[supra28]

Was wondering which DAC you guys are using for 24bit recordings?

 

[s1rrah]

Was wondering which DAC you guys are using for 24bit recordings?

 
All 30,000 or so tracks in my library are 16bit. Not concerned with 192/24bit, really ... I've dabbled here and there ... but I really am not too impressed with the difference over 16bit ... (maybe my ears or gear is broke) ... ... 
 
The new v2 Havana receives 192/24bit just fine ... but the final output is still 16bit.
 
MHDT Labs has another new DAC called "The Pagoda" ... which maintains the R2R design but outputs in 24 bit ... haven't heard it, personally.

 

[supra28]

Hey Joel, just noticed that you're a fellow Houstonian. I hear friends rave about 24bit, and kinda caught my curiosity . Maybe it would wise to jump to DSD instead. Have you tried the tung Sol 2c51?

 

[s1rrah]

Hey Joel, just noticed that you're a fellow Houstonian. I hear friends rave about 24bit, and kinda caught my curiosity . Maybe it would wise to jump to DSD instead. Have you tried the tung Sol 2c51?

 
If your in to that sort of thing then sure, DSD would be the obvious direction to go.
 
Personally? Having a music collection that I've quite literally been putting together since the 80's? High res listening, short of being a novelty, really isn't an interest of mine. Chances are I'm not going to be able to find Black Flag's earlier work in high res ... it's sort of a niche market, really, high res listening. Almost like something you have to seek out for the sake of seeking out high resolution music and not the music/content itself.
 
Hell. I personally still feel that a good clean vinyl record sounds better than anything digital, 16 bit or otherwise.
 
And yeah . . Houston is home ... for all of my 46 years. I live out close to Sugarland ... smack dab in the heart of "Chinatown" ... 
 
Best,
Joel

 

[loserica]

Guys, It has gone almost three months since I installed Black Gate FK (I got ten BG FK capacitors in mine Havana...) and imaging became so solid!! It is known that Black Gate requires hundreds of hours of burning. Havana equalized the DAC7 at details, stage presence, speed and timing. The bass is finally powerfull, very well defined and down below noticeably in frequency. BINGO !!

The lower midrange has much more authority and energy. I waited for this more than four years...
Everything sounds like I wanted: clear sound, excellent definition as I said, the piano sounds very natural and reliable; the sound texture became very rich and fleshy. Resolution and the microdynamics are incredible.

 
In the busy passages of the music and generally, the coherence level is exemplary. It has pace, rhythm, dynamics and a very good timing (which was not the case before). In the background it became discernible noises that I have never heard before in the songs that I listen every day. These micro details change a lot the feeling of listening.
 
The highs on Havana are so special (the upercut treble are more present and better defined than ARC DAC7 or Lavry DA10). The highs are so detailed and it has excellent sense, airy and reliability. They are clear but never too bright.
I do not know how much is due to Black Gate and how much to Sanyo Oscon in the digital stage section, becouse I installed them simultaneously, I can only say that it was a GREAT upgrade. One of the best, obviously.

 

[bdh]

 Chances are I'm not going to be able to find Black Flag's earlier work in high res ... it's sort of a niche market

 
Oh, to hear Damaged on vinyl again...
 
Digitization has sucked the life out of every punk rock record I've ever heard.  Even with the crappy turntables and headphones we had back then.

 

[kimchee411]

   
Oh, to hear Damaged on vinyl again...
 
Digitization has sucked the life out of every punk rock record I've ever heard.  Even with the crappy turntables and headphones we had back then.

 
So use a turntable?  They are still around...

 

[bdh]

I have one.  I just don't have the room to set it up, nor a desire to get back in the vinyl game for a variety of reasons.  It's mostly punk and classical I prefer vinyl with anyway--so not worth the hassle at the moment.

 

[s1rrah]

   
Oh, to hear Damaged on vinyl again...
 
Digitization has sucked the life out of every punk rock record I've ever heard.  Even with the crappy turntables and headphones we had back then.

 
I agree.
 
But as an alternative to Kimchee's coment ...
 
Get decent 16bit recordings and any of the MHDT tube DACs and a decent amp and headphones (I use Stax 323S and SR404LE's personally, and this set up is pretty magic with the Havana DAC and currently, a Stockholm v2) ...
 
The Havana and Stockholm are about the best counterpoint to vinyl that I've heard ... and here's the household's vinyl rig (my roommates which I've listened too extensively):
 
...
 

 
...
 
Cheers!

 

[loserica]

  Get decent 16bit recordings and any of the MHDT tube DACs and a decent amp and headphones (I use Stax 323S and SR404LE's personally, and this set up is pretty magic with the Havana DAC and currently, a Stockholm v2) ...
 
The Havana and Stockholm are about the best counterpoint to vinyl that I've heard ... and here's the household's vinyl rig (my roommates which I've listened too extensively):

 
I'm going to be little off topic...
 
I like how it sounds SR404LE with Havana. After I decided to change parts, I felt a slight loss of Havana refinement (that "analogue" feel into the music). It's hard to do this without affecting the initial sound balance. You increase the resolution and details step by step and you feel throughout the entire process that something fall behind. I don't know how to explain this..
 
..BUT, there was a time when everything returns in the beginning.

