[Merkurio]

@crinacle Hey, what do you think about the iSine 20 compared to Tier S- dogs like the EX1000 or Andromeda?

I'm also curious about the IMR R1 compared with those above, since I saw them in your tentative rank list recently.

 

[crinacle]

At the end of the day, this hobby has to be about the music, and the end result will always be subjective.
My problem is not with you, it is with the people that use these lists and rankings as the end all be all. We all have lists and rankings, its called personal preferences.
Yours just seem to held up as a bible by some of your fervent acolytes.
This is in no way a fault of yours, and again I am not blaming you.

I leave for a few hours to spend time with my family and I come back to you indirectly accusing me of being paid off by Sony and then directly accusing me of sending goons to a thread that I'm not subscribed to.

You say you're not blaming me here, but it's clear that you do and trying to make yourself a hero against an evil that doesn't exist.

I regret giving you my patience and time of day.

@crinacle Hey, what do you think about the iSine 20 compared to Tier S- dogs like the EX1000 or Andromeda?

I'm also curious about the IMR R1 compared with those above, since I saw them in your tentative rank list recently.

I'd personally still hold the EX1k and Andro to a higher regard simply because I find the DSP used in the Cipher cable to a little off as of now. The planar drivers used in the iSine/i4 series are stellar still, just needs a little fixing on the frequency domain is all.

As for the R1, I'll be making a post about that shortly. I love the bass response on them but the midrange tone can be a little iffy even on what I feel to be the best filters (blue or orange I think?). Overall resolution also wasn't quite up to par.

 

[UncleGrandpa]

That's exactly the case. Just to back you up here, Audeze have seem to indicate that they were aiming for sheer technical performance first and subjective audio quality second. The exact wording they use is that they ended up with not "perfect" response (still better than in most IEMs) but excellent behaving earphones. Which is basically code word for IEMs sound like hot trash but man do they measure well.

EQ works best with transducers that behave extremely well. Audeze iSINEs have vanishing low distortion so they're absolutely perfect cases for digital processing.

Yeah I knew that's what happened with the iSine, and I think that is a right decision from Audeze!

@crinacle Hey, what do you think about the iSine 20 compared to Tier S- dogs like the EX1000 or Andromeda?

I'm also curious about the IMR R1 compared with those above, since I saw them in your tentative rank list recently.

I used to own the EX1k for 3 months, and using the iSine 20 also in that time. For me, I think the EX1k hardly can hold a candle in technicalities to the huge planar driver of the iSine 20 (of course with the EQ applied).

 

[jeffreyw311]

The Sony EX1000 is a strange earphone that I've owned twice. With live recordings, which normally always sound decent because of auditorium acoustics smoothing everything, it sounds absolutely incredible. With most other stuff, most especially pop, the midrange is particularly honky and that 6khz spike is deadly. You mileage may vary greatly with it.

Its still one of the rare dynamic driver IEMs that isn't just warm mid-bass bloat and it can hit exceedingly hard if you find a physical or digital way to boost the sub-bass.

 

[BulldogXTRM]

I just listened to a 60,000 dollar McIntosh speaker system. 2 XRT2.1k floor speakers 2x(81 drivers).
It was highlighted as a modern technical achievement, supposedly no matter where you sit in front of the speakers you get to hear the same sound (irrespective of distance and height), an absolute cinematic and musical delicacy. It has all the bells and whistles you could ever dream of.
Everyone around me that got to listen to it, couldn't get enough of the specs and the breakthroughs in technology.


Impressive. Right.
Only....that it sounded like pure crap, a distorted, muddy, incoherant mess.
I heard every single one of those 162 different tiny speakers, and they collectively butchered the music.
I wouldn't pay 200 dollars for that system, let alone 60,000.
Now what good are technicalities, when the arrived at sound is a complete abomination to my ears?
And also is my perception of this system more valid than the others that were praising it?
Who decides?
Is it possible that the more gear you listen to, the more you get used to a particular sound, and that the further you enter into this world of comparing one piece of equipment against the other based on technicalities, what is forgotten and left behind is the most essential, the Music?
Now I do not like the KSE1500 or the Focal Utopia. They both sound harsh to my ears, and have almost zero musicality and flair.
To me they sound flat out boring. I wouldn't listen to them if given to me for free. But I can appreciate the fact that others love them dearly.
At the end of the day, this hobby has to be about the music, and the end result will always be subjective.
My problem is not with you, it is with the people that use these lists and rankings as the end all be all. We all have lists and rankings, its called personal preferences.
Yours just seem to held up as a bible by some of your fervent acolytes.
This is in no way a fault of yours, and again I am not blaming you.
The analogy is not about a chocolate cake and what dairy was used, how many layers, cocoa beans etc etc etc.
But simply, does it taste good.
And only the person eating it can decide.

