[Deezel177]

while we are on this topic, i hope you guys doesn't mind a question about zeus
i think the majority of the opinion said that zeus (non adel) doesn't have that much air like @seamon said, aether even sounds airier compared to zeus unfortunately, i only demoed the one with the adel (zeus XRA) and found it doesn't lack any air at all and have a really good soundstage. will the non adel version have a really different sound signature?. another thing that i usually hear is that the presence of the adel module makes the imaging and overall accuracy decrease in the zeus,and that is also the reason for nic to change the zeus in this shootout to the non adel version if i'm not mistaken. is the effect really drastic? would i be able to emulate the sound of original zeus with closed module AKA carrot module?

i know many people had asked this already in the EE thread, but i haven't catch up with that thread and re-reading all the page will take long time. so i hope i could get opinion from you guys here
and another thing, does the airiness attribute contributed by external module (ADEL or APEX) will always have side effect of sacrificing the overall accuracy and technicality?

The simple answer is "Yes." The XR and the XRA have different signatures and different presentations. The XR is richer, more bodied, and more natural sounding than the XRA. The XRA has the impression of being more airy due to a sparklier treble and thinner lower midrange, even though the XR is pretty airy already. I find the custom XR to lack a tiny bit of air just in the treble; everywhere else it has air in spades. On the bright side, this allows the XR to be more forgiving with harsher recordings, while they get unapologetically destroyed by the XRA.

Presentation-wise, the XR is more focused with fantastic clarity, resolution, and pinpoint imaging. The XRA, on the other hand, has a wider and more euphonic presentation, with imaging that's less precise, because the instruments sound somewhat stretched all around you. Resolution is also not as prevalent because of a less black background, some incoherence in the lower midrange, and the aforementioned phenomena of having details stretched around you. A friend of mine who has the XRA claims the carrot module cannot fully convert an XRA into an XR, even if it can get close.

 

[gearofwar]

For me the most things are
HD800 for me is just too darn reference, mids are too sterile and analytical and the artificial soundstage just seems empty at times.

This seems like someone who has been mentioned million times on head-fi where the person didn't match and drive HD800 properly. Don't even think about driving it with lowfi, midfi and daps....

U18 on balance out of wm1a on Whiplash twau goldplated is almost as good hd800 on midfi Valhalla

with valvo redl label e88cc with stock Bifrost. When switching to Schitt Gumby, it blew that 64 U18 and WM1A out of the water

This is headfi. Everyone says that. In fact I have heard better things over here ask @PinkyPowers - Sennheiser HD650 is better than LCD 2 and LCD 3, Chord Mojo is balanced etc.

Did you even drive the LCD3 properly? looks like someone prefer signature of something over and you listened that?

 

[Deezel177]

I have only heard the Zeus XRA Universal too and strictly in my humble opinion, I have found that it does not have enough air. If you think that the Zeus XRA has enough air for you that I think you'll be very happy with it and even with the air of the Aether but for me, Zeus XRA is not airy. My friend who tried the same pair owns the Campfire Audio Andromeda and Mr Speakers Ether Flow said that the Zeus XRA is not airy at all.

I find it odd how you'd categorize the U12 as one of the airiest IEMs you've heard, because I find its congested upper midrange/treble to be an absolute air killer. In your words, how would you describe "air"?

 

[seamon]

This seems like someone who has been mentioned million times on head-fi where the person didn't match and drive HD800 properly. Don't even think about driving it with lowfi, midfi and daps....

U18 on balance out of wm1a on Whiplash twau goldplated is almost as good hd800 on midfi Valhalla

with valvo redl label e88cc with stock Bifrost. When switching to Schitt Gumby, it blew that 64 U18 and WM1A out of the water


Did you even drive the LCD3 properly? looks like someone prefer signature of something over and you listened that?

I will not comment further on HD800 as it was probably not amped properly but yes I have properly amped my LCD 3 with a Violectric V181 and those words are not mine.

 

[Xymordos]

I've tried a lot of these at the HK AV show. For me, the Forte has a magical mid range, but the treble was quite splash, almost too sharp for me. I preferred A18 - less magical mid range, but better definition on the bass and controlled treble. Forte was extremely airy. A18 less so, but still very airy. I would say the Zeus (not sure which version I tried...it's without the switch) is similar to the A18 in terms of sound signature. VE8 appears to have nothing standing out, but it does everything very well, and it sounds very beautiful and has a satisfying amount of bass (good quality, too!).

For UM, I thought their planar-magnetic IEM, although slightly less refined in sound, sounded better overall than their Mentor MK3. The Mentor sounded quite dry for some reason.

I think my favorite I've tried so far is probably the UE18pro+ which sounds so smooth and cohesive. Zeus and A18 really did wow me, but I feel like I won't be able to listen to them as long as the UE18pro+ in the long term, as they will be more tiring with a stronger treble and the BA style bass.

 

[seamon]

I find it odd how you'd categorize the U12 as one of the airiest IEMs you've heard, because I find its congested upper midrange/treble to be an absolute air killer. In your words, how would you describe "air"?

Air to me is the air present between instruments. It is the feeling of something abstract present between them.

 

[Deezel177]

Air to me is the air present between instruments. It is the feeling of something abstract present between them.

That too is how I'd describe "air", along with space around the note where it lingers and decays after the initial transient. Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree then, I too have only heard the universal U12 after all. Cheers!

