[richard51]

  Without reading all 1370 pages can us new owners get a quick recap of the mods?
 

1. What benefits does the grill mod have? What do we lose with it? I assume we gain some clarity and sound stage at the cost of bass?
2. I've looked, i really can't find any hard details on the sorbothane mod. Help please?
3. What do we gain/lose with the $10 velours
4. How about the focus (a?) pads? 
5. Do these love tubes? Lyr 2? Typical planar?

 
Sorry, I generally do my research, but this thread is just massive. I've read a lot of people saying these things are better, but couldn't find any exact details why. I'm loving the bass on them and would hate to get into some of these mods only to have another flat headphone, and the beyers already fill that spot for me. 

sorbothane mod :
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/744839/damping-mechanical-resonance-distortion-of-stax-and-other-phones-with-sorbothane
 
read all this thread... all details explained here....

  this is one of the most important thread on the net audiophile... edStrelow has discovered that all headphones ( not only Stax and hifiman) are plagued by vibration, the sorbothane mod is a simple way to dampen the vibration and that transform the sound  from  good to extraordinary good...the change is on all the spectrum  of frequencies

 

[money4me247]

edited wrong thread. thought this was he-400s =S

 

[Oregonian]

How about this: My HE-400 has the grill mod and I run it usually (when I don't have the retro) via the HE-Adapter from Hifiman from the speaker taps of a 40 years old vintage Sansui (when they were world class) aomplifier from the speaker taps. Only issue is of course that you also need a balanced cable for them.

You need to hear that to see the light it's amazing, the HE-560 as well, they both pick up a notch....

Cheers,
K

I tried that...............and went straight to speaker taps. 

 

[DDDamian]

 
I tried that...............and went straight to speaker taps. 

Speaking of taps - your avatar is top-notch 

 

[MarcelE]

  Speaking of taps - your avatar is top-notch 

Those are definitely very nice earpads.

 

[DDDamian]

 
Those are definitely very nice earpads.

Community-interest O/T post - test: find the tattoo....
 

 

[DDDamian]

^^^^ and that, friends, was a fitting 1,000th post 

 

[Fearless1]

Been looking for a 1/2 hour, still don't see the tattoo ???!

 

[MarcelE]

Been looking for a 1/2 hour, still don't see the tattoo ???!

 
Hahaha, yes you're probably wondering where she sits on.

This is getting off topic sorry...so is she wearing a HE-400, I cannot tell on the pic.

 

[DDDamian]

   
Hahaha, yes you're probably wondering where she sits on.

This is getting off topic sorry...so is she wearing a HE-400, I cannot tell on the pic.

Sorry, are you talking about headphones?! 

 

[Lohb]

   
 

Rabbit in the headlights here...
 
 
 
 
DDDamian, what is the treble of 400's like through bottlehead S.E.X. amp ?
Much smoother and less of those bitey spikes ?

 

[DDDamian]

  Rabbit in the headlights here...
 
 
 
 
DDDamian, what is the treble of 400's like through bottlehead S.E.X. amp ?
Much smoother and less of those bitey spikes ?

Not really - that's more how I would describe it through the Gustard H-10. The BH S.E.X gives it some great dynamics and power to spare, but hides none of the bitey spikes (great phrase for them!). In fact it hides nothing with the HE-400. Listening to vinyl rips the hiss and pop, flutter and wow were all there, with the hiss especially hard to take. Those cans really do expose a lot, and the amp wouldn't hide any of it.
 
Some headlights eh?

 

[MrMateoHead]

 
Yea that kinda bugged me too. I mean, they (the brands) post all this measurement, but who's to say that they're not BS-ing? People like Tyler can double check with their exotic measuring equipment but most end users like me would just have to take their words for it, and probably got scammed all this time in regard of the measurements. 
 
Then there's what you said. Different measurements could be the products' deviations, or variation of methods.
 
I once tried plugging LCD 3 (not mine) to a $30 basic phone, and it still sound good. Not very much different compared to plugging it into an astell&kern which they got there as well. In regard of volume/loudness, I felt that LCD-3 was a bit louder than HE400, plugged to the same phone. Probably just a feeling, as I didn't bring the HE400 for side by side comparison. In short, the gap I felt wasn't as big as when comparing HE400 plugged to an ipad jack out vs a desktop dac/amp. 
 
Talking about behemoths, I once tried plugging HE400 straight to the speaker out of a pre-amp + power-amp combo. They're cheap amps, so I don't really know the specs, but they were originally used to power standing speakers. I have to admit, I got quite good sounds from it. Too bad, being cheap, the amp combo got crazy noise floor.

*Measurement is a compromise in most cases - you derive a means to "tell the story", but that means it isn't foolproof. I trust measurements but am well aware of some of the pitfalls. This is true whether your are a engineer or a social scientist. That is why many consider their "ears" the trump card to all measurement - "if I think it sounds better, it is better". Likewise that is why social science is criticized - "the scientist says we are poor, but I don't feel poor, so I think they are making things up". What you perceive does not = science, and what you believe can be different than what is fact (and the problem of "cognitive dissonance" explains why people might continue to choose to smoke in lieu of the facts).
 
*Measuring the "efficiency" of a headphone, like any speaker, can mean measuring output at one frequency, or a range of frequencies. Ever listened to test tones? I guarantee you that listening at the same SPL, the 30hz tone will seem quiet compared to the 1 khz tone. That is because our ears don't hear the way microphones do. So, I'm not surprised that the LCD's could "sound louder" - they probably have a better, bassier, or stronger mid-centric response which would be interpreted by your ears as louder. Or something like that. Bottom line, I think the overall "sound signature" of any phone influences perceived loudness, mW for mW!
 
