[Hutnicks]

Yeah Merc was best looking car until today morning. Fins & Twings spoil the looks.

We can only assume now that Skysports will change their theme music to "Jaws"
 
Fins should be banned outright just on general aesthetic grounds.

 

[gr8soundz]

Just catching up on the new car unveils today.
 
Have to agree, the Merc looks like the most cohesive design so far. Ferrari's looked more unique.
 
Bet all the cars will look different once the season starts and teams aren't hiding their design tricks.
 
Guess we'll also see, due to the extra G-forces, which drivers are in better physical shape.
 

 

[SP Wild]

They should just ban front and rear wings all together.

 

[Hutnicks]

They should just ban front and rear wings all together.

Or at the very least limit them in number to one. Lest the new Ferrari winds up looking like this.
 

 

[SP Wild]

Probably true.

I was thinking of the good looking classic wingless F1 cars that would slide around corners then pictured some modern abomination that was wind tunnel teseted to have maximum downforce for a 'wingless' design.

I read somewhere the classic cars had better racing because there was more reliance on mechanical grip and no aerodynamics, so overtaking actually occurred... For the lead even.

 

[Hutnicks]

Probably true.

I was thinking of the good looking classic wingless F1 cars that would slide around corners then pictured some modern abomination that was wind tunnel teseted to have maximum downforce for a 'wingless' design.

I read somewhere the classic cars had better racing because there was more reliance on mechanical grip and no aerodynamics, so overtaking actually occurred... For the lead even.

Well at one point they canned the whole system and promoted Formula Two cars to F1 and started over. Given Alonso's comments on his GP2 Maclaren motor, perhaps that might be a solution. Might even get a female into the formula as well.

 
 Reality here is F1 lost its mission years ago. You cannot claim to be the epitome of anything when you impose artificial restrictions. The price being paid is clear with Renault and Honda not being able to get to parity within the limits imposed by the powers. Liberty's takeover I fear will do little to correct that and a lot to making F1 into open wheel NASCRAP. Get it while you can because unless things change dramatically 2020 will usher in the absolute death of the formula. It is in the new owners best interest to let the teams go wild and hang wings and things everywhere so when the new era arrives in three years they can have all the ammunition to say well we told ya so, so now it's going to be spec chassis, spec motors and our way or the highway.

 

[SP Wild]

Well at one point they canned the whole system and promoted Formula Two cars to F1 and started over. Given Alonso's comments on his GP2 Maclaren motor, perhaps that might be a solution. Might even get a female into the formula as well.:rolleyes:

 Reality here is F1 lost its mission years ago. You cannot claim to be the epitome of anything when you impose artificial restrictions. The price being paid is clear with Renault and Honda not being able to get to parity within the limits imposed by the powers. Liberty's takeover I fear will do little to correct that and a lot to making F1 into open wheel NASCRAP. Get it while you can because unless things change dramatically 2020 will usher in the absolute death of the formula. It is in the new owners best interest to let the teams go wild and hang wings and things everywhere so when the new era arrives in three years they can have all the ammunition to say well we told ya so, so now it's going to be spec chassis, spec motors and our way or the highway.

Yeah... I kinda agree with you. The Americans are going to turn it into a control category sooner or later.

I just thought right now that perhaps we are entering a technology convergence in racing cars in all categories. With computers taking over in designs, perhaps we will never see the likes of classic f1? Those era was all human input design, zero computers.

 

[Planar_head]

Yeah... I kinda agree with you. The Americans are going to turn it into a control category sooner or later.

I just thought right now that perhaps we are entering a technology convergence in racing cars in all categories. With computers taking over in designs, perhaps we will never see the likes of classic f1? Those era was all human input design, zero computers.

 
That's an awfully narrow point of view. It's like you're saying the computers design the car, not people. What do you think all those engineers are for? People are still very much involved in the design, but the medium in which a car is designed is much different. As much as you'd like to believe that there was some magic to the "cut and try" era, it's not what is representative of how modern engineering works.
 
I'd wish for more room in the rules for teams to run different engine configurations. That'd be interesting. Giving more free reign over aero design would be a terrible idea (probably well stated now).

