Exclusive First Listen: Experience Yamaha’s Unreleased Head-Fi Models! YH-4000 headphones and YH-C3000 headphones

[RONJA MESCO]

Great, shroud this thing in secrecy...

 

[Kammerat Rebekka]

Love Yamaha and especially their older planar magnetics that pioneered great sound back in the day. Some of them even compete with headphones from today’s market, which is a feat in itself.
Worryingly though they also compete with the regular YH5000se - in fact as far as sound quality is concerned - quite easily stomp over Yamaha’s newest flagship…which is a problem imho.
The old school Yamaha planars were and are extremely natural sounding whereas the YH5000se sounds weird with all kinds of weird on top. To me and to many I know the old guard is just waaaaay better.
Now I went into the YH5000se thinking and hoping it would be the new king of the market. I quite simply adore the design language and the comfort is to die for. What I hadn’t expected was a planar magnetic take on Grado; subbass roll-off, enormous peak in the upper mids (Grado-styled) followed by a large hole in the treble and an overall lack of refinement.
One of the rare few cans I’ve ever tried that manages to sound SHOUTY and cavernous at the same time.

My hope for this new iteration - if it is a new iteration(?) - is that Yamaha has managed to squeeze in a natural sound signature heralding their own adventure in planar magnetics. I think Yamaha’s back history deserves a grand gesture

 

[wu1f]

Exclusive First Listen: Experience Yamaha’s Unreleased Head-Fi Models

This year, Yamaha is offering Head-Fi enthusiasts an exclusive chance to experience two unreleased Head-Fi models. Be among the first in the world to explore our latest range and immerse yourself in True Sound.

Don’t miss out!



◆Australian Hi-Fi Show Sydney: 4-6 April 2025 (Australia)
⇒ https://www.whathifi.com/news/australian-hi-fi-show-2025-coming-attractions-room-by-room
⇒ https://yamahamusic.formtitan.com/ftproject/aushifishow

◆AXPONA: 11-13 April 2025 (USA)
⇒ https://axpona.com/

◆HIGH END Munich 2025: 15-18 May 2025 (Germany)
⇒ https://www.highendsociety.de/high-end-44.html

Should be interesting. Used to love Yamaha equipment and would love to see them return to prominence.

 

[Kabeer]

The fact is the innovation and technology that go into something like an MPD8 or Immanis are not cheap. People want to think their topping DAC can compete and that all DACs measure the same so that means it can when you actually listen to these devices on the same headphone and compare them the difference is obvious and laughable. The measurement boys haven't done these comparisons and hence they have no idea what they are talking about. Even my Chord Dave was completely trounced by the MPD-8.

THe YH-5000SE was the initial expensive product, and TOTL, that was demonstrating the R&D and work involved to revive Yamaha's planar tech.

Now we should be getting the trickle down effect. I had heard that Yamaha were planning new products in this vein. I hope they are affordable and sound great. $2000 is still a lot of money. I am hoping they play in the sub $1k market in some way personally.


Either way I am very excited that Yamaha are bringing new headphones out, those who may know me from the Ortho thread know I am probably one of Yamaha's biggest Orthodynamic fans, I wish them well on the new range.

 

[HiFiDJ]

Pricing aside, it would be good for Yamaha to make these more forgiving and less sensitive to what you plug into them. If they did that, I'm sure more people would enjoy the sound

 

[Metalingus]

I tried the SE, tuning was off. Not on it’s special amp, i put it on Diablo. But i love it’s design and sure will buy cheaper better tuned version.

Will we be able to purchase in shows or just demo?

 

[vcoheda]

this yamaha joke never gets old.

++

me: i would like to buy a piano

yamaha: ok

me: i'd also like to buy a motorcycle, do u know where i can find a good one?

yamaha: you're not gonna believe this

 

[Beagle]

Find me a DAC as good as MPD8 at a low price, find me an IEM as good as APX SE at a low price, find me a headphone as good as Immanis at a low price. Price is correlated to sound quality.

Yes, you're right. You get 2% more sound quality for 800% more cash outlay.

 

[gikigill]

Yes, you're right. You get 2% more sound quality for 800% more cash outlay.

Sorry Beagle but your ears aren't sophisticated enough.