*The HE-400 (like my other headphones), definitely sounds better on an amp than off. I never used to believe that amps mattered all that much, but it does seem to add some sense of control, loudness, and bass.
 
*one thing my ears have become more sensitive to is when amps are running out of "headroom" - in short I can sometimes sense when "compression" is setting in, and the overall sound might seem more constrained. Hence I'd rather have more power than I need, than not. Its just that power is so $$$$ in this business and others.

 

[creatip]

  *Measurement is a compromise in most cases - you derive a means to "tell the story", but that means it isn't foolproof. I trust measurements but am well aware of some of the pitfalls. This is true whether your are a engineer or a social scientist. That is why many consider their "ears" the trump card to all measurement - "if I think it sounds better, it is better". Likewise that is why social science is criticized - "the scientist says we are poor, but I don't feel poor, so I think they are making things up". What you perceive does not = science, and what you believe can be different than what is fact (and the problem of "cognitive dissonance" explains why people might continue to choose to smoke in lieu of the facts).
 
*Measuring the "efficiency" of a headphone, like any speaker, can mean measuring output at one frequency, or a range of frequencies. Ever listened to test tones? I guarantee you that listening at the same SPL, the 30hz tone will seem quiet compared to the 1 khz tone. That is because our ears don't hear the way microphones do. So, I'm not surprised that the LCD's could "sound louder" - they probably have a better, bassier, or stronger mid-centric response which would be interpreted by your ears as louder. Or something like that. Bottom line, I think the overall "sound signature" of any phone influences perceived loudness, mW for mW!
 
*The HE-400 (like my other headphones), definitely sounds better on an amp than off. I never used to believe that amps mattered all that much, but it does seem to add some sense of control, loudness, and bass.
 
*one thing my ears have become more sensitive to is when amps are running out of "headroom" - in short I can sometimes sense when "compression" is setting in, and the overall sound might seem more constrained. Hence I'd rather have more power than I need, than not. Its just that power is so $$$$ in this business and others.

 
I see your point. And the brands do tend to not post enough information on the products. I mean, like if a headphone is rated at 64 ohms, well at what frequency? Usually it's measured at 1kHz, but because it's not really stated, they could claim, 'hey I never said that it's 64 ohms at 1kHz'. As with planars, I think planars tend to have the same value across the frequencies(?)
 
And I most definitely agree that audio is subjective, even if the elements in it can be measured objectively. This may be only my way of thinking, but my mindset is like you quoted, 'the ears are the final judge'. I mean, it's illogical to buy (and keep using) expensive devices that are the top notch in measurements, closest reproduction to the original, etc, but don't like the sounds at all. 
 
- why do you buy and keep using these?
- because they're the best of the best. Got the best reviews, closest reproduction to the original source, least distortions, cream of the crop....
- do you like how they sound?
- nope, not a single bit....
 
*Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying my ears got the best judgment there is, even for myself. You might be right, maybe I only perceived LCD-3 as louder, when in fact it's not. My ears have fooled me more than 1 time, that's for sure...

 

[MrMateoHead]

   
I see your point. And the brands do tend to not post enough information on the products. I mean, like if a headphone is rated at 64 ohms, well at what frequency? Usually it's measured at 1kHz, but because it's not really stated, they could claim, 'hey I never said that it's 64 ohms at 1kHz'. As with planars, I think planars tend to have the same value across the frequencies(?)
 
And I most definitely agree that audio is subjective, even if the elements in it can be measured objectively. This may be only my way of thinking, but my mindset is like you quoted, 'the ears are the final judge'. I mean, it's illogical to buy (and keep using) expensive devices that are the top notch in measurements, closest reproduction to the original, etc, but don't like the sounds at all. 
 
- why do you buy and keep using these?
- because they're the best of the best. Got the best reviews, closest reproduction to the original source, least distortions, cream of the crop....
- do you like how they sound?
- nope, not a single bit....
 
*Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying my ears got the best judgment there is, even for myself. You might be right, maybe I only perceived LCD-3 as louder, when in fact it's not. My ears have fooled me more than 1 time, that's for sure...

All of these points are great points. I would rather have more, not less specs but like you recognize their value can be (very) limited. But in the world of audio, the standards are quite weak.
 
I think of the problems in terms of the automotive industry. You can read a million articles on a million cars, with test data, acceleration, fuel mileage, etc., but the car that wins "on paper" may nevertheless not be your choice due to your preferring certain features or a certain "feel" behind the wheel, pricing, and so on. Millions of Toyotas prove that many people like reliability and efficiency, and probably a vanilla driving experience.  Millions of trucks are sold however, while generally reliable, seem to prove that efficiency and "fun to drive" are not high on people's lists. Did millions "need" a truck? Or do they love the big engine and ride height? Etc. Dozens of products for millions of people who are all doing something (driving), and who, in most cases, are probably motivated mostly by style, status and price! So much for being "objective" and choosing the "best" at all times.
 
Certainly audio products are not THAT different feature-wise, but I can certainly understand how, even despite research, it is nice to have speakers "tuned" in different ways. But as the hype of this stuff starts to fade from my memory, I worry more and more that I'll never be able to save money AND get the best sound!