 

[oqvist]

Essentially i´s computers and wind tunnel results that decide the design. And driver input of course still have to have a car that suits the driver. A computer controlled F1 car would have other balance and setups
 
F1 formulae is tricky it must be the most technically advanced but people want great racing. Hard to combine but yes certainly the wingless F1 cars offered superior racing. Partly due to driver skill and the risk involved you wouldn´t get much Verstappens blocking during braking

 

[Matrixnobu]

Well we have to give Liberty a chance. Because at least they have moved the rules in the right direction in their first year. I'm really excited about the faster cars and am really looking forward to the racing this year.

 

[Hutnicks]

  Well we have to give Liberty a chance. Because at least they have moved the rules in the right direction in their first year. I'm really excited about the faster cars and am really looking forward to the racing this year.

They will get their chance for certain. Ross Brawn on board is a very good first step.  The problem of increasing revenue is where they will wind up being co opted. You cannot have that many races without burning out the staff of the teams. It's not like baseball or the NFL where you can just add more expansion teams and run the season year round. It is a very different form of sport and my inner skeptic leads me to believe they may have bitten off more than they can chew.
 
 
 Testing is showing that this year is not going to be much different from last year, just run at a faster pace. The speed is moot here. The thing that potentially will change the complexion of the season is having tyres that last more than a hundred metres. One stop races will make pit strategy a very big factor.
 
With regard to the actual formula. It was length width and weight and displacement for the longest time. That was a good idea let the constructor use 6 12 or16 cylinders if they want. Wings came on to the scene and things started changing dramatically. We got to the 80's with Turbo Era I and things went south in a hurry. All of a sudden come the dawn of the 90's and the FIA is making so many rules no one knows which way is up anymore. The whole ground effect thing allowed them to start legislating everything in site and they went overboard and glommed on to the mechanicals. No reason on earth they should be allowed to mandate number of cylinders. The whole nonsense about banning fric as it provided an aerodynamic advantage should have gone to court and nailed the FIA's coffing lid shut. Every suspension component of the car fits into their ruling as the suspension is there to keep the bodywork in as stable attitude as possible. So you get a catch all rule that can be trotted out whenever the FIA figures it's in their own best interest.
 
 Dumbest move ever was banning active suspension. Awesome breakthrough with modern technology that had huge benefits in all automotive endeavors.

 

[Matrixnobu]

I agree with you that I would love to see the good old days of minimum weight, maximum length, width, and engine volume. That for me was what F1 was all about. But I just don't see anybody doing that anytime soon.

 

[wink]

They also killed the Can-Am series by getting away from the original concept........    

 

[SP Wild]

They will get their chance for certain. Ross Brawn on board is a very good first step.  The problem of increasing revenue is where they will wind up being co opted. You cannot have that many races without burning out the staff of the teams. It's not like baseball or the NFL where you can just add more expansion teams and run the season year round. It is a very different form of sport and my inner skeptic leads me to believe they may have bitten off more than they can chew.


 Testing is showing that this year is not going to be much different from last year, just run at a faster pace. The speed is moot here. The thing that potentially will change the complexion of the season is having tyres that last more than a hundred metres. One stop races will make pit strategy a very big factor.

With regard to the actual formula. It was length width and weight and displacement for the longest time. That was a good idea let the constructor use 6 12 or16 cylinders if they want. Wings came on to the scene and things started changing dramatically. We got to the 80's with Turbo Era I and things went south in a hurry. All of a sudden come the dawn of the 90's and the FIA is making so many rules no one knows which way is up anymore. The whole ground effect thing allowed them to start legislating everything in site and they went overboard and glommed on to the mechanicals. No reason on earth they should be allowed to mandate number of cylinders. The whole nonsense about banning fric as it provided an aerodynamic advantage should have gone to court and nailed the FIA's coffing lid shut. Every suspension component of the car fits into their ruling as the suspension is there to keep the bodywork in as stable attitude as possible. So you get a catch all rule that can be trotted out whenever the FIA figures it's in their own best interest.

 Dumbest move ever was banning active suspension. Awesome breakthrough with modern technology that had huge benefits in all automotive endeavors.

I read somewhere they had to curb the lateral g forces for the drivers safety.

I do agree that the new management is at least trying, and allowing the cars to be fastest of all time! Right? Which is what F1 is all about. The pinnacle.

 

[Hutnicks]

I read somewhere they had to curb the lateral g forces for the drivers safety.

I do agree that the new management is at least trying, and allowing the cars to be fastest of all time! Right? Which is what F1 is all about. The pinnacle.

In the 80's with full ground effects the drivers were actually experiencing grey outs during cornering.