[roxrite]

I'm at the end-earphone show again and trying to compare between the two (LCD4 on my head as I type this having just left the Hifiman exhibit 3 mins ago.

It's a hard comparison at the show despite crowds subsiding. The main issue trying to compare is they driven very differently...the Susvara has hefty EF1000 amp whilst the LCD4 is being driven by a Luxman P-700U Amp (Audeze Deckard?? pre-amp? setup).

The Luxman is somewhat underpowered for this 200 ohm LCD4 too - I'm almost maxed out on volume here.

The Susvara seems to sound a little more visceral than the LCD4. Susvara sounds a little more open with the music room to breath too despite both open cans. The LCD4 has a bloom warmth to the sub-to-midbass.

To my ears the way the LCD4 is driven here by the Luxman, the LCD4 has more warmth.

Edit: just as the player moved to the next track which isn't mine, the sub bass of the LCD4 was deeeeeeeep though. Pity I didn't get to test the this with the Susvara.

Thanks a lot.
It really depends on the amp thats true.
You can take away susvaras air easily with a worse amp.
On the other hand i experienced great soundstage with the audeze the king amp paired with the lcd 4.

 

[AnakChan]

I'm at the end-earphone show again and trying to compare between the two (LCD4 on my head as I type this having just left the Hifiman exhibit 3 mins ago.

It's a hard comparison at the show despite crowds subsiding. The main issue trying to compare is they driven very differently...the Susvara has hefty EF1000 amp whilst the LCD4 is being driven by a Luxman P-700U Amp (Audeze Deckard?? pre-amp? setup).

The Luxman is somewhat underpowered for this 200 ohm LCD4 too - I'm almost maxed out on volume here.

The Susvara seems to sound a little more visceral than the LCD4. Susvara sounds a little more open with the music room to breath too despite both open cans. The LCD4 has a bloom warmth to the sub-to-midbass.

To my ears the way the LCD4 is driven here by the Luxman, the LCD4 has more warmth.

Edit: just as the player moved to the next track which isn't mine, the sub bass of the LCD4 was deeeeeeeep though. Pity I didn't get to test the this with the Susvara.

It would have been great if I could have picked up that LCD4 and walked over to the Hickman booth and plug the LCD4 into the EF1000 but somehow, I don't think either exhibitors would be impressed . The LCD4 was really underwhelmed by the Luxman - the GSX II was just in the booth opposite - so close yet to far.

Edit: Apologies, I did try to make a comparison despite it being a somewhat meaningless one.

 

[336881]

You are completely wrong about the R-10! Hands down... it is worth 4K and above.

The concept, the presentation, the details that went into it is ground breaking. The light weight feeling and the woodie earcups screams excellent.
The soft fluffy pushy earpads makes the R-10 the most comfortable headphone ever made.
The soft excellent light weight cable with its Y-split is just perfect.

The leather case Box, red interior, keys and booklet is a great touch of premium quality.

The feeling of putting it on and almost forgetting its even on is just great.

And than the SOUND! The most natural, organic, musical, down to earth warm humanly possible sound that it produce can not be match.
Everything sounds natural and real, nothing fake or artificial. Nothing lacking. And yes it has bass you bass junkies out there! A natural bass that excell to greatness.

All hail Kings of Kings the mighty R-10

$4k maybe, $5k is pushing it and they better be mint. The speaker equivalent of the R10, the SS-GR1's are for sale on ebay right now for $28k, retailed for $20k and they are just sitting there from a buyer (slex) who is pretty well known for being a bit over priced. He will get $15-20k if he is lucky. I know some people will say the SS-R10's are the speaker equal but that was a Stat where the GR1's are bio like the R10.

Could you make the argument that once you buy the R10 you could listen to it and sell it for what you paid for it, yeah. There is also the chance you get a $10k doorstop and that has happened to several members or even worse get ripped off completely and receive nothing.

Most of what I listened to nowadays is vintage Sony so I am more than aware of just how good their stuff was/ still is today.

I like headphones but this price wars that are going on today and many times their original retail vintage phones is making this more and more a hobby I stop caring about.

 

[jlbrach]

I got a chance to sample the susvara at canjam in NYC....it is a noisy environment so obviously i couldnt do real critical listening but my brief take was underwhelming and disappointing...I owned the HE1000v2 which i very much enjoyed and there is no way I would pay twice the 3K for these new ones..not a chance...I recently got my abyss 1266 upgraded to the new Phi drivers and to my ears it is the best HP available today,simply stunning....if you can get used to the build it is for me fantastic

 

[AnakChan]

I got a chance to sample the susvara at canjam in NYC....it is a noisy environment so obviously i couldnt do real critical listening but my brief take was underwhelming and disappointing...I owned the HE1000v2 which i very much enjoyed and there is no way I would pay twice the 3K for these new ones..not a chance...I recently got my abyss 1266 upgraded to the new Phi drivers and to my ears it is the best HP available today,simply stunning....if you can get used to the build it is for me fantastic

What was it driven by? I'm beginning to feel the Susvara's performance varies greatly depending on how it's driven.

