[Berlioz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by aristos_achaion /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'd be kinda curious if the woman in the fourth picture was even doing her job at the time...it looks like a posed photo to me. And there's no fscking way the fellow in the sixth shot was doing anything interesting, with a photographer breathing down his neck. All the Senn shots look unnatural...the crazy angles, the artistic focus, the shininess...it's clearly a professional, staged shoot. Whereas the Grado pictures look genuine, like someone took a camera and shot people really doing their job. @Berlioz: You must have really awful bosses. Even in college, my friends were allowed to wear earphones on the job, assuming they weren't in a customer-support position or whatnot. Plus, check out how many Head-fi'ers list work setups or ask for closed phones because they can't disturb other people at work. Probably why she's not wearing Grados...they'd leak like crazy and disturb other people. What I get from this is that Grado wants to show fans a typical day at the office, and that Senn wants a sales brochure.

I have had some awful bosses

But to be honest I wouldn't wear headphones at work even if I was allowed to. Mostly because both my job and my music listening would suffer. When I was 15 I worked in a production facility that was not unlike the Grado one, and headphones were a big no-no, mostly for safety reasons. Obviously, that's not so much of an issue at a headphone manufacturing company.

I agree that the Senn shots look very posed. I didn't pay much attention to them. Regardless, the environment looks very clean, at least in the area where the HD800's are produced.

 

[bhd812]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClaudeRaines /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yep, its really apples to oranges.

yes and no...

it's like comparing Nascar to F1, one comes from a barn and the other comes from Lab, but both are auto races meant to entertain and MAKE MONEY!

grado is about old school U.S. manufacturing that has been largely outsourced for better cost to profit. Sennheiser is a much larger and technology led company made to their specs exactly..for better cost to profit.

Every Grado i ever owned seemed like a toy next to a set of 600/650's but the 600/650 just does not have the weird addictive feel and sound any Grado comes with (esp John grado stuff).

 

[iriverdude]

Sorry I think Sennheiser's look a toy, lots of moulded plastic, cheaply made, no design or character to it. Much like a budget Japanese car dash board.

 

[ArmednInsane]

Hm....from the other HF-2 thread and to this thread. I am guessing a lot of people here are judging manufacturer on how the manufacturer should be running their business. Then again, we should keep in mind, this is the manufacturer's business and they will run it how they want it. If the way they run it is wrong...then I guess they will get the consequences.

How they run the company is none of the consumers' business and the consumers in essence should just care how the final products affect the consumers. If there is no problem with Grado's product compared to Sennheiser, I am inclined to say that Grado is smart, because this way, they save money more than Sennheiser while still maintaining their market share. Same thing with the other thread, a lot of the posts say "If Grado has done this, they woulda get more fans, buyers, whatever." The thing is, why does it matters so much to us, as final consumers?

Of course, what I say above only applies as long as the manufacturer is not hiring kids below 14 and tell them to work 21 hours without any break. (this is just an expression, considering this is an online community, there might be a chance someone reply "so you are fine if they are above 14 and work 20 hours a day")

You see the way Grado put their stuffs in an old cardboard box and Sennheiser line it up properly, and the response that we see is "Why does Grado show this pictures?" Well who cares, for all we know, it means Grado's stuffs is more durable and stronger than Sennheiser's and that's why theirs can be thrown around like that.

Just like Bose, they costs a lot and their factory might look better than Sennheiser's but if you guys don't like Bose, Bose will still get bashed. Grado treats their supposedly "made with pride" headphones like these but people still like their products and their products is still reliable and durable. So what seems to be the problem?

 

[GuyDebord]

wow! what does grado do with the revenue??? certainly doesn't put in in a SOTA research lab, also not in their employees nor in quality control and obviously not in the workspace! Im thinking mr. Grado makes a lot more personal money with his products than mr. Sennheiser.
Seriously, aside from sound quality....any company that gives such sh#tty environment to their employees should be put in everyones low standard... Im not giving grado my money!

 

[iriverdude]

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyDebord /img/forum/go_quote.gif wow! what does grado do with the revenue??? certainly doesn't put in in a SOTA research lab, also not in their employees nor in quality control and obviously not in the workspace! Im thinking mr. Grado makes a lot more personal money with his products than mr. Sennheiser. Seriously, aside from sound quality....any company that gives such sh#tty environment to their employees should be put in everyones low standard... Im not giving grado my money!

