[RadiatedAnt]

I felt the same way! They do music justice, it's just your crappy audio source! After I fed it through my fiio e18 kunlun it turned into a completely different beast!

 

[ankurjhunjhunwala]

  I felt the same way! They do music justice, it's just your crappy audio source! After I fed it through my fiio e18 kunlun it turned into a completely different beast!

+1 .. With Nexus 5 and Spotify 320 kbps they sounded good, but now with ipod 5.5g + C5D and apple lossless they sound phenomenal..

 

[marctwo]

  +1 .. With Nexus 5 and Spotify 320 kbps they sounded good, but now with ipod 5.5g + C5D and apple lossless they sound phenomenal..

 
Oddly, I actually felt they sounded better with Spotify than Apple Lossless through my iPhone.

 

[modulor]

  I just got a pair of RE-400s after 6 years with my trusty Sennheiser cx-500s. I've owned a low end pair of Shures (broke) and even some Monoprice 8320 (just don't fit me) but I always came back to the cx-500s.
 
After getting my RE--400s I must say I am disappointed. All the reviews were great but maybe I am doing something wrong?
 
So far they have had 10 hours of pink noise burn-in. I spent a long time trying all the tips but ended up using the silicone tips from the sennheisers. I don't find the RE-400s nearly as comfortable and they move around a lot in my ear and I am constantly adjusting them.
 
Some tracks sound great and others terrible. I listen mostly to electronica, drum'n'bass and techno and sometimes the bass is good and other times it seems to be totally lacking. They don't seem to have much sound-stage and I find them harder to drive than the cx-500s.
 
Does anyone have any advice? Do they need more burn-in time? Should I try different tips again?

Well, a good seal for one is critical for bass response, thus it's important to get tips that fit and seal well...a deeper insertion yields better results too.  Beyond that, I agree with tinyman in that these are definitely more neutral than anything, with more forward mids (which tends to give a more relaxed presentation in contrast to a V-shaped or Warm signature with more bass and treble emphasis).  You may want to try foam tips, but these will never be really bass heavy.  Possibly with some modding...but even then I still would call it just slightly warmer.  For my tastes, they're good for most electronic music but they will present bass as it is in the recording more often that not, and never over-exaggerate it or add in extra warmth.  They're also not a particularly warm headphone in general, but I would say the soundstage is above average in size (perceptively less so because of the forward mids).  They are higher impedance than the CX500 (50Ohm vs 16Ohm) so they'll be a bit harder to drive from some devices...though even the lower power Clip+ drives the RE-400 to pretty loud volumes easily from my experience.
 
Physical burn-in isn't going to do much, 'brain burn-in' however where you're getting adjusted to a new signature is most likely going to make a bigger change.  Give them some exclusive time, then go back to your CX500 after a week.  Also try different tips with a more narrow bore hole (like Sony Hybrids) if the stock tips aren't fitting well...and if you're handy, you can perform some simple damping mods to bring the FR below 1kHz more forward (highlighted in the comparison link below).  Due to your musical tastes and the fact that you find them lacking in bass in some cases though, I would recommend checking out some other IEMs.  This guide is pretty helpful in putting different signatures into perspective and links to full reviews: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/ I would suggest looking at the Warm and Smooth and V-Shaped categories and researching from there.  I did a little comparison of the RE-400 to the EPH-100 and I would say the latter definitely sounds like it'd be more suited to your tastes (or that type of signature rather).
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/704091/hifiman-re-400-or-yamaha-eph-100
 
I personally would recommend checking out the SteelSeries Flux for ~$50 or the Yamaha EPH-100 for $100+ for electronic genres depending on budget, and if possible compare them directly to the RE-400.

