[skeptic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cAsE sEnSiTiVe /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have the maxxed WA6....it's a great amp, but it still doesn't fix the inherent problems in the 701. The main problem is that it is simply too lean in the upper bass/lower mids. They rob music of presence, depth....the feeling that there is a hint of some real musical event going on. The 2nd issue, and one that is think is maybe present because of issue #1, is that the phones have an annoying peak in their frequency response in the uppermids/lower treble, i.e...the presence region. If there was a bit more foundation available in the lower registers, this might not be an issue. My ED9's and my Markl D5000's are infintely more enjoyable than my 701's..whether my stock or my ALO modded pair. Ken's re-cabling helped things somewhat, but didn't turn it into a can I could deal with as my regular headphone. So, I went shopping elsewhere....I really suggest the OP does the same.

Thanks for the thoughtful and detailed comment!

It shatters my illusion of the WA6 + K701 combo - but in a good, informative way. I'm eager to see how the K701 fans respond to this.

One question though, how much do you think your perception of the K701 is influenced by having really high end cans as your baseline? Or did you pick those up only after determining that the 701's just weren't going to do it for you?

Thanks again.

 

[riceboy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by skeptic /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks for the thoughtful and detailed comment! It shatters my illusion of the WA6 + K701 combo - but in a good, informative way. I'm eager to see how the K701 fans respond to this. One question though, how much do you think your perception of the K701 is influenced by having really high end cans as your baseline? Or did you pick those up only after determining that the 701's just weren't going to do it for you? Thanks again.

That's a good question. The K701s were one of my first high end cans that I owned. I eventually sold them and just brought them again. I know there are things I don't like about them, but there are things I like about them as well so I just use them for certain types of music. The one thing I've found in this hobby is that I moved on past the K701s and brought many cans and owned them for a while like HP2 x2, L3000s, and now the R10s and K1000s. Since moving through many different cans (they are in my profile), my tastes and what I hear have changed. Right now I'm perfectly happy with my DT990s at work, but at home I love the R10s with my rig. Also, when I first got the DT990 I really didn't like it at all, but with a new source and amp I'm happy with the sound from them. Everyone is just in a different phase or place in this hobby. I'm in a pretty comfortable place right now, but it seems you are just starting out. It's hard to say how you would feel if you heard another can with a different source or amp. If you can, I would own and try different cans and then see how you like them after a while. If that is an issue because of funding, then try to go to a meet or find a local audio store where you could audition the can (of course you will be hearing it on their equipment and not your own too), but at least you'll get a general feel for how the can sounds in regards to highs, mids, lows and sound stage. I wish you the best of luck on your journey as mine is constantly changing and evolving, but it's always been a fun ride for me.

 

[cAsE sEnSiTiVe]

Quote:

Originally Posted by skeptic /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks for the thoughtful and detailed comment! It shatters my illusion of the WA6 + K701 combo - but in a good, informative way. I'm eager to see how the K701 fans respond to this. One question though, how much do you think your perception of the K701 is influenced by having really high end cans as your baseline? Or did you pick those up only after determining that the 701's just weren't going to do it for you? Thanks again.

I started off with a stock pair of 701's. They were my first serious phone. At about the 400hr mark, and reading the positive comments of the phones coming alive with a re-cabling, I enlisted Ken @ ALO to work me up a second, new pair. 18awg, Jena cryo...the works.

While the results were an improvement in transparency, adding a bit more lower bass to the picture, as well as slightly removing a bit of the rise in the upper frequencies I previously mentioned, ultimately it didn't turn them into something they aren't....which is something I can live with on a regular basis.

At that point, I read what Markl was doing with the Denon cans, read the overwhelmingly positive comments on the result, and sight unheard, bought a stock pair and shipped them to Mark. When they returned, the very moment I put them on, mind you with very little burn-in time, it was a revelation compared to the AKG's. They are a VERY balanced headphone, much like a Vandersteen loudspeaker....for those that have heard them. These just do music.

While I was breaking in the Denon's, the deal on the Ultrasone's from Northern Sound was too good to pass up, so I bought a pair.

While these are my new reference phones, the denon's still get plenty of listening time, and are a very close runner up....which is a feat in itself, as it's damn near a 1/3rd of the price of the UE9's.

I am enlisting Stephen (thrice) @ Rockhopper to build me a balanced beta22. With that, and the possibility of some "Jam" mods to the WA6, I'll have some of the best of both SS & tubes at hand.

Since I have quite a bit of coin in them, I am going to keep the AKG's until such time as I can give them a dance with the Beta. If they don't improve in the areas I think they're lacking, then I will give up on them for good.