 

[Stars700]

I'm the past few days I've been talking to Hifiman about a Susvara loaner however it seems my Eddie Current ZDSE ain't gonna cut it as the Susvara is quite demanding. I was told that even something like the Eddie Current Balancing Act may not have sufficient juice to drive it properly. Although o have a McIntosh MC275 & with the HE Adapter it would work, Hifiman is not certain how the synergy is between the two.

I was recommended the likes Hifiman EF1000 that's what I tried at the e-earphone show this weekend at the Hifiman exhibit. The EF1000 was massive! Although the show was crowded and noisy pumping up the volume a little more did show the Susvara was scalable to bigger and amps.

Preliminary thoughts are that for one to actually get the Susvara to perform, one would need to invest in a decent powerful amp. Extending @Edwood's post about comparing the costs of the a decent Susvara setup the Stax rig, it would seem to me that to start to get the Susvara to perform, would be close to the cost of a alreadty ToTL Stax SR-009/BHSE rig.

Waiting for review

 

[protoss]

$4k maybe, $5k is pushing it and they better be mint. The speaker equivalent of the R10, the SS-GR1's are for sale on ebay right now for $28k, retailed for $20k and they are just sitting there from a buyer (slex) who is pretty well known for being a bit over priced. He will get $15-20k if he is lucky. I know some people will say the SS-R10's are the speaker equal but that was a Stat where the GR1's are bio like the R10.

Could you make the argument that once you buy the R10 you could listen to it and sell it for what you paid for it, yeah. There is also the chance you get a $10k doorstop and that has happened to several members or even worse get ripped off completely and receive nothing.

Most of what I listened to nowadays is vintage Sony so I am more than aware of just how good their stuff was/ still is today.

I like headphones but this price wars that are going on today and many times their original retail vintage phones is making this more and more a hobby I stop caring about.

I have to congrats you for highlighting a masterpiece as the Sony SS-GR1 !


But let's get to it... (I wish that we could of discuss this somewhere else, because Susvara is a meh headphone....) :/


I will not call the SS-R10 or the GR1 the R-10 equal. The SS-R10 a one man project created in 1995 that took very old electrostatic ideas/theories and applied it to the speaker.
Btw It is also a masterpiece ! ( my god how many masterpiece has Sony created!, back in the day!)

The speaker equalivent to the R-10 is the groundbreaking SS-A5 speaker that was release along with the R-10 in 1989. Uses the same bio-cellulose but a higher advance version of it. The SS-A5 originally had the bio first and than other speakers adopted it.

I consider the SS-A5 speaker one of the 3 greatest speakers ever created !

Back to R-10, yes it is very hard to find a mint version and a properly working version and also not get a defect version. But as a standalone properly working headphone it is well worth the price tag. I pretty much don't need to contuine with the R-10 because I have an idea that you do appreciate it nonetheless.

Cheers

 

[jlbrach]

i do not remember the amp used in the set up at the show but i have to believe it was considered a good match because fang himself showed it to me and had me listen to it

 

[mulder01]

This one?

Surely HiFiMan wouldn't be showing it with anything else

 

[jlbrach]

could be,i do not remember

 

[Whazzzup]

It was something else for me, but I'm picking up the loner this Saturday so see what's what on my rig.

 

[336881]

I have to congrats you for highlighting a masterpiece as the Sony SS-GR1 !


But let's get to it... (I wish that we could of discuss this somewhere else, because Susvara is a meh headphone....) :/


I will not call the SS-R10 or the GR1 the R-10 equal. The SS-R10 a one man project created in 1995 that took very old electrostatic ideas/theories and applied it to the speaker.
Btw It is also a masterpiece ! ( my god how many masterpiece has Sony created!, back in the day!)

The speaker equalivent to the R-10 is the groundbreaking SS-A5 speaker that was release along with the R-10 in 1989. Uses the same bio-cellulose but a higher advance version of it. The SS-A5 originally had the bio first and than other speakers adopted it.

I consider the SS-A5 speaker one of the 3 greatest speakers ever created !

Back to R-10, yes it is very hard to find a mint version and a properly working version and also not get a defect version. But as a standalone properly working headphone it is well worth the price tag. I pretty much don't need to contuine with the R-10 because I have an idea that you do appreciate it nonetheless.

Cheers

La Voce's? I read really good things about them and APM-77w's on the Vintage Knob. Seemed to me to be his two favorites. There is/was a pair of ss-g777es' on yahoo japan. You could get all 3 speaker sets for what a Susvara costs if you were patient enough. As for the R10 I think we will just have to agree to disagree or maybe I will hear one for myself one day and change my mind. Really love my APM 4's though. I know it is different experiences but using the APM 4's as a $4k measuring stick any $4k headphone is going to have a very tough go. The hd800 and 007mk1 are also really exceptional for allot less than $4k.

 

[up late]

have the power requirements to adequately drive the susvara been determined yet?

 

[Currawong]

They sounded highly dynamic out of the EF1000 in Tokyo, where there wasn't much noise. I wonder if they will power from the Vidar, which was just announced.

 

[AnakChan]

They sounded highly dynamic out of the EF1000 in Tokyo, where there wasn't much noise. I wonder if they will power from the Vidar, which was just announced.

I wonder if the Phatlab Sassy II SET Portable amp can drive the Susvara to a satisfactory (not expecting wonderful or ideal) level.