/sarcasm

 

[voja]

Love Yamaha and especially their older planar magnetics that pioneered great sound back in the day. Some of them even compete with headphones from today’s market, which is a feat in itself.
Worryingly though they also compete with the regular YH5000se - in fact as far as sound quality is concerned - quite easily stomp over Yamaha’s newest flagship…which is a problem imho.
The old school Yamaha planars were and are extremely natural sounding whereas the YH5000se sounds weird with all kinds of weird on top. To me and to many I know the old guard is just waaaaay better.
Now I went into the YH5000se thinking and hoping it would be the new king of the market. I quite simply adore the design language and the comfort is to die for. What I hadn’t expected was a planar magnetic take on Grado; subbass roll-off, enormous peak in the upper mids (Grado-styled) followed by a large hole in the treble and an overall lack of refinement.
One of the rare few cans I’ve ever tried that manages to sound SHOUTY and cavernous at the same time.

My hope for this new iteration - if it is a new iteration(?) - is that Yamaha has managed to squeeze in a natural sound signature heralding their own adventure in planar magnetics. I think Yamaha’s back history deserves a grand gesture

At this point, it seems like you are deliberately spreading misinformation.

Post in thread 'Yamaha YH-5000SE — a flagship from an orthodynamic headphones veteran!'

Feb 25, 2025

A combination of Holo May, Mola Mola Tambaqui, Riviera AIC10 and Niimbus U5 Pro. Also heard it via an old school Rotel cd player and Lake People headphone amp. Same results.
No chain can remove a large midrange peak unless it uses equalisation.

Edith: it’s alright @voja
Like I said my buddy shares the same sentiment as you do regarding the Yamaha. I have stopped trying to like it. Trust me I’ve tried. I really really adore the way it looks and feels but ultimately can’t get over how wrong I feel it sounds.
Then again the reason I hate the sound of this headphone is the exact same...

• Kammerat Rebekka

• 

It's pathetic how in the same post you clearly specified that you only listened to the YH-5000SE through a combination of Holo May (>€5000), Mola Mola Tambaqui (€12000), Riviera AIC10 (nearly €20000), and Niimbus US5 Pro (€5500), and also stated "no chain can remove a large midrange peak unless it uses equalisation". Just to get that right, these two DACs and two amplifiers = all chains? Or is it because of their €?

In the same thread, when I explicitly explained to you that I successfully got rid of the peak (by using the HA-L7A amplifier and my iBasso DX340 DAP as the source), you dismissed that and wrote:

No amp, dac, streamer, dap or cable is going to remove a large peak from the presentation. That is just outside of the laws of physics. I do believe that some can get used to the presentation - so much so that what earlier sounded like a peak to them now sounds like welcoming detail, sure…but the peak is still there. It’s the listener’s ears and head that have changed

I'm sorry, but I've spent close to 6 years critically listening to audio. I am confident in my judgment about what my ears hear. That's 6 years of listening to sound—not enjoying music. I don't need anyone to school me about what my ears are hearing, trying to convince me that my ears and head have changed. You're gaslighting; you're not even trying to hide that. I have a good idea about the kind of an individual you are. That's very apparent from just taking a peek at your activity history and reading the "About" section on your profile.

Regarding the brain burn-in accusation, I'll quote myself:

[YH-5000SE] is simply unlike any other. Those who haven't heard this range of variation firsthand cannot comprehend it, nor can they accept it, apparently. As a critic, I don't get brain burn-in—I don't get used to sound. The best way I can describe my approach to judging sound is by comparing it to the sensation of touch. Imagine you have a textured surface and you run your finger over it. If you are running your finger over it for a while, you'll lose the intensity and the depth of the surface texture. When I am composing reviews, each time I put the headphones on is a fresh sensory experience. My ears and brain hit a factory reset button each time I take the headphones off my head. A sharp edge is a sharp edge, it doesn't become dull once you run your finger over it.

Also, PLEASE tell me what laws of physics you are talking about. I'd love to hear more about it Some references would be a good start.

Each component in the audio signal path has its own physical properties. So, please show me the proof that these physical properties have zero effect on sound. Or are you implying all of us are insane and you're the only smart guy? I am not the only person who discovered that the YH-5000SE's sound drastically changes depending on what it's paired with. So, are you trying to position yourself above others? Because you are obviously dismissing these observations. Another person said that 'other [flagship] headphones sound great when paired with whatever'... I'm sorry to break it to you, but YH-5000SE ≠ other headphones.


It's funny how I addressed all of this in my YH-5000SE article (skip to the Sound section), yet you didn't respond with a single counter-argument. Is that because you couldn't come up with any valid counter-arguments? Perhaps I was too accurate? Whatever the reason is, you're very obvious in what you're trying to do. You must think you're clever with your words by downplaying the fact that you are pushing your own narrative, but you're not. You're so blatantly obvious that it's not even funny. I just hope others aren't deceived by your mask. You were very aware that I would be publishing my article soon, and when I did—silence. How convenient is that...

