[joseph69]

  On a side note, I can sort of get the sound i am looking for simply by applying a slight bit of pressure around the perimeter of the enclosures, but I feel I used to get that sound previously without doing so.  My point is that the change I'm looking for is subtle, and I believe it is reasonable to expect that a change in component could get me where I want to be..

 
Have you ever though that the headband possibly stretched which is why you can replicate your earlier experiences by putting slight pressure on the enclosures? Or the ear pads themselves have possibly changed with use?

 

[Allanmarcus]

i have a question.  Recently, with burn-in, I am preferring my Utopia less.  I know it isn't broken but the sound profile has changed subtly. The tonality has shifted.  The lower mid-range is accentuated and the mid-range seems to have receded a bit.  It is not recessed, but it lost a little bit of what I perceived to be a slightly mid-centric sound..  The result is a little less bite, a little less clarity/focus, and a bit more bloomy (which I don't care for).  On certain recordings you can also hear a little more of the space/reverb - sometimes seems like singer is singing in a bathroom - I am exaggerating a bit, but you get the point.  To put things in perspective, the headphone is still one of my favorites, but I am looking for an amp or DAC that folks would consider slightly mid-forward.  Let me be clear.  Not looking to increase lower mids or upper mids.  I am looking to increase the frequencies in the meat of the mid-range.  If you think of a vocal I don't want the voice to have lower frequencies or the upper frequencies accentuated.  I currently use a GS-X MK2 and a Woo WA5-LE (relatively new version).  I use varying sources, but primarily I use an Oppo 105D. Whatever you recommend, clarity and impact is very important to me as well. I prefer a rich, but analytical sound.

On a side note, I can sort of get the sound i am looking for simply by applying a slight bit of pressure around the perimeter of the enclosures, but I feel I used to get that sound previously without doing so.  My point is that the change I'm looking for is subtle, and I believe it is reasonable to expect that a change in component could get me where I want to be..

Thanks in advance,
Brian

Take what I say with a gain of salt. I had an HA-1, and the DAC was relatively thin. I've also read that that GS-X 2 is also relatively analytical, with a little less meat than some would like. You combine those two (assuming the HA-1 DAC and the 105D are similar) and you may have a challenge there. The woo, from what I remember, certainly isn't thin, so you might want to try a different DAC with the woo. Now the woo is very tube dependent, so that could also be an issue. Heck, you can spend more on a 300b than you paid for that amp!

Hopefully you have a buddy or dealer that can you can try different equipment with. Your profile doesn't show a location. There are those here that love the GS-X. I've heard it and it sounded great with thinker headphones, like ZMFs. I too am chasing a little lusher sound, and that's why I have a mjolnir 2 on the way.

If I were you I would start with the DAC. Maybe a Schiit R2R. Heck, you can pick up a mimby, leave it on for 24 hours, and see if that changes things. If you like it, step up to your choice of price points.

 

[Kukua]

i have a question.  Recently, with burn-in, I am preferring my Utopia less.  I know it isn't broken but the sound profile has changed subtly. The tonality has shifted.  The lower mid-range is accentuated and the mid-range seems to have receded a bit.  It is not recessed, but it lost a little bit of what I perceived to be a slightly mid-centric sound..  The result is a little less bite, a little less clarity/focus, and a bit more bloomy (which I don't care for).  On certain recordings you can also hear a little more of the space/reverb - sometimes seems like singer is singing in a bathroom - I am exaggerating a bit, but you get the point.  To put things in perspective, the headphone is still one of my favorites, but I am looking for an amp or DAC that folks would consider slightly mid-forward.  Let me be clear.  Not looking to increase lower mids or upper mids.  I am looking to increase the frequencies in the meat of the mid-range.  If you think of a vocal I don't want the voice to have lower frequencies or the upper frequencies accentuated.  I currently use a GS-X MK2 and a Woo WA5-LE (relatively new version).  I use varying sources, but primarily I use an Oppo 105D. Whatever you recommend, clarity and impact is very important to me as well. I prefer a rich, but analytical sound.

On a side note, I can sort of get the sound i am looking for simply by applying a slight bit of pressure around the perimeter of the enclosures, but I feel I used to get that sound previously without doing so.  My point is that the change I'm looking for is subtle, and I believe it is reasonable to expect that a change in component could get me where I want to be..

Thanks in advance,
Brian

they'll get better sonically over time....it's a major inherent character trait of the utopia's....not to worry.

 

[Energy]

I receieved a 2nd pair of Utopia's. This one is new compared to my previous used pair.

It's is a tad bright. Not sure which frequency range, maybe 8-12khz somewhere. So far 5 hours of burn in hasn't removed the treble emphasis yet. It's not bright as say an HD800, but half way.

At first the sound stage (or fullness) didn't sound closed in, but then it kept coming and going.

Hope this goes away. Should I be burning it in at listening volume or slightly louder to loosen it up more?

 

[TSAVJason]

I receieved a 2nd pair of Utopia's. This one is new compared to my previous used pair.