 

[marctwo]

  Well, a good seal for one is critical for bass response, thus it's important to get tips that fit and seal well...a deeper insertion yields better results too.  Beyond that, I agree with tinyman in that these are definitely more neutral than anything, with more forward mids (which tends to give a more relaxed presentation in contrast to a V-shaped or Warm signature with more bass and treble emphasis).  You may want to try foam tips, but these will never be really bass heavy.  Possibly with some modding...but even then I still would call it just slightly warmer.  For my tastes, they're good for most electronic music but they will present bass as it is in the recording more often that not, and never over-exaggerate it or add in extra warmth.  They're also not a particularly warm headphone in general, but I would say the soundstage is above average in size (perceptively less so because of the forward mids).  They are higher impedance than the CX500 (50Ohm vs 16Ohm) so they'll be a bit harder to drive from some devices...though even the lower power Clip+ drives the RE-400 to pretty loud volumes easily from my experience.
 
Physical burn-in isn't going to do much, 'brain burn-in' however where you're getting adjusted to a new signature is most likely going to make a bigger change.  Give them some exclusive time, then go back to your CX500 after a week.  Also try different tips with a more narrow bore hole (like Sony Hybrids) if the stock tips aren't fitting well...and if you're handy, you can perform some simple damping mods to bring the FR below 1kHz more forward (highlighted in the comparison link below).  Due to your musical tastes and the fact that you find them lacking in bass in some cases though, I would recommend checking out some other IEMs.  This guide is pretty helpful in putting different signatures into perspective and links to full reviews: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/ I would suggest looking at the Warm and Smooth and V-Shaped categories and researching from there.  I did a little comparison of the RE-400 to the EPH-100 and I would say the latter definitely sounds like it'd be more suited to your tastes (or that type of signature rather).
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/704091/hifiman-re-400-or-yamaha-eph-100
 
I personally would recommend checking out the SteelSeries Flux for ~$50 or the Yamaha EPH-100 for $100+ for electronic genres depending on budget, and if possible compare them directly to the RE-400.

 
Thank you, some very good suggestions there.
 
I wear them the same way as the CX500s, very shallow using the medium tips. If I insert then any deeper I find pressure in my ear and they sound terrible. Maybe this is where I am going wrong?
 
The bass does sound ok with some tracks and not so much with others. I'll keep trying different things and see if I can improve the situation.
 
I did look at the Yamahas and the RHAs but was put off by the V shaped response, I really did want something more accurate. Maybe I was wrong.

 

[Tom22]

Thank you, some very good suggestions there.

I wear them the same way as the CX500s, very shallow using the medium tips. If I insert then any deeper I find pressure in my ear and they sound terrible. Maybe this is where I am going wrong?

The bass does sound ok with some tracks and not so much with others. I'll keep trying different things and see if I can improve the situation.

I did look at the Yamahas and the RHAs but was put off by the V shaped response, I really did want something more accurate. Maybe I was wrong.

The re400s are actually meant for deep insertion, thats why they made the body so small as well. But again as stated earlier, the re400s wouldnt be my first recommendation electronic music. I actually find the re400 very forgiving of the source, it never gets harsh or anything (the treble extends tremendously).

But again if you want more bass try narrower tips like the sony hybrids, i even went as far as to mash my oval klipsch tips (very narrow opening) you could try ur shure tips. But deep insertion is a must for the re400, their a bit bass light as it is.

I actually use smaller tips if i want more bass for it to get in deeper, but i heard others say differently.

 

[marctwo]

The re400s are actually meant for deep insertion, thats why they made the body so small as well. But again as stated earlier, the re400s wouldnt be my first recommendation electronic music. I actually find the re400 very forgiving of the source, it never gets harsh or anything (the treble extends tremendously).

But again if you want more bass try narrower tips like the sony hybrids, i even went as far as to mash my oval klipsch tips (very narrow opening) you could try ur shure tips. But deep insertion is a must for the re400, their a bit bass light as it is.

I actually use smaller tips if i want more bass for it to get in deeper, but i heard others say differently.

 
I tried the smaller tips and putting them deeper but couldn't get a good seal. I'll keep experimenting, thank you.

