[conquerator2]

The R2R11 is very good though... It's a very good match for most headphones and I don't see what a relatively reference HD650 needs that the R2R11 doesn't have?

 

[yaby1979]

It is not adequate amp for HD650/6XX.
For example when i owned HD650 i used 2 amps ss - Musical Fidelity M1hpa and tube amp Little Dot Mk3 upgraded with C3g+6SN7 and even if the MF is a v.transparent amp when i moved on LD the difference was obvious-bigger more 3D stage,mids to die for plus crystal clear highs,and keep in mind that LD it is not the last word on tube amps ,there are many better amps.

This isn't the HD-650 thread

 

[SilverEars]

From what I gather, the emphasis of sibilant treble is chaaa sounds(overall there really isn't strong treble qualities anyways). I think it's 6k, but overall smooth treble besides recordings that shows this treble. I think these could use a bit of bass punch to increase dynamic feel.

It does sound a bit like HEK, but HEK has more depth with better sub-bass extension, and better dynamics for significant bass dynamic tracks(in comparison, Sundara scales lower in bass dynamics, but mid-bass characterization is similar, not so forward).

So, two things that can improve these. Greater scale of bass dynamics and mid lift. But, I like the overall smooth treble(ignoring a bit of 6k emphasis I hear now,I'm hearing after break-in of the drivers) and overall balanced sig that is a bit laid back, not forward or that punchy. If you like more forward aggressive with punchy overall dynamics, these probably won't suit your taste.

I think overall, the definition of sounds are a bit lacking. Although the treble sounds smooth, I don't think the sounds are as much defined as should be. It maybe caused by inoffensive tuning of it that some necessary sounds that should be a bit forward, isn't. Such as the mids for example. I would say coherency or articulation can be fine tuned, sounds doesn't have that distinctness(for something like rock, with a bit much going on in sounds, a congestion, but rock recordings can be like this and degree can vary), but can sound a bit blended. I guess this goes against separation.

Based on the volume I use them at High gain, these are not really all that efficient. I doubt that these can be driven well out of portable players.

 

[SilverEars]

If you listen to music with a bit of congestion, there's a bit of blend of sounds for something like rock. If you listen to something like an acoustical live recording like Eric Clapton Unplugged or Jazz at the Pawnshop, the recording is pretty well separated due to the way the instrumentments are quite distinct sounding types anyways. No wonder audiophiles like them. These types of recordings are just generally well separated due to the recordings.

Hopefully, these impressions may change for the better and it still has not broken-in fully. I don't know.

 

[Light - Man]

^ Sliver-Ears thanks for your thoughts but a little too late for me as my pair are on the way and I should have them by Saturday.

Hopefully with continued burn-in they will improve for you, so keep us posted.

I think I have read that they take 150 hours burn-in. (damned if you do, damned if you don't).

I will make a comparison with the Fidelio X2 I still have and find very versatile.

P.S. what are you pairing it with?

 

[bobbyblack]

This isn't the HD-650 thread

Comparisons were made with HD650 /6XX...

 

[SilverEars]

^ Sliver-Ears thanks for your thoughts but a little too late for me as my pair are on the way and I should have them by Saturday.

Hopefully with continued burn-in they will improve for you, so keep us posted.

I think I have read that they take 150 hours burn-in. (damned if you do, damned if you don't).

I will make a comparison with the Fidelio X2 I still have and find very versatile.

P.S. what are you pairing it with?

As I try out various recording genres, my impressions change. Some recordings that have a less dynamics, these headphones seem to lower it more than it should. But, it sounds pretty dynamic with recording that puts it out. With modern tracks, it does put out good amount of bass. Overall for the price, good performing headphones.

I'm really confusing myself as I try various recording types, some of them sounds more dynamic over others, and can't say it's generally a narrowly dynamic headphone. I think the bass sounds quite good and tight, and you can hear the rumble when the track pushes. It's not lacking in bass it seems. I'm listening to bass out of electronic genre and it sounds quite good and tight with good amount of weight. It maybe that with modern electronic music it puts out more dynamism.

I could see why impressions are all over the place for these headphones. Sound seems recording dependent and we try out different recordings. I'm realizing It's hard to figure out besides about the recessed mids.

 

[SilverEars]

When I listen to deadmau5, I hear significant bass, and it's very responsive and tight. I know deadmau5 recordings pushes a bit of bass. It's definitely not lacking bass. Just fine the way in the level of bass. It can be punchy when the track pushes it out. It performs very good with electronic music sounds just like HEK. Very quick and responsive with deadmau5 recordings.

 

[heliosphann]

When I listen to deadmau5, I hear significant bass, and it's very responsive and tight. I know deadmau5 recordings pushes a bit of bass. It's definitely not lacking bass. Just fine the way in the level of bass. It can be punchy when the track pushes it out. It performs very good with electronic music sounds just like HEK. Very quick and responsive with deadmau5 recordings.

I'm not going to comment too much on them yet, but one aspect that has impressed me greatly is the Bass. To be more specific, the low end extension and quality. In this regard it reminds me of the HEK. It reaches down almost as effortlessly and has a very clean, detailed bass presentation. I consider that high praise as the HEK is still my favorite planar in terms of subbass quality.

 

[Anaz]

...,

Thanks for the comparison to the HE-560. Which do you think handles classical music better?

Unfortunately I no longer have the HE-560 for a direct comparison. If you want my opinion, if you’re perfectly happy with the HE-560, I would holdout for something else. The HE-560 was the best sounding headphone I owned (and I loved them), but I liked the Sundara more because I prefer a flatter sound signature (a mild V actually) and because 560’s yolk has a penchant for breaking.

When I was doing my comparison, I kept thinking that the Sundara was a great upgrade to HD 6XX, so if I may conjecture to describe the Sundara sound based on 2 day old memory: think of HD 650’s sound profile, add a little treble, add bass extension, and add the width and detail of the HE-560.

I hope this helps.

 

[SilverEars]

Yeah, it seems an upgrade to HD650(or HD6XX) and maybe even HD600, so I guess the price-point works.

 

[ra990]

Been following this thread for a while. I returned my HE560 and HEXv2 in hopes that the Sundara might be a good alternative. I'm pretty interested in how it compares to the HEXv2 if anyone has both. That was a really nice headphone, I liked the open, airy soundstage, and the warm laid back sound. How do these compare to those? I'm seeing a lot of comparisons against the HEK, which sound too good to be true, I think realistically it is probably closer to the HEXv2, right?

 

[SilverEars]

It's no replacement for HEK. HEK is definately an upgrade in every way.

 

[bradbort]

Aside form the improved sound quality, here is an experiential vote for the improved build quality of the Sundara.

I had a pair of 400i, who’s U yokes snapped for no apparent reason. It was actually quite an issue to get them repaired, since they were out of warranty.

Recently my new Sundara was pulled off of its stand on a table by a roomba. It fell a few feet onto a wood floor, and was dragged a few feet. They are still in excellent shape. No visible scratches or damage at all. Of course, they still sound great!

 

[zodiac1234]

TIPS ON SUNDARA:

■ - LOTS of burn-in. 100 h at least
■ - Change cable immediately
■ - Use balanced cable & amp
■ - Pad roll
■ - Sounds Better with Push Pull amps amps