[n99127]

I personally think that the HE-1000 sounds great out of the Hugo. However, the extra power of something like...say the EF-6, does make it better. I find that, on the Chord Hugo, I keep pushing the volume knob higher and higher because I'm trying to hear the finer details...which I can never quite get unless I reach uncomfortably high volumes on the Hugo. I'm not sure if it's a psychological thing, but that's my perspective on the issue .
 
I think the HD800 is pretty comparable to the HE-1000. The only issue for me there is that it's rather finicky with amp selection (not exactly new information there). Straight out of the Hugo, it sounds pretty meh...My amp of choice is the SPL Phonitor. I use a Benchmark 2 DAC connected to the Phonitor to listen to my HD800. This is my chosen setup for listening to classical music at my computer when I'm too lazy to head into the other room to use my SR-009 system.
 
EDIT:
 
I think the HE-1000 is brilliant for the fact that it sounds pretty good out of just a Hugo, making it an ideal backpack headphone that I can take to work to listen (note that I didn't say portable, I certainly wouldn't use it while going to work!). It's certainly more convenient as an office headphone than the HD800, which requires an amp to sound good.
 
Of course...the HD800 + amp is cheaper than the HE-1000 on its own...so...

 

[JaZZ]

  What you describe there would be taking the headphone output signal and feeding it to amp input. Which indeed doesn't make any sense

, instead you take the line (RCA or XLR) output of your DAC to feed your amp.

 
I don't understand the last part. I thought you would have realized that the Hugo's headphone out and line out are one and the same.
 

From the above info I can't really figure out if there is an amp stage between the FPGA and the headphone output and if yes, what type. If there indeed is no amp inbetween, then I expect the headphone to have some influence on the previous circuit i.e. the DAC.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenz's_law
How do they establish the damping factor?
 
Besides your obvious enthusiasm for the Hugo/HE1000 combo, I can assure you that haven't heard what the HD800 is capable of unless you have heard it via a GSX-Mk2 ... my kind of truth

 
I guess there's some kind of amplification going on after the DAC, let's call it the line-out stage. It doesn't really matter. The crucial point is that you can't get a purer signal from the Hugo to feed an external amp than what you'd use for driving a headphone. And amplifying the signal further makes no sense anyway.
 
The Hugo's damping factor is as low as it gets, IIRC about 0.25 ohms.
 
I have heard the HD 800 with various amps. I can't help, but directly from the Hugo it sounds clearly the best to my ears – in every possible quality criterion. Your sonic ideal may be different from mine. As said earlier, I'm not interested in euphony, I like it unvarnished and immediate. The Hugo without any detour.
 
Your ironic «truth» is still based on a wrong, misleading quote out of context. I don't preach any truth. You may look back to find the origin. Well, I'm so stubborn as to refuse purchasing a GSX-Mk2, simply because I have given up the hope for a neutral and accurate amp. For some the GSX-Mk2 is the wire with gain, for others it's the MicroZOTL... Do they actually sound identical? I prefer to rely on the Silver Dragon between the Hugo and the HE1000 (or the stock cable and the HD 800) in that it has the ability to transport the signal with almost no loss and addition (amazingly it does something favorable to it, though) – and I'm far from needing higher gain or power for both of my main dynamic headphones.
 
As far as maximizing the potential of either HE1000 or HD 800 goes: I can guarantee you that you haven't heard what they're capable of, with or without GSX-Mk2, before you have optimally equalized them. 

The effect is even bigger (and particularly more favorable if you're into accuracy and realism) than the addition of an amp to the Hugo.

 

[miceblue]

However, the extra power of something like...say the EF-6, does make it better. I find that, on the Chord Hugo.

I'm 100% certain the power output is not the only factor for the difference in sound. It makes no sense logically that having more power would make it sound better either unless the amp in the comparison was really lacking in power output. The HE1000 really doesn't require too much power compared to other planar magnetic headphones.

 

[n99127]

I'm 100% certain the power output is not the only factor for the difference in sound. It makes no sense logically that having more power would make it sound better either unless the amp in the comparison was really lacking in power output. The HE1000 really doesn't require too much power compared to other planar magnetic headphones.