 

[Tom22]

I tried the smaller tips and putting them deeper but couldn't get a good seal. I'll keep experimenting, thank you.

Yea keep trying! When i take out my re400sci use the gr07 larger black tips, theres a suction effect. The sony hybrids could be a good idea the silcone the use is very "suctiony" if they makes sense. , since u already bought it might as well experiment rather than get something else so soon. Good luck!

 

[modulor]

   
Thank you, some very good suggestions there.
 
I wear them the same way as the CX500s, very shallow using the medium tips. If I insert then any deeper I find pressure in my ear and they sound terrible. Maybe this is where I am going wrong?
 
The bass does sound ok with some tracks and not so much with others. I'll keep trying different things and see if I can improve the situation.
 
I did look at the Yamahas and the RHAs but was put off by the V shaped response, I really did want something more accurate. Maybe I was wrong.

If you're using medium size tips, try the small double-flange tips that come with the RE-400 (I think they come pre-installed) as those have the most narrow bore.  Those are kind of designed for a relatively shallow fit, but even if they're not the most comfortable, see if that makes a positive difference sound-wise to you...it should elevate the bass a bit due to the narrower opening.  I will say tip rolling will only take you so far, but it's worth an investigation.  Sony Hybrids are good to try too.
 
There are pretty neutral options out there that have bigger bass body, more lushness and more slam (relatively speaking) or I guess you can say different degres of neutral.  For example, I own the Flux and it's not quite as refined as the RE-400 but it's definitely a more engaging, warmer listen and a more ideal choice for electronic in some cases (or for some preferences).  The EPH-100 is actually pretty neutral, just with a bass boost in the lower registers...I never felt they were truly v-shaped, rather the bass/mids are relatively balanced with one another and the treble is smooth behind them (hence warm/smooth category in joker's writeup) so more of a natural downward slope.  Some will find this a more natural presentation overall and more accurate, and I can definitely agree with that...it can paint a more realistic image in some genres.  I personally have the RE-400 now primarily for vocals and acoustic tracks...it's a great all-arounder but on the more relaxed, less engaging side of that and is best suited for those types of music IMO, while not entirely lacking in others...it's all about the mids.
 
The measurement can be deceptive though comparing directly to those of the RE-400, but I can say there is audibly less sub-bass reverberance in the RE-400 even though it goes down low (similar to how some single/dual BA IEMs sound).  The bass is pretty big and fun on the EPH-100 but without drowning out any other frequencies, as well presented forward bass should be (you don't want muddiness of course) and you can feel the bass (adds a sense of sub-bass realism).  The RHAs are similar, with more of a downward slope so that they're warm with more forward sub-bass but also has a smooth signature overall.  Joker's writeup on the MA750 has some comparison to the RE-400 so you can see where each pair's merits lie...I'd say that they're on par from a technical standpoint, with different presentations: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/rha-ma750-ma750i/ Same can be said from my (and his) assessment of the EPH-100...these are still not true 'basshead' levels of bass, but you get a better sense of proper bass presentation, at the cost of changing the FR slightly.  This is one reason I encourage people to try out different things, because at least in my journey it's taken a few tries to find out what balance is best suited for me...and my favorite IEM to date is the BA200 

 but the RE-400 still has it's place in my collection.

 

[Tom22]

  If you're using medium size tips, try the small double-flange tips that come with the RE-400 (I think they come pre-installed) as those have the most narrow bore.  Those are kind of designed for a relatively shallow fit, but even if they're not the most comfortable, see if that makes a positive difference sound-wise to you...it should elevate the bass a bit due to the narrower opening.  I will say tip rolling will only take you so far, but it's worth an investigation.  Sony Hybrids are good to try too.
 