@crinacle

And this is exactly the reason why graphs and reviews and other things should only be used as a guide, not the gospel.

As an example having owned the 64Audio U18t, and now buying the A18t, it truly is the best IEM I've ever heard. Even before delving into the audiophile world of high end gear, I was an audiophile and didn't realize it. My preferred flavor is a slight bass bump with neutral mids and a small 2-5k bump for clarity. The only thing I ever thought the U18t lacked is supposedly corrected in the A18t being a custom so this must be my perfect sound signature. What was crazy is that by accident I found that signature in an IEM that was less than $300 recently. I spoke with @crinacle via PM to see where he would rank this IEM and said somewhere in the B range. But I'll be darned to my ears, my physiology I would rank them probably in the S- category. The difference being I was looking at this from an subjective point of view not the objective/technical point of view.

My "miracle" find was the Fiio FH5. They were so dang close to the sound signature of the U18t to my ears, I had no reservation about selling the U18t and waiting until I had the funds to purchase the A18t, I had what IMO was the budget doppelganger in sound signature and sound quality in the FH5. Now was there a difference, of course, the U18t did have a bit more clarity, separation, the sound stage was a bit better, the decay was better, but the FH5 was so close, that I was amazed and now has me interested in buying the Fiio FA7 as soon as I can lay my hands on them. The other IEM that I also own that was very close to these two was also in the $300 range, the InEarz Zen2. It's 2 drivers and again I was shocked that it was able to compete with 18 drivers. The Zen4 it's bigger brother, was very good to - technically much better, but was off the mark for my preferred signature. On stage when I perform I use my InEarz Zen Euphoria, because I've never found a better IEM for stage monitoring. The sound signature is perfect on the stage with my wireless IEM setup. I've tried the U18t, the FH5, Unique Melody, Ultimate Ears, and countless others, but the Euphoria performs the best because of it's ability to resolve and it's particular sound signature. Not sure where it would rank on @crinacle list, but I would say it would also be somewhere in the B range. They're my preferred stage IEM because I don't have to EQ, and I don't like to EQ. I already have to adjust levels for each instrument as it is on stage for my monitoring mix, EQ'ing is just another thing to tweak that takes me away from what I enjoy and that's playing guitar on the stage.

Taste changes, hearing changes over time. I remember at one point in my teenage years I wanted to hear the sibilant sound of a bad tweeter when I hi-hat was struck that TSSS-TSSS sounded good to me. Today I get tired of it. So all of this is to say that it doesn't matter, all of these talk and measurements should be a guide just as @crinacle intended it to be, no one should be getting butt hurt. He has established a well defined criteria that if looked at is probably better than anyone else's in the audiophile world, technicality and he also has been transparent with his methodology. Use these measurements, rankings, reviews as a guide to make your decisions on what to purchase and what to listen for. Don't get caught up in the hype of one product over another, but pay attention. If there's hype around a product there's probably something to it. At the end of the day, take time to listen for yourself and decide what your wallet, taste in music, and what your intended purpose dictates whether it be personal enjoyment, critical listening, stage monitoring, etc.

 

[rockaphile21]

Hi Crin, I was looking for informations on the Soranik SP3 when I stumbled on your mini-review. But your review unit is a Soranik SK3. So, can you tell me if they are the same product? Is the isolation and comfort great, and can you compare them to Etymotic ER4XR (I'm deciding between ER3XR and the Soranik one but I guess all Ety's IEMs have the same exterior build). Thanks.