For me this time coincides with the break-in of Black Gate. It's incredible what it's capable Havana at this level!! The good news is that it keeps the whole initial refinement and analogue feel.
 
@Joel, have you ever tried eXStatA (the SS version)? Would be an improvement over the 323S.

 

[s1rrah]

   
I'm going to be little off topic...
 
I like how it sounds SR404LE with Havana. After I decided to change parts, I felt a slight loss of Havana refinement (that "analogue" feel into the music). It's hard to do this without affecting the initial sound balance. You increase the resolution and details step by step and you feel throughout the entire process that something fall behind. I don't know how to explain this..
 
..BUT, there was a time when everything returns in the beginning.

For me this time coincides with the break-in of Black Gate. It's incredible what it's capable Havana at this level!! The good news is that it keeps the whole initial refinement and analogue feel.
 
@Joel, have you ever tried eXStatA (the SS version)? Would be an improvement over the 323S.

 
Hi ...
 
No .. I've not heard an eXStatA amp. I'm really happy with the 323S at the moment ... I'd have to hear one before actually investing. What do you like more about it?
 
Further, I for one am totally pleased with the stock Stockholm v2 that I've been listening too for the past couple weeks. It's quite a leap in detail retrieval and resolution over the stock Havana DAC, which is a bit more "dark" sounding to me. Not sure if it's the different digital receiver in the Stockholm v2 or the fact that MHDT decoupled the DAC chips internal OPAMPS, but the Stockholm v2 is a much more refined listen to my ear. I'm currently beginning a bit of a review of this new Stockholm DAC and will post a word once it's done. 
 
Also ...
 
To Loserica (and any other Havana modders) ...
 
If one were to upgrade JUST the output caps of a Havana DAC? What would you all say would be the best choice and why?
 
Thanks...

 

[loserica]

  No .. I've not heard an eXStatA amp. I'm really happy with the 323S at the moment ... I'd have to hear one before actually investing. What do you like more about it?
 
If one were to upgrade JUST the output caps of a Havana DAC? What would you all say would be the best choice and why?

 
I've owned both, the eXStatA (SS) and Stax SRM-006tII. I've not heard 323S, but based upon my "Stax" experience I can make some logical deductions. eXStatA had the same texture as SRM-006tII, but better speed, resolution and presentation of microdetails, superior separation. These DIY amp are a very good solutions for Stax earspeakers. Certainly drive them better.

 
...not to be off-topic, there are some good references here:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/462138/first-impressions-exstata-diy-electrostatic-amp

 

[robeeert1]

If one were to upgrade JUST the output caps of a Havana DAC? What would you all say would be the best choice and why?
 
Thanks...

 
Joel, Havana, Stockholm are in fact cheap DACs, what would I say in this matter? To get the best caps in the price range of the DAC itsefl? I would not recommned such solution. I recommend  Jensen copper foil PIO caps (check the dimensions first) which are decent priced and very analogue sounding ones... they will improve the performance not ruining your pocket..
I don't think the differences like you say between Stockholm 2 and Havana are caused by opamps. PCM56's internal opamp is a very good one. The Stockholm v2 must have better contruction than Havana. It seems MHDT gets some experience in building DACs...

 

[carmagff]

Any comprasions between any MHDT DAC and Metrum Octave? It's really interesting because they are using the same NOS philisophy but very different realisation.

 

[loserica]

To Loserica (and any other Havana modders) ... If one were to upgrade JUST the output caps of a Havana DAC? What would you all say would be the best choice and why?

   Quote:

  Joel, Havana, Stockholm are in fact cheap DACs, what would I say in this matter? To get the best caps in the price range of the DAC itsefl? I would not recommned such solution. I recommend  Jensen copper foil PIO caps (check the dimensions first) which are decent priced and very analogue sounding ones... they will improve the performance not ruining your pocket..

 
I'm trying an answer based on my experience.
 
You are close to the truth, Robert. Your old Havana was very well upgraded and was similar to mine (both we have used V-Cap CuTF, Black Gate N, F, some FK, K-grade BB chips, the same tubes, etc.). The differences between the stage where you stop before selling your Havana and these last upgrades that we have made (me and Eugene) are impressive.

Believe-me! Havana it is capable of deep bass and very extensive highs and that transparency and microdynamics in front of which other dac's fades, but only if you realize the full upgrade; and this requires additional seven Rike S-Cap (0,1uF) and a few others FK Black Gates (and/or high capacity Sanyo OSCON). I admit that I have implemented supplementary supported by a friend, eight Sanyo Oscons on the back of the motherboard..
The replace of film capacitors will not take the full effect without the best electrolytics for Havana. and the best electrolytics are, as you said, the BG FK!!

 
@Joel,
If you want a decently DAC, those Jensen to the output would be the best solution; They have been personally tested by Robert.
But if you want HIGH-END with Havana, you must to put inside the best parts: V-Cap CuTF, Duelund Cast PIO, Black Gate FK, Rike S-Cap, etc.. but remember, not just to the output caps, or elsewhere.. all parts! Everything has to be perfect.
 
It depends to what wants each and of course, how much can investing. The full upgrade cost about $1700. This qualitatively exceeds its price components, this is undoubtedly.
After the complete Black Gate FK break-in, the texture is gorgeous.