There are pretty neutral options out there that have bigger bass body, more lushness and more slam (relatively speaking) or I guess you can say different degres of neutral.  For example, I own the Flux and it's not quite as refined as the RE-400 but it's definitely a more engaging, warmer listen and a more ideal choice for electronic in some cases (or for some preferences).  The EPH-100 is actually pretty neutral, just with a bass boost in the lower registers...I never felt they were truly v-shaped, rather the bass/mids are relatively balanced with one another and the treble is smooth behind them (hence warm/smooth category in joker's writeup) so more of a natural downward slope.  Some will find this a more natural presentation overall and more accurate, and I can definitely agree with that...it can paint a more realistic image in some genres.  I personally have the RE-400 now primarily for vocals and acoustic tracks...it's a great all-arounder but on the more relaxed, less engaging side of that and is best suited for those types of music IMO, while not entirely lacking in others...it's all about the mids.
 
The measurement can be deceptive though comparing directly to those of the RE-400, but I can say there is audibly less sub-bass reverberance in the RE-400 even though it goes down low (similar to how some single/dual BA IEMs sound).  The bass is pretty big and fun on the EPH-100 but without drowning out any other frequencies, as well presented forward bass should be (you don't want muddiness of course) and you can feel the bass (adds a sense of sub-bass realism).  The RHAs are similar, with more of a downward slope so that they're warm with more forward sub-bass but also has a smooth signature overall.  Joker's writeup on the MA750 has some comparison to the RE-400 so you can see where each pair's merits lie...I'd say that they're on par from a technical standpoint, with different presentations: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/rha-ma750-ma750i/ Same can be said from my (and his) assessment of the EPH-100...these are still not true 'basshead' levels of bass, but you get a better sense of proper bass presentation, at the cost of changing the FR slightly.  This is one reason I encourage people to try out different things, because at least in my journey it's taken a few tries to find out what balance is best suited for me...and my favorite IEM to date is the BA200 

 but the RE-400 still has it's place in my collection.

of course! i'm just saying tip rolling is relatively cheap way to eq the sound and comfort welll cheaper than buying a new iem (where i get my stuff theres no refund soo your kinda stuck if you don't like it). plus you'll always need more tips right ?! =) 

 

[marctwo]

  If you're using medium size tips, try the small double-flange tips that come with the RE-400 (I think they come pre-installed) as those have the most narrow bore.  Those are kind of designed for a relatively shallow fit, but even if they're not the most comfortable, see if that makes a positive difference sound-wise to you...it should elevate the bass a bit due to the narrower opening.  I will say tip rolling will only take you so far, but it's worth an investigation.  Sony Hybrids are good to try too.

 
I tried these and they are ok. I have to insert them slighly deeper to get a good seal, but they sound ok. I find them rather uncomfortable though. With the medium tips, I can get a good seal and they do have a reasonable amount of bass, but the fit is so delicate and I keep having to re-adjust them.
 
I don't really want to give up on these as they are clearly good, but if I can't get a comfortable fit then it might be my only choice. If it does come to this, does anyone have any recommendations for around the same price as the RE-400s? I like tight bass and sparkly treble. This would be a good example of the kind of thing I listen to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5cFa3qqF-s

 

[modulor]

   
I tried these and they are ok. I have to insert them slighly deeper to get a good seal, but they sound ok. I find them rather uncomfortable though. With the medium tips, I can get a good seal and they do have a reasonable amount of bass, but the fit is so delicate and I keep having to re-adjust them.
 
I don't really want to give up on these as they are clearly good, but if I can't get a comfortable fit then it might be my only choice. If it does come to this, does anyone have any recommendations for around the same price as the RE-400s? I like tight bass and sparkly treble. This would be a good example of the kind of thing I listen to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5cFa3qqF-s