 
Apologies...I didn't mean it was only the power that was involved...When I said power, I meant the EF-6 adds something to make the headphone sound better. Being a rather new audiophile, I suppose I accidentally chose the wrong word to describe it
 
Anyways, I guess to clarify...I do feel that the EF-6 makes the HE-1000 sound better, but having only listened to the HE-1000 for a while so far, it's going to be a bit longer before I can clarify exactly what that is
 
 

 

[zeissiez]

Attended a meet, and heard the He-1000 with EF6, Passlab INT150, Radiator 030. There were He-6, HD800, T1 for comparison.

This is my 0.02cents on the He-1000. Clarity is top class, good transparency(better than HD800), but not quite speaker-like sound of the he-6. Sounds Very smooth, refined and balanced. It's on the smooth side rather than analytic side (think LCD 3 vs HD800), there's zero edgy-ness anywhere in the spectrum. I don’t hear harshness in the treble that some people mentioned. Soundstage is enveloping, great air and separation. I find the size hit a good balance between spaciousness and fullness. HD800 soundstage is bigger, but lost some fullness. Presentation is relaxed, more like T1 than HD800 (back row rather than front row). Bass is impactful but not the hard type, more like being felt than being hit. Some people said it’s musical sounding, but I think that depends on what type of music u listen to, there are other headphones that sound better with rock for example. I can see some people prefer the LCD-X for example. Details and imaging not quite at HD800 level. It's not a headphone that wows and excites, other than the bass, there's nothing in the sound that immediately says: this is a usd3000 headphone, but I can imagine that it could give fatigue free long listening experience. It isn’t one level up from HD800, especially in technicalities. I can see some people thinking it’s overly smooth. As for the price, I certainly see the rule of diminishing return kicks in, certainly can't call it good value for money. I haven’t heard the Abyss, but I haven’t heard another headphone that sound as smooth, refined and balanced and yet possess such good level of technical quality.

 

[miceblue]

I'm aware of the limitations of this approach. After all it makes for a better precondition for the preservation of transparency than opting for euphony, so it's less limited, since you can counterbalance for missing synergy any time (e.g. by equalizing). Whereas with the euphony/synergy approach you can't recreate lost detail, and it's impossible to remove harmonic distortion.

I'm more than satisfied with the result from the Hugo/HE1000 pairing. I think it's the «best» sound I've heard from headphones so far. «Best» in terms of natural sonic colors, accuracy and depth of image. So not much in the way between the music and me!

So what makes you think the Hugo/HE1000 is the:

«Best» in terms of natural sonic colors, accuracy and depth of image

If you don't know what the original source music is supposed to sound like, and especially "depth of image"? : p

With all the talk of added THD, I was going to mention that you should probably listen to an e-stat since those tend to have the lowest distortion of any speaker diaphragm technology, but I see you already have. : D

Whether that low distortion sound sounds "good" or not is another story. XD
https://books.google.com/books?id=9DeZqnsjetgC&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false

 

[up late]

Apologies...I didn't mean it was only the power that was involved...When I said power, I meant the EF-6 adds something to make the headphone sound better. Being a rather new audiophile, I suppose I accidentally chose the wrong word to describe it

Anyways, I guess to clarify...I do feel that the EF-6 makes the HE-1000 sound better, but having only listened to the HE-1000 for a while so far, it's going to be a bit longer before I can clarify exactly what that is

then you must prefer a more "forgiving" sound than the "unvarnished" "truth" that only the hugo can give you

 

[raypin]

mmm....prefer the HE1K with the Mass Kobo 394 over the Hifiman EF6 (with a Chord QBD76 as DAC). I tested my HE1K on both set--ups at my favorite headfi dealer yesterday. It is not the SQ (both set-ups are very good to excellent). It is just the "flavor" that tipped me over to the Japanese desktop amp. But those are non-portables. For portables: yes, I also prefer the sound off the AK240/Chord Hugo with the HE1K.

 

[n99127]

then you must prefer a more "forgiving" sound than the "unvarnished" "truth" that only the hugo can give you

Personally, I just want the music to sound good! If I wanted analytical detail I'd probably go for the SR-009 or HD800 (as I said previously)
 
That reminds me, can someone recommend a good classical piece of music (preferably available on HDTracks) so that I can test my ability to recognize detail with these three headphones? I'm kinda curious how good these headphones are at retrieving small details.
 
 
 

  mmm....prefer the HE1K with the Mass Kobo 394 over the Hifiman EF6 (with a Chord QBD76 as DAC). I tested my HE1K on both set--ups at my favorite headfi dealer yesterday. It is not the SQ (both set-ups are very good to excellent). It is just the "flavor" that tipped me over to the Japanese desktop amp. But those are non-portables. For portables: yes, I also prefer the sound off the AK240/Chord Hugo with the HE1K.