 

[BananaOoyoo]

Hey crin,

Have you heard about these yet? Supposed to be another est IEM - this time from soranik

 

[crinacle]

Hey crin,

Have you heard about these yet? Supposed to be another est IEM - this time from soranik

Yes, I have some non-production prototypes with me right now. Will talk about them once Soranik confirms the final tuning.

Hi Crin, I was looking for informations on the Soranik SP3 when I stumbled on your mini-review. But your review unit is a Soranik SK3. So, can you tell me if they are the same product? Is the isolation and comfort great, and can you compare them to Etymotic ER4XR (I'm deciding between ER3XR and the Soranik one but I guess all Ety's IEMs have the same exterior build). Thanks.

SP3 and SK3 are different, I think. SK3 technically doesn't exist so I'll be updating with the SP3 (which I have with me right now) instead.

 

[UncleGrandpa]

Yes, I have some non-production prototypes with me right now. Will talk about them once Soranik confirms the final tuning.



SP3 and SK3 are different, I think. SK3 technically doesn't exist so I'll be updating with the SP3 (which I have with me right now) instead.

Yeah, SP3 is the entirely new product from Soranik. It had one or two very positive reviews at first, but then some responded negatively to them. I also went for a listen, and the sound was quite odd, very very bright, sibilant. I'm looking forward for your opinion!

 

[nabeelkhan]

Good post, it's not unique to the Head-Fi. People get heated over something that in the grand scheme of life is NOT important. This is a hobby, a luxury pursuit, we aren't doing important world changing disease work here. As long as someone is respectful to you, no one should be butt hurt by someone else's opinion, we are after all just randoms on the internet.

I for one believe @crinacle is doing quite the service for the headphone community dedicating time to building this resource. I use my own judgement alongside looking at his list.

And this is exactly the reason why graphs and reviews and other things should only be used as a guide, not the gospel.

As an example having owned the 64Audio U18t, and now buying the A18t, it truly is the best IEM I've ever heard. Even before delving into the audiophile world of high end gear, I was an audiophile and didn't realize it. My preferred flavor is a slight bass bump with neutral mids and a small 2-5k bump for clarity. The only thing I ever thought the U18t lacked is supposedly corrected in the A18t being a custom so this must be my perfect sound signature. What was crazy is that by accident I found that signature in an IEM that was less than $300 recently. I spoke with @crinacle via PM to see where he would rank this IEM and said somewhere in the B range. But I'll be darned to my ears, my physiology I would rank them probably in the S- category. The difference being I was looking at this from an subjective point of view not the objective/technical point of view.

My "miracle" find was the Fiio FH5. They were so dang close to the sound signature of the U18t to my ears, I had no reservation about selling the U18t and waiting until I had the funds to purchase the A18t, I had what IMO was the budget doppelganger in sound signature and sound quality in the FH5. Now was there a difference, of course, the U18t did have a bit more clarity, separation, the sound stage was a bit better, the decay was better, but the FH5 was so close, that I was amazed and now has me interested in buying the Fiio FA7 as soon as I can lay my hands on them. The other IEM that I also own that was very close to these two was also in the $300 range, the InEarz Zen2. It's 2 drivers and again I was shocked that it was able to compete with 18 drivers. The Zen4 it's bigger brother, was very good to - technically much better, but was off the mark for my preferred signature. On stage when I perform I use my InEarz Zen Euphoria, because I've never found a better IEM for stage monitoring. The sound signature is perfect on the stage with my wireless IEM setup. I've tried the U18t, the FH5, Unique Melody, Ultimate Ears, and countless others, but the Euphoria performs the best because of it's ability to resolve and it's particular sound signature. Not sure where it would rank on @crinacle list, but I would say it would also be somewhere in the B range. They're my preferred stage IEM because I don't have to EQ, and I don't like to EQ. I already have to adjust levels for each instrument as it is on stage for my monitoring mix, EQ'ing is just another thing to tweak that takes me away from what I enjoy and that's playing guitar on the stage.