In that price-range for that criteria there's the Vsonic GR07 Classic, which are currently $100.  They'll be a bit bassier and a bit more sparkly, but have a tendency to emphasize sibilance in recordings (I didn't like that trait myself but others are OK with it).  The Vsonic is still quite neutral, just slightly more forward bass and more sparkly treble, less forward mids than the RE-400 comparatively.  I'd call it a different flavor of neutral.  The GR07 tends to sound wider in soundstage, but not quite as deep as a result.  Since you like the presentation of the RE-400, my first recommendation would be the TDK BA200 but it has unfortunately been discontinued, so finding a new pair in that price range may be difficult.  Periodically they show up on Ebay/Amazon used in good condition for about $100-$120, but to get the best out of them you need a deeper fit and certain tips (foams, particularly Shure Olives work the best I find) so there's a bit more investment there.  On those, there is a bit more mid-bass and impact vs the RE-400 (though a tad less than the GR07) and a bit more sparkle with a slight tendency at exaggerating sibilance, but IMO less so than the GR07.  The BA200 tends to be the smoothest of the three, except for the treble region where the RE-400 wins out.  Plus, they are a bit fuller sounding than both RE-400 and GR07, thicker of note especially in the midrange.
 
Reviews:
http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/hifiman-re-400-waterline/
http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/vsonic-gr07/
http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/tdk-ba200/
Measurements:
http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2013/03/hifiman-re-400-evolution-or-devolution.html
http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2012/10/vsonic-gr07-mkii.html
http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2013/04/tdk-ba200.html
 
You can see how similar they are to one another 

 just little differences here and there in presentation.

 

[gnarlsagan]

Great post modular. I'd add that the Zero Audio Tenore is a very likely candidate at about $60 shipped. A few of us consider it top tier against any price range.

 

[Tom22]

   
I tried these and they are ok. I have to insert them slighly deeper to get a good seal, but they sound ok. I find them rather uncomfortable though. With the medium tips, I can get a good seal and they do have a reasonable amount of bass, but the fit is so delicate and I keep having to re-adjust them.
 
I don't really want to give up on these as they are clearly good, but if I can't get a comfortable fit then it might be my only choice. If it does come to this, does anyone have any recommendations for around the same price as the RE-400s? I like tight bass and sparkly treble. This would be a good example of the kind of thing I listen to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5cFa3qqF-s

i actually own both the re400 and the vsonic gr07 BE now the be edition is more expensive but it does have the extra bass response (despite its name its nowhere near basshead category) its more than re400 by a bit but its mindblowingly fast and tight, the extra bass it has over the mk2 supposedly is on the midbass only otherwise identical
 
the mids are a bit pushed back (but just by a hair) i really didn't notice until i a/b them back and forth for a good 15 minutes of hard core concentrating. but otherwise beautiful and clear. the mid are similar to the re400s in that its lean sounding which helps with its transparency (not as transparent as the re400 because of the bass boost but still top notch).
 
the treble is sparkly and dry and well extended, it is a bit siblant. i noticed this at first but its not siblant to the point where its ear piercing, its just more so than the re400 which has a impossibly smooth treble response
 
i actually find the re400 seems to extend farther (notice i said seem because of the extra emphasis the vsonic gr07 be has on the lower treble) but both extend very well
 
sound stage the gr07 is definitely wider abeit a bit more diffuse sounding. so in terms of layering its not as good as the re400
 
even though i've never tried the vsonic gr07 classic i think its a worthwhile try because vsonic was daring enough to replace a head-fi and china favorite, it can't disappoint
 
but the gr07 be is still being produced (the people of china demanded it and vsonic responded ) =) 
 
and lastly i would like just like to let you know, if my gr07be dies one day, i will get another pair! i might buy another one a few years down the road (or recable mines) they will be by my side for a long long time

 

[modulor]

Great post modular. I'd add that the Zero Audio Tenore is a very likely candidate at about $60 shipped. A few of us consider it top tier against any price range.

That is one I really need to hear, as it seems the more recent Zero Audio models (this one in particular) are gaining some traction and popularity as being a big bang for buck.  I know Inks likes the Tenore and I trust his opinion, plus they seem to measure quite well:
 
http://www.geocities.jp/ryumatsuba/zh-dx200-ct.html 
 
Hmm...I may have to check these out now after a little bit of reading lol