 
Hmm... I've been looking into the Mass Kobo amps. What kind of influence do you think they add (treble? dark? etc). I've been thinking of getting a Mass Kobo amp of some kind...it's just a pity that they're hard to get a hold of where I am.

 

[up late]

Personally, I just want the music to sound good! If I wanted analytical detail I'd probably go for the SR-009 or HD800 (as I said previously)

sounds reasonable to me coz there are no absolutes in this hobby, no matter how much some folks bang on about their preferred gear choices

 

[Articnoise]

It’s not uncommon to use and beef up the DAC’s analog output stage and use it like a pre and then connect the DAC direct to a power amp. The advantage to this is that you will have one amplifying stage and one connection less that the signal need to pass thru. The analog output stage of the DAC and the volume pot of course need to be of good quality, as good or better than a good pre.  

 

This doesn’t mean that amplifying in different stages is bad and by doing it we automatically will introduce coloration. Most companies do want (for good reason) to separate the pre-amplifying from the power-amplifying stage which is separated from the DAC section. Sometimes they are placed in different boxes (shields + PSU) other times they are only separated by using individual PSU. Even Chord go separate in their more expansive gears.

 

The question is will the advantage of one less amplifying stage (it’s an advantage in my book) make it sound better with or without an additional amp? I think it depend on (1) how good the analog output stage in the DAC is compared to the amp xxx, (2) if the DAC has separate PSU’s for different tasks (digital, analog and left and right) (3) can the DAC deliver enough power/current/voltage to drive the HE1K at a certain loudness level, (4) does the DAC has a sound signature you like?

 

My 2c 

 

[doctorjazz]

You expressed very clearly what I was not so clearly trying to say.

 

[jsgraha]

Personally, I just want the music to sound good! If I wanted analytical detail I'd probably go for the SR-009 or HD800 (as I said previously)

That reminds me, can someone recommend a good classical piece of music (preferably available on HDTracks) so that I can test my ability to recognize detail with these three headphones?

http://www.hdtracks.com/recomposed-by-max-richter-vivaldi-the-four-seasons

It's not completely classical, rather a mix (modern take of classical piece). I saw when they came to Melbourne last year, and it's awesome. The recording is great too

 

[n99127]

http://www.hdtracks.com/recomposed-by-max-richter-vivaldi-the-four-seasons

It's not completely classical, rather a mix (modern take of classical piece). I saw when they came to Melbourne last year, and it's awesome. The recording is great too

 Thanks for the suggestion! I'll go take a listen.

 

[JaZZ]

So what makes you think the Hugo/HE1000 is the:

«Best» in terms of natural sonic colors, accuracy and depth of image

If you don't know what the original source music is supposed to sound like, and especially "depth of image"?

 
I don't need to know what the original sounded like to get the feeling that the sound I'm listening to is realistic, believable. I have attended classical concerts and played in a band, so I know the sonic colors of instruments quite well. The HE1000's imaging of sonic depth is extraordinary to my ears. I don't need to know where the instruments were effectively placed during the recording to like the realism it provides.
 

With all the talk of added THD, I was going to mention that you should probably listen to an e-stat since those tend to have the lowest distortion of any speaker diaphragm technology, but I see you already have.

 
In my experience a clean sound with low distortion is what I like best, but it's not an ideologic preconception to avoid harmonic distortion per se. I also like the sound of tube amps, but couldn't live with them in the long run (anymore), although I'm not pretending to have heard what the best tube amps can achieve in terms of unobtrusiveness of harmonic distortion. However, I have come to the insight that I like the coloration (distortion spectrum?) of solid-state amps better.
 
I have a mixed feeling about electrostatics in general and my two pairs. They may have even lower distortion than the HE1000, after all they sound extremely transparent and clear, but there's an inorganic trait in them particularly affecting the treble, and I'm halfways convinced to know the technical cause (in my activity as a speaker-builder I have experimented a lot and built several planar/ribbon transducers myself as well as some dome tweeters, with all of which I took care to avoid the very same phenomenon that I attribute to electrostatics – and not just to those). That said, I like them nonetheless – a lot – and use them regularly, just not right now, with the HE1000 as novelty.