It's is a tad bright. Not sure which frequency range, maybe 8-12khz somewhere. So far 5 hours of burn in hasn't removed the treble emphasis yet. It's not bright as say an HD800, but half way.

At first the sound stage (or fullness) didn't sound closed in, but then it kept coming and going.

Hope this goes away. Should I be burning it in at listening volume or slightly louder to loosen it up more?

It isn't how loud you put gain to it. It's how long you do it. You'll begin to notice that high frequency group mellow after about 70 hours.

 

[Arniesb]

I receieved a 2nd pair of Utopia's. This one is new compared to my previous used pair.

It's is a tad bright. Not sure which frequency range, maybe 8-12khz somewhere. So far 5 hours of burn in hasn't removed the treble emphasis yet. It's not bright as say an HD800, but half way.

At first the sound stage (or fullness) didn't sound closed in, but then it kept coming and going.

Hope this goes away. Should I be burning it in at listening volume or slightly louder to loosen it up more?

The longer you listen the more eardpads deform and you will get more seal. This means more warmness accros the fr range.

 

[John2e]

I receieved a 2nd pair of Utopia's. This one is new compared to my previous used pair.

It's is a tad bright. Not sure which frequency range, maybe 8-12khz somewhere. So far 5 hours of burn in hasn't removed the treble emphasis yet. It's not bright as say an HD800, but half way.

At first the sound stage (or fullness) didn't sound closed in, but then it kept coming and going.

Hope this goes away. Should I be burning it in at listening volume or slightly louder to loosen it up more?

The leather ear pads break in as well (like a baseball glove) and the seal should improve along with the sound stage

 

[Kukua]

It isn't how loud you put gain to it. It's how long you do it. You'll begin to notice that high frequency group mellow after about 70 hours.

thanks for your input sir...my favorite of yours by miles actually.

 

[Allanmarcus]

 

I receieved a 2nd pair of Utopia's. This one is new compared to my previous used pair.

It's is a tad bright. Not sure which frequency range, maybe 8-12khz somewhere. So far 5 hours of burn in hasn't removed the treble emphasis yet. It's not bright as say an HD800, but half way.

At first the sound stage (or fullness) didn't sound closed in, but then it kept coming and going.

Hope this goes away. Should I be burning it in at listening volume or slightly louder to loosen it up more?

The leather ear pads break in as well (like a baseball glove) and the seal should improve along with the sound stage

Interesting. I never thought of them that way. Do people use leather conditioner or other leather care products on ear pads?

 

[Alu]

 
Interesting. I never thought of them that way. Do people use leather conditioner or other leather care products on ear pads?

 
I personally don't, but I believe it's recommended to wipe the pads off with a cloth after each use, isn't it?
I'm also not doing this, but I'm giving them a bit of a rub with my hands after each use, which probably does nothing.
 
I use them for upwards of 7 hours a day, one of the blessings of freelance work.

 

[kingkikapu]

Been using these cans daily for months now.  I can lose hours just exploring on spotify. Pretty awesome stuff. I put my poor old LCD 2.2's on the other day and the clarity is substantially lower.  They're still fun headphones, but they are honestly collecting dust.  I figured I would be swapping between the two headphones more what with the different sound signature, but Utopia really is a sizeable step up not to mention more comfortable to wear.
 
Time to sell LCD's and start funding a Yggy.

 

[Energy]

@TSAVJason
@Arniesb
@John2e

Thanks for the clarification.

Now I feel like a dummy blasting my headphones throughout the night while I was sleeping. It woke me up a couple of times. I'll just do extremely low volumes from now on.

As for the break-in of the ear pads for warmer and smoother frequency makes a lot of sense too. I do notice that after having them on for awhile, the ear-pads would heat up and produce more bearable frequencies. Either that or the sweat seals the deal.

I'll give some more time with these before closing the books. Hope they perform like my original pair or better.

 

[FLTWS]

 
Interesting. I never thought of them that way. Do people use leather conditioner or other leather care products on ear pads?

 
Not me, any type of fluid or oil that works it's way thru perforations or seams could turn the underlying foam to a soggy sponge. A barely damp with water microfiber cloth is all I ever use and not everyday.

 

[John2e]

 
Interesting. I never thought of them that way. Do people use leather conditioner or other leather care products on ear pads?

Oils from hands and face should be enough.  But this type of break in obviously needs to be done be wearing them and not just feeding them a white noise loop....   

 

[FLTWS]

I did an informal impressions write up at the request of another member here at Head-Fi of my HD600 and Utopia and PM’d it to him. He suggested I post it here and on the HD600 thread as it might be useful to others.
 
Getting back to you on the Utopia vs HD600
 
The HD600 acquits itself extremely well overall and particularly in the midrange which surprised me a bit after not listening to them in some time. The bass on Utopia has greater weight and seems to go lower (after 400+ hours of break-in). This makes deep bass details a little easier to hear. Utopia also moves more air making it more satisfyingly impactful. The highs seem more extended on Utopia but this can be a good or bad thing depending on the recording.
 