YMMV

 

[cAsE sEnSiTiVe]

Quote:

Originally Posted by riceboy /img/forum/go_quote.gif That's a good question. The K701s were one of my first high end cans that I owned. I eventually sold them and just brought them again. I know there are things I don't like about them, but there are things I like about them as well so I just use them for certain types of music. The one thing I've found in this hobby is that I moved on past the K701s and brought many cans and owned them for a while like HP2 x2, L3000s, and now the R10s and K1000s. Since moving through many different cans (they are in my profile), my tastes and what I hear have changed. Right now I'm perfectly happy with my DT990s at work, but at home I love the R10s with my rig. Also, when I first got the DT990 I really didn't like it at all, but with a new source and amp I'm happy with the sound from them. Everyone is just in a different phase or place in this hobby. I'm in a pretty comfortable place right now, but it seems you are just starting out. It's hard to say how you would feel if you heard another can with a different source or amp. If you can, I would own and try different cans and then see how you like them after a while. If that is an issue because of funding, then try to go to a meet or find a local audio store where you could audition the can (of course you will be hearing it on their equipment and not your own too), but at least you'll get a general feel for how the can sounds in regards to highs, mids, lows and sound stage. I wish you the best of luck on your journey as mine is constantly changing and evolving, but it's always been a fun ride for me.

excellent advice to heed...

 

[Pricklely Peete]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tfarney /img/forum/go_quote.gif You hear beaming in headphones? How's that work? OP - As Morpheus said to Neo, "How deep into the rabbit hole do you want to go?" You can take the blue pill and wake up to a pair of 701s for sale and a search for replacements that already sound good to you with the equipment you already have (have you tried HD595s? Dennons? Audio Technicas? ie: phones that are more efficient and more forward in presentation than 701s? An improvement upon, but not a complete departure from what you're used to?). You might even end up with some money in your pocket. Or you can take the red pill, put $500 - $1,000 into a beefy tube amp (red meat is expensive in TubeTown), maybe a few hundred more into re-cabling, and you may end up with headphones that sound good to you. Or maybe not. More power may open the 701s up a bit a low volumes, gain a bit more control over transients, etc. But it won't change the basic sound signature of the cans. They'll still be distant and analytical. The rabbit hole is deep. Tim

I like this man's thinking

Great post Tim !!!

Peete.

 

[majkel]

Till not so ancient past I was a real K701 hater. Now I can easily say they are good or maybe very good. Actually they need some juice from the headphone out to start to rock. So, a SS output in a hybrid or a SS amplifier is a good way to go. Say Cayin HA-1A or Bada PH-12 (if I get the type right) or some DIY. All the disadvantages I found in the K701's were due to their driver mounting, self-adjustable system. They were just going up my head slowly while the sound was getting worse. I hadn't realized that before the last meeting with my friends, and then found the sweet spot position over my ears and didn't let them go anywhere.

They sounded really nice, with quite a lot of body and authority in the bass. The soundstage also had a nice shape and imaging abilities. Maybe it was due to incomplete burn-in process but could they get worse?

 

[tinseljim]

Can I ask what opamp you have in the Zero Dac? If it is the stock one (which is OK) then can I suggest either a OPA627 or a LT1364? This has much improved warmth and depth of bass over the stock opamp IMO. Also soundstage opens up about 35 degrees!

James

 

[vvanrij]

35 degrees, that is correct

. Anyway, if possible try to listen to some other headphones on your current setting. I have listened to the K701 from an excellent source/amp and I just didn't like it, this is an option people, some people just don't like it.

 

[JMCIII]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kake /img/forum/go_quote.gif I’m currently the owner of a pair of k701, and I must say that they have yet to blow my mind away. I bought my k701 based on reviews (I KNOW it’s not the way to do it,, but never the less it’s done) Have read that they require many hours of burnin,, (And so I gave them that) I also have a some low-end cans (Hd280Pro,, (to dark and boomy),, HD555,, Ok but nothing more,, BT770Pro a bit bassy but I kind of like the sound,) Amps iBasso D1 (with upgraded opamps) and a Zero-Dac/Amp. Sources computer or an original A8 cd player. My “problem” with the k701 is that they (in my point of view and using my rig) lack dynamic.. Meaning I have to turn the volume knob higher than my ears (in the long run) considers healthy. Q: Can a dedicated desktop amp help me with my problem or should I go hunting for a new pair of cans (perhaps a DT880?) Witch entry level (read affordable) desktop amp can be recommended for the akg’s?