What you are doing is disgusting and dishonest. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Enough is enough. I won't fall for your provocations, but I will confront you about your actions. I just don't understand why you're forcing this false narrative. What are you gaining from it?

If you're not willing to put in the effort to build a setup in which the YH-5000SE sounds to your liking, just say that—there is literally nothing wrong with that. Admit that you heard the same YH-5000SE across [your pairings] and that you aren't open to accepting that it can sound any different from that. I shared my findings and explicitly stated the setup I used. Others did the same. What is it that you're trying to accuse us of?


I spent so much time trying to understand this headphone, so I invite everyone to give my YH-5000SE article a read. At least read it from the Sound section to the end. If you want to hear observations from someone who got to experience both sides of the YH-5000SE, I think it will be worth your while.

 

[Kammerat Rebekka]

I was very close to putting you on ignore the last time we crossed paths @voja. To be completely honest with you, I had a hard time understanding how you could be so condescending to another member simply because they had a different opinion than you.
It’s now very clear to me that is indeed who you are. Life is going to treat you hard, if you attack everyone with a different viewpoint than you.
Welcome to my ignore list.
Peace.

 

[Luckyleo]

I've been hanging out in the Schiit Happened thread for 10 years or so (over 12,000 pages of comments). Not once have I seen people getting personal in their criticisms (at least that I remember). I've already seen multiple instances on this thread and we're only on page 2. I am enjoying this change of pace, but it probably isn't a good idea to continue this. It's just headphones and stuff; Supposedly for our enjoyment. Peace my friends! Enjoy the music!

 

[Beagle]

I was very close to putting you on ignore the last time we crossed paths @voja. To be completely honest with you, I had a hard time understanding how you could be so condescending to another member simply because they had a different opinion than you.
It’s now very clear to me that is indeed who you are. Life is going to treat you hard, if you attack everyone with a different viewpoint than you.
Welcome to my ignore list.
Peace.

I just wanted to chime in about your thoughts on the original Yamaha orthos. I bought my first good headphone when i was a teen and it was the Yamaha HP-1. I also had the YHD 1, 2 and 3 in the late 80's. I still use an HP-1 in my recording system down stairs. They are some of the smoothest, natural sounding headphones I've had.

So, although I haven't heard the YH5000SE, judging by the graph of the frequency response, I'd say you seem to be right on the money.

 

[voja]

I was very close to putting you on ignore the last time we crossed paths @voja. To be completely honest with you, I had a hard time understanding how you could be so condescending to another member simply because they had a different opinion than you.
It’s now very clear to me that is indeed who you are. Life is going to treat you hard, if you attack everyone with a different viewpoint than you.
Welcome to my ignore list.
Peace.

I had my money on this guy trying to play the victim card—and guess what? He ended up putting me on the ignore list after I dismantled his claims. I spoke too much truth, and it seems that was more than he could handle. Typical.

How am I condescending?? At no point ever did I place myself above anyone else. At no point did I dismiss anyone's opinion. Where do these accusations stem from? I am genuinely looking for an answer to this.

Let's be clear: all opinions are welcome. What you're doing is not sharing an opinion. You know what you're doing. Now you're running away because you cannot present a single valid counter-argument. You cannot answer a single question I posed to you.

You can't use my own words against me

Hypocrisy at its finest.

Read up on falsifiability

He argued that the only way to verify a claim such as "All swans are white" would be if one could theoretically observe all swans, which is not possible. On the other hand, the falsifiability requirement for an anomalous instance, such as the observation of a single black swan, is theoretically reasonable and sufficient to logically falsify the claim.

Popper's idea to solve this problem is that while it is impossible to verify that every swan is white, finding a single black swan shows that not every swan is white. Such falsification uses the valid inference modus tollens: if from a law L we logically deduce Q, but what is observed is ¬Q, we infer that the law L is false. For example, given the statement L = "all swans are white", we can deduce Q = "the specific swan here is white", but if what is observed is ¬Q = "the specific swan here is not white" (say black), then "all swans are white" is false. More accurately, the statement Q that can be deduced is broken into an initial condition and a prediction as in C ⇒ P in which C = "the thing here is a swan" and P = the thing here is a white swan". If what is observed is C being true while P is false (formally, C ∧ ¬P), we can infer that the law is false.

Rejecting the intersubjective consensus about YH-5000SE's capability to sound natural and different from how you are describing it ≠ an opinion. If your claims were defensible, you’d address the raised arguments, not retreat. You're well aware of what you're doing, but fine, run away from a civil debate.

I got to hear the YH-5000SE you and 'so many' described, and then also got to experience a completely different YH-5000SE—one that you haven't experienced. That doesn't make me superior to you, it just allows me to share a perspective you've ignored and dismissed. An experience you called impossible.

