[pp312]

Quote:

 
Make sure you are not being confused by the gain DIP switch diagram. The white box is the protruding part of the DIP switch. Maybe you have it backwards.
 

Yes, I do, and I think Matrix have come up with one of the most confusing illustrations in the history of user manuals.
 
They've also come up with one of the most irritating volume controls. Smooth as a glacier and quite stiff to turn, it resists all but the most determined attempts to change volume. It's also virtually unmarked, so it's next to impossible to tell what position it's in even in a bright room.
 
Otherwise, everything's sweet.

 

[damaltor]

 
Quote:

Yes, I do, and I think Matrix have come up with one of the most confusing illustrations in the history of user manuals.
 
They've also come up with one of the most irritating volume controls. Smooth as a glacier and quite stiff to turn, it resists all but the most determined attempts to change volume. It's also virtually unmarked, so it's next to impossible to tell what position it's in even in a bright room.
 
Otherwise, everything's sweet.

Totally agree on the volume control, I replaced the knob on mine with a "Goldpoint 1.1 Aluminum Knob", much better.
 

 

[jeff119]

Where did you get your AD797BRZ with brown dog adapter from?
 
Quote:

The HRT I dont know sorry but if you do opt for the NFB-3 I can HIGHLY recommend a pair of AD797BRZ (on a Brown Dog adapter) for the M-Stage. I ran the full gamut of opamps for the Matrix out of an NFB-3 until the AD797BRZ and it was a "BAM - thats the one!" moment.
 

 

 

[Riverback]

A bit interested on the M-stage. Looks like a good replacement for the Mav D1's amp stage
 
Why was coolfungadget banned though?  Nvm, I saw the post
 
A question about opamp swapping, Is there any dc offset to worry about? or do we have blocking caps to save us from that?

 

[RudeAmbassador]

is there a newer newer version of the mstage?

 

[project86]

Quote:

is there a newer newer version of the mstage?

Not exactly. There is the original M-Stage as seen in my review at the beginning of this thread. Then there is the refreshed version, sometimes called v2, which is what you see being sold on eBay and other places (they don't sell the original anymore). And that's technically all there is.
 
Unofficially, the new Matrix Quattro amp seems to basically be two M-Stages combined into a single chassis, for balanced operation.
 

 

[dlaloum]

 
Hi folks,

 

I have been using my Revox 3100 (beyer DT880/600 vintage 1985) for a long time, and most recently with my Matrix M-Stage.

 

Very happy with the sound...

 

lately I have been experimenting with my Turntable/Cartridge setup, and specifically with variable cartridge loading, which subtly (and sometimes coarsely!) alters the frequency response of MM / MI cartridges.

 

My issue is that I have been finding that through my main speakers these differences are audible albeit subtle - through the headphones there is no difference.

 

This appears to indicate that my HP ring is not sufficiently transparent to expose these differences.... and that therefore I can presumably get more from these headphones.... OR that I need to shop for something a notch further up.

 

I am looking for assistance as to what might either make my existing setup more transparent or alternatively what alternatives might provide the transparency/resolution I am seeking.

 

Please note this is NOT about warmth/coolness/neutrality or other aspects of frequency response "accents" that define the "character" of a setup, but its ability to resolve fine detail differences....

 

A couple of other things (before you ask!) - I run pure digital, that is to say TT goes to Phono stage goes to DAC, which feeds AVR, which in turn drives speakers. 

The AVR is not the constraint as through this chain the differences are audible.

When using the AVR as the HP amp, the differences are not audible (it has an internal 5532 with diamond buffer HP amp).

 

My Setup:

Turntable: JVC QL-Y5F (various cartridges)

Phono Stage : JLTI Phono (with custom loading via loading plugs)

ADC/DAC: Windows7 PC with eMu 1616m - connected to AVR via HDMI

Pre/Amp/AVR: Onkyo TX-SR876

Speakers : Gallo Ref 3.1

HP Amp : Matrix M-Stage (opamps 49860 with class A mod)

HP's: Revox 3100 (DT880/600-1985), Koss Pro4x, Sennheiser PCX450, Audio Technica ATH-AD700

 

Most HP listening is done via the M-Stage connected to the DAC out of the 1616m

Listening via the Onkyo TX-SR876 uses the Onkyo's DAC and amplifiers (either speaker or HP) - but speaker based showed up the differences, where HP based did not.

 

Any input gratefully accepted

 

thanks


David

 

[BmWr75]

 
Are you converting the analog signal from your TT/phono pre to digital and then back to analog in you receiver?  That doesn't sound right, but that is how your original post reads?
 
When using the M-stage, are you plugging the phono pre analog outs directly into the M-stage inputs?