Here are a couple of options in solid state amps that should work well with your K701s and don't cost a bundle.

SoundStage! "All In Your Head" Back-Issue Article (5/2006)

SoundStage! "All In Your Head" Back-Issue Article (6/2006)

I'm sure you can find others too. But suffice to say you shouldn't have to spend a bundle to get the best out of your K701s.

 

[technobarbie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kake /img/forum/go_quote.gif I also have a some low-end cans (Hd280Pro,, (to dark and boomy),, HD555,, Ok but nothing more,, BT770Pro a bit bassy but I kind of like the sound,) Amps iBasso D1 (with upgraded opamps) and a Zero-Dac/Amp. Sources computer or an original A8 cd player.

Could it be that your more of a bass-head instead of an air-head? The K701's are air-head cans.

 

[Penchum]

The MOST important thing, is to buy headphones that are NOT lacking to begin with. They should present your audio from one end of the spectrum to the other and do so in such a way that you "hear" everything properly and it sounds great to you! Follow this, and you will be a happy camper.

Tried, Tested and True Audio rule of thumb:

You don't buy a system to make your headphones sound good. You buy headphones that will make your system sound good.

 

[Kake]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tinseljim /img/forum/go_quote.gif Can I ask what opamp you have in the Zero Dac? If it is the stock one (which is OK) then can I suggest either a OPA627 or a LT1364? This has much improved warmth and depth of bass over the stock opamp IMO. Also soundstage opens up about 35 degrees! James

Sure you can..
OPA627 in the Dac. LT1364/DY2000 in the amp.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMCIII /img/forum/go_quote.gif Here are a couple of options in solid state amps that should work well with your K701s and don't cost a bundle. SoundStage! "All In Your Head" Back-Issue Article (5/2006) SoundStage! "All In Your Head" Back-Issue Article (6/2006) I'm sure you can find others too. But suffice to say you shouldn't have to spend a bundle to get the best out of your K701s.

Will look into those,
affordable tubamp suggestions also interesting.

 

[tinseljim]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kake /img/forum/go_quote.gif Sure you can.. OPA627 in the Dac. LT1364/DY2000 in the amp.

Hmmm...it's the cans!

 

[Currawong]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cAsE sEnSiTiVe /img/forum/go_quote.gif I started off with a stock pair of 701's. They were my first serious phone. At about the 400hr mark, and reading the positive comments of the phones coming alive with a re-cabling, I enlisted Ken @ ALO to work me up a second, new pair. 18awg, Jena cryo...the works. While the results were an improvement in transparency, adding a bit more lower bass to the picture, as well as slightly removing a bit of the rise in the upper frequencies I previously mentioned, ultimately it didn't turn them into something they aren't....which is something I can live with on a regular basis. At that point, I read what Markl was doing with the Denon cans, read the overwhelmingly positive comments on the result, and sight unheard, bought a stock pair and shipped them to Mark. When they returned, the very moment I put them on, mind you with very little burn-in time, it was a revelation compared to the AKG's. They are a VERY balanced headphone, much like a Vandersteen loudspeaker....for those that have heard them. These just do music. While I was breaking in the Denon's, the deal on the Ultrasone's from Northern Sound was too good to pass up, so I bought a pair. While these are my new reference phones, the denon's still get plenty of listening time, and are a very close runner up....which is a feat in itself, as it's damn near a 1/3rd of the price of the UE9's. I am enlisting Stephen (thrice) @ Rockhopper to build me a balanced beta22. With that, and the possibility of some "Jam" mods to the WA6, I'll have some of the best of both SS & tubes at hand. Since I have quite a bit of coin in them, I am going to keep the AKG's until such time as I can give them a dance with the Beta. If they don't improve in the areas I think they're lacking, then I will give up on them for good. YMMV

I'm in exactly the same position as you, though I didn't have a stock pair of K701's to start with, only some time in a headphone shop giving me an idea of the sonic signature I wanted, which seemed most present in the K601. Quite a jump to get ALO 701's for me (albeit second-hand). I'm finding at the moment that the upper mids are too thin, and my UE 10 triple-fi's are more fun to listen to. A ZERO DAC, modded, has helped a lot, being more musical than my analytic Apogee Duet.

What you've described though about the markl Denon's sound exactly like the kind of can I want. Either those or re-cabled 780's. I can feel the UE9 creeping up on me and my wife murdering me.

 

[Kake]

Conclusion: I have ordered an Little Dott IV SE
If I still doesn't like the sound of the AKG's ill buy another pair