Your posts are disguised as innocent, but it's apparent that you are trying to force a false narrative. And yes, it is false because you are aware of other listeners sharing opposing views, yet you dismiss them completely. It's very immature.

Thankfully, Head-Fi is a public forum, so your posts aren't going anywhere.

I've been hanging out in the Schiit Happened thread for 10 years or so (over 12,000 pages of comments). Not once have I seen people getting personal in their criticisms (at least that I remember). I've already seen multiple instances on this thread and we're only on page 2. I am enjoying this change of pace, but it probably isn't a good idea to continue this. It's just headphones
and stuff; Supposedly for our enjoyment. Peace my friends! Enjoy the music!

I'm not trying to get personal. My issue is with the absolutist claims being made here. Someone tested the YH-5000SE on a few expensive toys and is now presenting their limited experience as the definitive truth. Meanwhile, they’ve dismissed observations from others (including myself) that contradict their narrative. I am confronting them about it.

This guy did it in the YH-5000SE thread, and now continued it here. I am not going to sit here and watch him close this headphone in a box that I and others got it to break out of. It's a harmful misrepresentation of this headphone's sound performance.

Just look at his first post here. Read it. It's disgusting.

If he’d engage with counter-arguments instead of hiding behind empty claims, we could have a real conversation. Until then, I’ll keep advocating for what this headphone actually does, not what one person claims it can’t.

I never suppress or silence people's opinions. I've been intervening attempts to silence negative impressions for many years, in many threads. If your impressions are positive, negative, or anything in-between, share them! But don't try to assert superiority over others, that's when I will confront you about it. Just to clarify, I validate and accept his observations about YH-5000SE's sound performance. However, I don't condone turning your limited observations into absolutist claims. Can we agree that that's wrong?

We are a community, we enjoy music, then comes a fart that tries to tell you that only his ears are right and nothing outside that exists.

---

BACK TO DISCUSSING YAMAHA'S TWO UPCOMING HEADPHONES.

 

[SolarCetacean]

@voja you're sounding like a fanboy now. It's not a good look, and you'd do well to chill out. Kammerat's opinions on the YH-5K are not unusual. And if a headphone is so sensitive to chain that it sounds like a completely different headphone on another amp, then that itself is an attribute worthy of criticism. I have 4 wonderful headphones in my regular rotation. All of them sound great on every chain. Sure, there's still synergy at play here, and they'll sound slightly different on different chains, but their fundamental character remains enjoyable everywhere. If the YH-5K cannot do that, then that's a weakness, not a strength, no matter what sophistry you employ to justify it. And yes, I've read through your long sound impressions and even though you've found a good combo, there's no guarantee that if I heard the YH-5K on your chain that I'd come to the same conclusion as you. That's just the nature of headphones; two people can sit in the same room and listen to the same headphones on the same chain and come away with different conclusions. Also, Kammerat has stated in the other thread that he has a friend who loves the YH-5K; while he doesn't share that friend's view, he has acknowledged it, so don't go around saying that's he's trying to slander the product. He's offering criticism, just like anyone has the ability to do here.

---

Putting all of that behind me (hopefully), I'm looking forward to these headphones. To me, the YH-5K was like a concept car; it's strange and quirky and uses all sorts of impractical design elements as a statement of aspirations and technology demonstrator rather than a viable product. Comparing it to a car, it would be most like the Honda 0 Saloon that was unveiled a few months back. There's no chance that the Saloon will be a successful commercial model, but it's to show off a concept and maybe 10 years down the line some elements of it will show up in the Accord. Like there is no rear windshield on the Saloon, so you can't turn around to look out the back, and it has no side-mirrors (it uses cameras instead) so it wouldn't be road-legal in the US anyways.

The YH-5K is kind of like that car. It's got a really cool design (at least IMO), it's a demonstrator for the new orthodynamic driver, and it has some interesting sound qualities along with some sound oddities. Just like the 0 Saloon is one of the weirdest car concepts I've seen, the YH-5K is one of the weirdest headphones I've ever listened to. A cheaper headphone that builds on the investment in design, tooling, and manufacturing expertise from the YH-5K adventure will probably have a more normal tuning to appeal to a larger audience. The summit-tier is the best place to launch a brand-new product that's been developed from scratch as the margins are higher (faster recoup of development costs), fewer units get sold (easier on still-new production processes while they get through the initial teething period), and frankly, summit-tier audio customers are more tolerant of unusual tunings The Yamaha team has already shown that they can do good industrial design and comfort, and that their tuning has some compelling qualities. I'm looking forward to seeing and hearing what they can do with the framework they have.