 

[seamon]

I find it odd how you'd categorize the U12 as one of the airiest IEMs you've heard, because I find its congested upper midrange/treble to be an absolute air killer. In your words, how would you describe "air"?

Did you by chance try it with the S1 module. I am asking because I am using the G1 and it makes the upper midrange absolutely fantastic.
Also, U12 Treble at first looks very lacklustre but after getting used to it, you start to notice the air.

 

[PinkyPowers]

Did you by chance try it with the S1 module. I am asking because I am using the G1 and it makes the upper midrange absolutely fantastic.
Also, U12 Treble at first looks very lacklustre but after getting used to it, you start to notice the air.

That's very true. Once you grow accustomed to the recessed treble, you begin to hear how extended it is, and how much air that brings to the stage.

I wouldn't call the U12 the most airy IEM. But it is more than decent once your brain adjusts.

 

[Wyville]

I think my favorite I've tried so far is probably the UE18pro+ which sounds so smooth and cohesive. Zeus and A18 really did wow me, but I feel like I won't be able to listen to them as long as the UE18pro+ in the long term, as they will be more tiring with a stronger treble and the BA style bass.

For me that is very important. I have no use of IEMs that sound amazing but are tiring after a while because I use mine all day long. They need to be smooth and non-fatiguing. I'm hoping I can arrange for a proper demo of the Harmony 8.2 and UE18+ Pro soon.

 

[Xymordos]

For me that is very important. I have no use of IEMs that sound amazing but are tiring after a while because I use mine all day long. They need to be smooth and non-fatiguing. I'm hoping I can arrange for a proper demo of the Harmony 8.2 and UE18+ Pro soon.

The mid range of the UE18 is very magical too. It's different from the Tia Forte one though. UE18's mid range is very smooth and liquid and sounds like a part of the entire flow of music. It does stand out due to how nice it sounds, but it blends well with the music and doesn't shove the vocals in your face. The Fourte's vocals are magical where it creates a HUGE sense of space around the vocals. Like, all the instruments are miles away from the singing. The sound stage is holographic. What ruined it for me was the treble though. There was some peak in the higher treble section which made it unbearable for some music. Shame, really. The bass and vocals was really unheard of in any other IEM.

 

[seamon]

For me that is very important. I have no use of IEMs that sound amazing but are tiring after a while because I use mine all day long. They need to be smooth and non-fatiguing. I'm hoping I can arrange for a proper demo of the Harmony 8.2 and UE18+ Pro soon.

Tried the U12? Might be right up your alley

 

[andra555]

I have only heard the Zeus XRA Universal too and strictly in my humble opinion, I have found that it does not have enough air. If you think that the Zeus XRA has enough air for you that I think you'll be very happy with it and even with the air of the Aether but for me, Zeus XRA is not airy. My friend who tried the same pair owns the Campfire Audio Andromeda and Mr Speakers Ether Flow said that the Zeus XRA is not airy at all.

in my short demo what i feel in the term of airiness was zeus XR > aether , but aether still feel quite airy for me. still zeus beat aether in the definition and imaging, still haven't got a chance to demo U/A12 but from the general opinion it lend towards dark, maybe not really fit my preference but still gonna demo it if i got a chance , thanks!

The simple answer is "Yes." The XR and the XRA have different signatures and different presentations. The XR is richer, more bodied, and more natural sounding than the XRA. The XRA has the impression of being more airy due to a sparklier treble and thinner lower midrange, even though the XR is pretty airy already. I find the custom XR to lack a tiny bit of air just in the treble; everywhere else it has air in spades. On the bright side, this allows the XR to be more forgiving with harsher recordings, while they get unapologetically destroyed by the XRA.

Presentation-wise, the XR is more focused with fantastic clarity, resolution, and pinpoint imaging. The XRA, on the other hand, has a wider and more euphonic presentation, with imaging that's less precise, because the instruments sound somewhat stretched all around you. Resolution is also not as prevalent because of a less black background, some incoherence in the lower midrange, and the aforementioned phenomena of having details stretched around you. A friend of mine who has the XRA claims the carrot module cannot fully convert an XRA into an XR, even if it can get close.

thank you very much for the insight, it is really helpful, been eyeing on some XRA, but still wondering if i get to bite the bullet in the end, should i reshell it to non A or just keep the A, price wise A cost quite a lot more and it will be a loss to remove it. there is also more option by having the A version which enables us to switch module, when i want that thin airy sound just plug the adel module, when i want the sound that is near to the original XR i could plug the carrot module, too bad that it couldn't reproduce the exact same sound with the non adele version, if it could it would be perfect

by the way, which zeus did you have is it the Adel version or the normal one? and i have heard a lot issues about zeus sensitivity, last time i auditioned it using hugo i stil hear some hisses in the background. what source do you use with the zeus is it wm1a?

For me that is very important. I have no use of IEMs that sound amazing but are tiring after a while because I use mine all day long. They need to be smooth and non-fatiguing. I'm hoping I can arrange for a proper demo of the Harmony 8.2 and UE18+ Pro soon.

hope you could those iems soon, don't forget about the prelude too just stay away from hidition,samba and dream lookalike they may torture you with their treble representation

 

[hung031086]

Yup try the u12 with gold plated hybrid cable, you will like it.

 

[andra555]

dunno where the sparkle and splash from the fourte come from (as i never tried fourte) but in my experience using UIEM , comply could help tame those nasty upper mid/lower treble peak (it alter the overall FR somehow though)