp/dac designer and has created an impressive build with a well thought out product. The master 11 speaks for itself, or you just have to listen to it to realize that something was done right.  In the end, all the fancy expensive parts don't mean anything as well as all the measurements on paper. It's the human ear that will tell you if it sounds good. Sure i'm going out on a limb saying all this. But to an extent, most of this is true. Many amp/dac designers throw a bunch of high grade parts into their products and the end result is less than spectacular. The Master 11 varies from the Master 7 and Master 9 yet essentially is those two units combined into one. You would think the separates would sound better as the master 7 has 8 pcm1704uk's... but that doesn't realty matter. The master11 to many actually sounds much better. Some believe it's due to the short or direct path between the dac and amp. No interconnects to color the sound etc. Yet some want to have interconnects to color the sound. More money to spend on extra parts you don't essentially need for good sound.  Where am I going with this? well, the Master 11 is a brilliant build, it won't be out of date later on down the road. You can use it as just an amp, or just a dac if you so desire. I've hooked many different dac's up to the master11's amp. Why? the master11's amp is beastly and sounds incredible. MUCH better than most any amp out there currently. I prefer it over the beastly ragnarok in many ways! It's pretty much the same amount of power, which is overkill, The audio-gd master 11 is pure class A power through the whole power curve up to the 16,000mw per channel! the Ragnarok is only pure class A up to 4,000mw per channel and then it reverts to class AB operation after that point... the master 11's specs are more impressive.
 
 
yet the sound is cleaner and the relay stepped volume control is way nicer than the ragnarok's. I can't stand the stiff Rok's control, and the rok's relay control has feedback issues that are audible, not to mention it's linear and only 64steps. that makes for terrible control of sensitive headphones or iems. The Audio-GD M11 relay based control is 99 steps and NOT linear, it has an immense amount of gradual control for all the sensitive iem's and headphones. yet again, the master 11's specs are more impressive.
 
the power plug used in the master 11 is pure red copper, The power inlet is not some cheap plug or the wires attached to it. The power wire is routed under the PCB's with layers of shielding to prevent EMI/RF etc. Thick aluminum chassis and walls were made for the chassis to prevent EMI/RF/Eddy Current etc.the wires used inside area all Ohno Continuous Cast wire. amongst choose a high grade Amanero Combo 384 with a specific build exclusive to Audio-GD with it's own onboard class pure A power supply. 
 
Do you believe there are other products that are in the same class of performance of the Master 11? if so, what?  I would say the Yggdrasil/Ragnarok is a close match to performance yet the price is literally double that of the Master11.  Build quality of the Schiit products have some lacking issues as well if you want to be picky. yet for the price they're asking.... well.. you've ever right to be picky. 
 
The DAC19 is the subject. The price audio-gd asks is insanely reasonable and the performance is better than anything Schiit has to offer except the Yggdrasil. thats is... the Gumby is not as good imho. especially in SE the Gumby is clearly a few steps below the DAC19.  In Balanced the Gumby is more comparable, yet still has the forward aggressive and fatiguing sound that schiit is known for. DAC19 anyday over the gumby imho.  The build quality is backed by a 10 year warranty. I'd like to think i'll still be listening to my master11 in 10 years from now... once 11 years hit, well maybe it'll break and i'll buy something else. But everyone say's they're made like tanks. SO TRUE. quality product imho.
 
-T
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 3:48 PM Post #1,071 of 1,962
   
Hmmm, I did list specific parts.  And you can see them in the open-case pictures on their website.  Those red rectangles are cheapo $0.25 caps.  Those resistors near the circuit boards are cheapo $0.50 resistors.  The regulators are IC regulators, not discrete.
 
I haven't drawn any comparisons of its components to those in offerings at a similar price point.  That's not the point.  I think you missed my point.  It's a very decent DAC in many ways, but with some audiophile component upgrades it could be even better and even more appealing (albeit at an elevated price point).  Maybe you don't think a DAC-19SE is an interesting idea.  I do.  That's all.

 
I think it's interesting as well. That said, Kingwa said that there's really no upgrades possible, and he seems to know what he's doing. A $0.25 cap or $0.50 resistor isn't necessarily less than ideal.
 
P.S. Yeah, to some extent I'm just defending my new baby. And sorry for derailing the DAC-19 thread!
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 4:02 PM Post #1,072 of 1,962
I think it's interesting as well. That said, Kingwa said that there's really no upgrades possible, and he seems to know what he's doing. A $0.25 cap or $0.50 resistor isn't necessarily less than ideal.

P.S. Yeah, to some extent I'm just defending my new baby. And sorry for derailing the DAC-19 thread!


Yeah that line about no upgrades possible is just that ... A line. There are many possible.

But I never intended to talk badly about the DAC-19. And I don't think I have. It's a great DAC. I love the sound. And that's why I think it'd also be a great base design for an even better higher end product offering.

Don't want to go back to the M11 discussion as this isn't the right place for that.

Cheers!
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 10:30 PM Post #1,074 of 1,962
Dac-19se is not interesting to me. I'm not bothered by the components in the dac-19. A balanced dac-19 without going all the way to the master 7 or 11, and in the same size box does interest me though. Different strokes…


Look for a used Reference 5.32 and upgrade its input to Amanero. I had a Ref 5 before my Master-11.
 
Nov 14, 2015 at 9:07 PM Post #1,076 of 1,962
Dac-19se is not interesting to me. I'm not bothered by the components in the dac-19. A balanced dac-19 without going all the way to the master 7 or 11, and in the same size box does interest me though. Different strokes…

 
I now have a $2800 amp that's SE so I'm very content with my SE DAC-19.  :)
 
Nov 19, 2015 at 4:11 PM Post #1,078 of 1,962
For those in the USA ordering from Audio-GD, are there any issues with customs or insurance with the $180 value declaration, or should I have actual value declared? If I do declare actual value, what is the additional import tax, if any? Also cross posting to the three new amps thread.
 
Nov 19, 2015 at 4:18 PM Post #1,079 of 1,962
There is no import tax in the USA.
 
The declared $180 value is really not of any help to you, though might prevent customs from tearing open your box and inspecting the contents - which they will do from time to time.
 
BTW, I'm purchasing a NFB-1AMP which I'm using to hold me over until a custom built amp arrives in a couple months.  I would be glad to sell you a barely used NFB-1AMP at a discount in a couple months time if interested.  I am also in the USA.
 
Nov 20, 2015 at 10:26 AM Post #1,080 of 1,962
For those in the USA ordering from Audio-GD, are there any issues with customs or insurance with the $180 value declaration, or should I have actual value declared? If I do declare actual value, what is the additional import tax, if any? Also cross posting to the three new amps thread.

Never had an issue when I asked Audio-GD to declare a specific value on customs. It arrived with minimal fuss via DHL. Interestingly the only customs inspection it seemed to have gotten was going over the border from mainland China to Hong Kong, where Chinese customs completely opened the box and looked through it. They did an excellent and overly generous job taping the box back up again, however.
 

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