Taste changes, hearing changes over time. I remember at one point in my teenage years I wanted to hear the sibilant sound of a bad tweeter when I hi-hat was struck that TSSS-TSSS sounded good to me. Today I get tired of it. So all of this is to say that it doesn't matter, all of these talk and measurements should be a guide just as @crinacle intended it to be, no one should be getting butt hurt. He has established a well defined criteria that if looked at is probably better than anyone else's in the audiophile world, technicality and he also has been transparent with his methodology. Use these measurements, rankings, reviews as a guide to make your decisions on what to purchase and what to listen for. Don't get caught up in the hype of one product over another, but pay attention. If there's hype around a product there's probably something to it. At the end of the day, take time to listen for yourself and decide what your wallet, taste in music, and what your intended purpose dictates whether it be personal enjoyment, critical listening, stage monitoring, etc.

 

[Colors]

Good post, it's not unique to the Head-Fi. People get heated over something that in the grand scheme of life is NOT important. This is a hobby, a luxury pursuit, we aren't doing important world changing disease work here. As long as someone is respectful to you, no one should be butt hurt by someone else's opinion, we are after all just randoms on the internet.

I for one believe @crinacle is doing quite the service for the headphone community dedicating time to building this resource. I use my own judgement alongside looking at his list.

Ya seriously. I follow this list very closely as it matches my preferences quite a bit and has proven to be true throughout my purchases. However, I still listen to Planamics very frequently despite crinacle giving it a D.

 

[Sound Eq]

i am planning on selling my empire ears legend x, and its so tough to make buying decisions without being able to audition

so here I would like your recs for best of the best price no objection
1- must have great bass something similar to legend x, maybe a tad more controlled
2- must have full rich mids, without being affected by bass, mids must be detailed full and rich
3- must has good details, but not to have any harshness
4- big sound stage
5- musical

I listen to all genres but i am not into classical

my source is AK SE100

any ideas, i am leaning to 64audio trio, but i would like to hear more thoughts

 

[BulldogXTRM]

i am planning on selling my empire ears legend x, and its so tough to make buying decisions without being able to audition

so here I would like your recs for best of the best price no objection
1- must have great bass something similar to legend x, maybe a tad more controlled
2- must have full rich mids, without being affected by bass, mids must be detailed full and rich
3- must has good details, but not to have any harshness
4- big sound stage
5- musical

I listen to all genres but i am not into classical

my source is AK SE100

any ideas, i am leaning to 64audio trio, but i would like to hear more thoughts

This sounds like every Jerry Harvey universal IEM I've ever listened too. The Roxanne would be spot on to what you described. The 64Audio Trio would be close to this, but if you really want good bass with 64Audio go with the U12t or the Forte. Both of those would fit the bill. The Forte however is source dependant where the U12t has tech that maintains its sound signature.

 

[eldss]

i am planning on selling my empire ears legend x, and its so tough to make buying decisions without being able to audition

so here I would like your recs for best of the best price no objection
1- must have great bass something similar to legend x, maybe a tad more controlled
2- must have full rich mids, without being affected by bass, mids must be detailed full and rich
3- must has good details, but not to have any harshness
4- big sound stage
5- musical

I listen to all genres but i am not into classical

my source is AK SE100

any ideas, i am leaning to 64audio trio, but i would like to hear more thoughts

From memory, Trio is more controlled than the Legend X and it doesn't bleed into the mids like I felt the X did. I personally preferred my A12t to the Trio to be honest. I'd recommend the U12t since I know you prefer universals, but I just couldn't get them to sound close to the custom version. I tried several tips and have experience w/ 64 universals, but for some reason, I couldn't get them to match or come close in my opinion.

 

[crinacle]

i am planning on selling my empire ears legend x, and its so tough to make buying decisions without being able to audition

so here I would like your recs for best of the best price no objection
1- must have great bass something similar to legend x, maybe a tad more controlled
2- must have full rich mids, without being affected by bass, mids must be detailed full and rich
3- must has good details, but not to have any harshness
4- big sound stage
5- musical

I listen to all genres but i am not into classical

my source is AK SE100

any ideas, i am leaning to 64audio trio, but i would like to hear more thoughts

If you're coming from the Legend X, I'd recommend a hybrid at very least. Trio is a good pick and probably Trinity Brass as well, can't really think of any others for now. Fourte is too sharp, Khan is too thin, N8 could work but bleeds in custom form, and the IER-Z1R is a risky pick due to rumours of a non-final tuning in demo units.