On solo piano (as you’ve said before, very difficult to get right on recordings) and depending on mike placement the Utopia will give slightly more detail and better transparency but sometimes that also means hearing more of the clangy / buzzy mechanical artifacts I remember as a kid when I would stick my head under the sound board on my father’s grand piano as he played and before he would yell at me to pull my head the hell out of there in case the support brace gave way making me more brain damaged than I already was! LOL, good times, I miss my dad. From the day I was born until I left for the Army I heard live classical piano music almost daily.
 
My father was a classically trained pianist starting at age nine and he resumed training after he came back from 4 years in the Pacific as a ship board radio man. He used the GI bill to attend college for electrical engineering and continued his piano schooling but when I came along he felt he needed to focus on a surer career path future and went into the fledgling computer industry with Remington Rand in the late 40’s. He played everything from Bach to Shchedrin but favored Beethoven and Brahms, especially having fun with the “Sturm und Drang” aspects.
Back on topic. Both phones present a very similar sound field, wide and flat-ish depth-wise but very palpable.  On one jazz ensemble recording I like to use the acoustic instruments like saxophone, bells, piano and harpsichord, various drum sets, and acoustic guitar, displayed a slightly rounded 3D like characteristic to their sound on both phones. Electric guitar and electric bass sound like cardboard cutouts. Very consistently heard with both phones.
 
What gives the Utopia the edge overall to my ears is amazing control of transients both on attack and decay giving a level of clarity that I feel makes it more transparent than the 600, and just about any other phone I’ve auditioned with the exception of the HD800. This added refinement makes the instruments sound more life-like, more real. This clarity / transparency also differentiates the boundaries of the various groupings within a large symphony orchestra, recording dependent.  Of course this type of specificity is not heard live unless you’re on the podium or immediately around the orchestra. The farther out in the audience I get a blending of the groups sounds occurs, which I actually prefer. Up close can be loud but the right spots out in the hall can be just as loud but with a sense of  power that comes from the greater volume of air and ambience / the direct and reflected sound waves the music has to work with. Mahler 2’s closing “Aufersteh'n” chorale with full orchestral and organ support comes to mind.
 
Utopia handles dynamic extremes a bit better as well most likely due to its large and unique magnet assembly.  Siegfried’s Funeral March on Sheffield CD 7/8; it’s the soft tympani strokes that tell the story, the sound of the mallet on the drum head skin sound heard clearly and lifelike at such low levels and this extends to all instruments at their lowest extremes of their volume capabilities. The Utopia isn’t better to my ears because I can listen to it at louder levels, because I can’t, and they shouldn’t be pushed to stupid loud levels. But even when I listen at my typical peak volume levels the clarity of the pppp passages is a treat by comparison with other phones I’ve heard.
 
One physical aspect of the comparison between these two phones is that the Utopia is much more comfortable to wear for longer sessions.
 
I used the Ragnarok for the comparisons simply because I could set up equal volume levels for each phone with a sound meter and 1 kHz test tone and by counting the number of clicks on the volume control between the two different settings. As I switched phones I was reasonably confident when listening to either that loudness levels were very close. Can’t emphasize enough how slight volume differences can affect all aspects of what I hear. I ran AES/EBU from CD transport to Yggy and Yggy balanced in to balanced out on the Rag. (I still haven’t got around to a SE vs Balanced shootout yet). To the extent that cables do or don’t have much effect on the sound I also want to note that I was using 3 meters of DanaCable Lazuli Reference on the Utopia and 10 feet of Moon Black Dragon on the HD600. Thanks to an industry that can’t seem to settle on a quality connector standard for all full size phones I had no way to swap and see if the wire made a difference. Both are however just copper with the standard connectors, plain old Neutrik 4 Pins on the other, and no other special sauce. Price differential on the wires; Dana’s $1,200 vs Moons $300. 
 
On to the bottom line. The HD600 need make no apologies to the Utopia (or HD800). Like Schiit’s gear, it’s a value of the highest order and the sound is surprisingly good even compared to Utopia.  The $4,000 question is, given the diminishing returns aspect is the Utopia worth 10 times the price of the HD600? Probably not, but… Only your wallet can tell you that for certain. My wallet caved under the pressure so I guess it is worth it for me. But I’ll still most likely hang on to my HD600, it sounds that good compared to Utopia. But my “A” phones remain the Utopia and HD800. HD600 is a solid “B”. I also firmly believe that if you’re going to spend that kind of money you owe yourself some serious in home auditioning time before saying “I DO!”
 
Other phones I’ve had 7 to 10 day in-home auditions with since summer of last year include:
Oppo PM-1’s, HD600, HD800S, Dharma 1000, Abyss 1266, HEK V1, and several LCD models at dealers. Turns out I prefer dynamic to planar drivers in a headphone although the HEK and Abyss were very good, but the HEK was not quite as well articulated a sound as HD800 and the Abyss was a tricky fit and centrifugal forces with the distribution of the weight made it a situation of always being aware that they were on my head. Some of the phones I auditioned may excel at this or that specific parameter but Utopia, followed closely by my HD800, seem to better balance strengths and weakness for the best compromise to what’s important to me.
(And the type of music I listen to most.)