You should buy Bose then, they spend millions on R&D (probably Bose term for suing other audio companies) Why should he buy new equipment? What's wrong with a 50 year old lathe for the wood cups? Fred Dibnah made stuff on lathes, powered by steam engines.

I really have to wonder if the people complaining are kiddies.

 

[GuyDebord]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArmednInsane /img/forum/go_quote.gif How they run the company is none of the consumers' business and the consumers in essence should just care how the final products affect the consumers. If there is no problem with Grado's product compared to Sennheiser, I am inclined to say that Grado is smart, because this way, they save money more than Sennheiser while still maintaining their market share. Same thing with the other thread, a lot of the posts say "If Grado has done this, they woulda get more fans, buyers, whatever." The thing is, why does it matters so much to us, as final consumers?

What about ethics and the informed consumer!!!! Actually it is the consumer that should be informed, demand better and not support companies that arent to their standards! If you think Grado is smart because they give a bad working environment for their people, then support it. I wont!

Actually, we should really care about the process! the end products just mask and makes us more indifferent, they alienate you from the human labor involved, creating the social relations of our f*^cked up societies, where no one cares!

 

[GuyDebord]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iriverdude /img/forum/go_quote.gif You should buy Bose then, they spend millions on R&D (probably Bose term for suing other audio companies) Why should he buy new equipment? What's wrong with a 50 year old lathe for the wood cups? Fred Dibnah made stuff on steam powered lathes. I really have to wonder if the people complaining are kiddies

I have seen the manufacturing facilities in Tijuana, Mexico. For sure they are better than grado's but I also know about their cheap labor exploitative practices, they pay 250-300 dollars a month to their workers.

Sennheiser manufactures the hd800 in Germany, pay salaries in Euros (starting at 2k a month for a cleaner) they pay pension to the workers, health insurance fees, 1 month vacations and high taxes, plus they have SOTA facilities!

 

[iriverdude]

How on earth do you know Grado have a bad working enviroment? Is John Grado whipping them? Perhaps you're just annoyed he's not employing white Americans.

Pretty much all factories have vast majority of unskilled, immigrant workforce. They just hire good looking models for company sales brochure, so you think they employ wholesome American families.

 

[drizzt]

I agree with iriverdude. Just because it's not beautiful doesn't mean it is bad. As long as there is a little AC in the building and a lunch break what else do you really need. Also sennheiser would have a bigger and probably nicer factory because they are more mainstream. Not all of their products of course, but some lower end models like the px-100 was available a circuit city and they also have products available at apple now. Also grado doesn't ship outside the US so it makes for a smaller market. And just curious if all of Sennheiser's assembly looks this good because all these pictures are of the HD-800s. I doubt they take the same care with their other models, but that is just what I believe.

 

[TwoTrack]

It's silly to draw conclusions regarding manufacturing quality based on a handful of photos.

Also, Grado is in Brooklyn so by definition the facilities may be a bit dated.

I greatly respect Sennheiser but at the end of the day I prefer the Grado sound.

 

[tvrboy]

I think my original point wasn't that the facilities ARE a terrible workplace. I haven't been there. I was just saying that those are not the pictures I would post on my company website. It's like they gave the janitor a camera and said "jose, you have 5 minutes to take the factory pictures. If you don't finish in 4 minutes you're fired."

 

[deadly55]

but photos that capture the moment and aren't staged are the best by far.

 

[Sakhai]

I like Grado headphones and all, but there's something to be said about quality products. I know we want superior sound, but that does that mean it has to come at the expense of other things? Is is so wrong to ask for both quality sound and a solid build? Perhaps if Grado upgraded their WWII gear, they could build their headphones more efficiently, cut costs, and charge their customers a lower price. Imagine what it'd be like if the GS1000 costs us $600, the RS1 $350, etc. Modern machinery are more efficient. There's no denying that.

 

[ClaudeRaines]

"Good Quality Grados" can be produced in a place like the one pictured on the website. They have everything they need. Its management you need to look at if Grado quality is not up to par.