 

[purrin]

Quote:

My issue is that I have been finding that through my main speakers these differences are audible albeit subtle - through the headphones there is no difference.

 

This appears to indicate that my HP ring is not sufficiently transparent to expose these differences.... and that therefore I can presumably get more from these headphones.... OR that I need to shop for something a notch further up.

 

I am looking for assistance as to what might either make my existing setup more transparent or alternatively what alternatives might provide the transparency/resolution I am seeking.

 

Please note this is NOT about warmth/coolness/neutrality or other aspects of frequency response "accents" that define the "character" of a setup, but its ability to resolve fine detail differences....

 

 
Keep in mind that speakers can do things that headphones can't such as soundstage and instrument separation. This sometimes lets you discern certain kinds of differences including detail. However, since you are already able to hear subtle differences in your current signal chain, this leaves only the following:
 

• Your headphone amp
• Your headphones

 
The Matrix is pretty good in the transparency department, but severely limited by the op-amp voltage gain stage and to a lesser extent coupling capacitors at the input. You can't expect world class transparency at that price. A fully discrete DC-coupled head-amp will give you more transparency.
 
For headphones, if you want resolution and the ability to retrieve low-level information (sidestepping any issues of warmth, dryness, neutrality, tone, balance, whatever, etc.), try Sennheiser HD800, Sony SA5000, or maybe the HE6 or high-end STAX.

 

[dlaloum]

The M-Stage is direct connected to my 1616m DAC ADC....
 
I usually listen to stuff from my server flac library....  the Turntable is present as part of my exercise of digitising the vinyl parts of the library - before getting heavily into digitising, I first launched into a research project to work out the best possible archival setup with which to digitise my records...
To that end I found myself comparing a range of very nice cartridges - some of them are subtly different.
So what I do is digitise an album - normalise it so level differences don't  taint my comparison, then listen to two or three different recordings of the same album
 
That means that the Phono stage goes straight into the ADC, and the Matrix M-Stage goes straigh from the DAC.
 
Purrin  - took your advice and had another listen to my Sennheisers (not quite HD800's - they are PCX450's) - sure enough they do show up some of the differences - not as well as the speakers, but they are audible.
 
In some frustration I also took a multimeter to my Beyer/Revox HP's - one channel reads 590ohm (close enough) the other reads 1150ohm - not even in the ballpark.... seems like part of the problem is the headphones....
 
Thanks for the input
 
Bye for now

David

 

[purrin]

Quote:

 
In some frustration I also took a multimeter to my Beyer/Revox HP's - one channel reads 590ohm (close enough) the other reads 1150ohm - not even in the ballpark.... seems like part of the problem is the headphones....

Double check that. Make sure you are measuring (L -> Ground) and (R -> Ground) instead of L- > R  (L -> Ground - > R) which would be x2 the impedance of one driver. I did this once and realized I was having a brain fart.
 

 

[dogwan]

Does anyone have or know where I can get the schematics for the M-stage?
 
I'm considering upgrading the resistors in the signal path. I've had good experience moving away from metal films to carbon film. After reading the LovelyCube thread it seems likely that some of the components may not be the highest quality or even possibly fakes. I know that is a dangerous inference on my part.  From previous experience with Chinese metal film resistors in components I think there is a hint of glare that can be alleviated.
 
Also I'm wondering if there's other threads with more mods for the M-stage than this thread? I've perused this one from the beginning and it seems to mainly be focused on swapping Opamps.
 
Thanks,
Dogwan

 

[MilesDavis2]

For anyone using the M-Stage with a Beyerdynamic DT880 600 ohm, please let me know was the power from the M-Stage sufficient to power the beyers with plenty more reserve.  Thanks for your input.

 

[castlevania32]

Quote:

For anyone using the M-Stage with a Beyerdynamic DT880 600 ohm, please let me know was the power from the M-Stage sufficient to power the beyers with plenty more reserve.  Thanks for your input.

yes plenty of power with the +20dB gain. People usually like dt880 with tube amp to tame the brightness of the headphone, but power wise the m-stage drives it great.

 

[Sganzerla]

 The Meier Concerto was a lot better than my Matrix M-Stage with Earth HDAM on a brief test I've made, with DT 880/600.
 I think my next move will be the La Figaro 339, as Concerto was a little more to the bright side, something I don't want. I like tube sound too, and there are a lot of people saying good things about this pairing.
 
 By the way, I'm here to write about the capacitor mod in the Earth HDAM. I've just done it, removing the grey/white caps too, and yes, there is an improvement, less harshness on the highs. I used the PIO 160v 1uF, don't know if I'm risking my amp.

Let's see if burn in improves the sound too.