[BruceBanner]

Thats pretty much the same as every dap, every iem, every amp, every iem tip. Some say good some say not some say average some say the best.

 
I'm kinda hinting that tho with the C2 and the PD, both are Cowon, both carry same DSPs, so with all things being equal, same headphones, same settings used, is the sound quality different, and if so by how much?

 

[sledgeharvy]

That's what I'm saying, some say it's the same, some better, some say marginally better, others say a lot better.

I've owned both the Plenue D and the AK Jr.. In terms of sound, it's subjective. But honesty.. The AK Jr is better. You get way more details and spacious sound. In addition, you get a cleaner better soundscape than the Plenue D.
The Plenue D is a great player don't misunderand me, I just just wanted to make sure people don't go over board in saying it's better than the AK Jr..
I get the fact that the Plenue D has more customization options, to tailor the sound.. But if you do too much, you get a very artificial sound. On the AK Jr, it always sound very natural. I am a detail freak, I love hearing the echo in the reverb of a guitar on Heavy Metal, in general, you can never hear that, especially newer modern Death/Progressive Death Metal, ultras compressed music, so to listen to that genre and still hear the ring in a tom or echo of the room the drums were being played in is a rarity.. One that the Plenue D doesn't offer.
What the Plenue D does excel at, is vibrant visceral bass. That is one area the Ak Jr fails at in a direct comparison. That's not to say the AK Jr is completely lacking bass.. It is thick, but its a natural bass, it's not that sub-woofer in your carnbass that can be produced on the Plenue D which by the way, the Bass response on the Plenue D is pretty much 2nd to none in my book. I haven't used another placer that has that kind of Bass quantity. And in that regards, sure, the Plenue D is better than the AK Jr.. But with most genres, that heavy bass isn't conducive to good sound.

 

[Hi-Fi'er]

I've owned both the Plenue D and the AK Jr.. In terms of sound, it's subjective. But honesty.. The AK Jr is better. You get way more details and spacious sound. In addition, you get a cleaner better soundscape than the Plenue D.
The Plenue D is a great player don't misunderand me, I just just wanted to make sure people don't go over board in saying it's better than the AK Jr..
I get the fact that the Plenue D has more customization options, to tailor the sound.. But if you do too much, you get a very artificial sound. On the AK Jr, it always sound very natural. I am a detail freak, I love hearing the echo in the reverb of a guitar on Heavy Metal, in general, you can never hear that, especially newer modern Death/Progressive Death Metal, ultras compressed music, so to listen to that genre and still hear the ring in a tom or echo of the room the drums were being played in is a rarity.. One that the Plenue D doesn't offer.
What the Plenue D does excel at, is vibrant visceral bass

1. [img]http://cdn.head-fi.org/4/48/100x100px-LS-487884fe_20160324_183621.jpeg[/img]

1. jmills8
2.  

<This member does not agree the Jr. was better.

I would never buy the Jr. I demoed it three times.


 
 

 

[sledgeharvy]

1. 
   [FLOAT=LEFT][img]http://cdn.head-fi.org/4/48/100x100px-LS-487884fe_20160324_183621.jpeg[/img]
   [/FLOAT]
   

1. jmills8
2.  

I would never buy the Jr. I demoed it three times.






:blink:

Jmills, I understand most people have an issue with the customer service or technically, the lack there of, in reference to Astell & Kern.. Or maybe even the supposed lag in thebUI, another thing I never experienced.. I found myselfnreally liking both the AK Jr and Plenue D for completely different reasons.. So depending on what your music genre is, or personal preference is towards sound signature or just soundscape I'm general, younwill either love it or hate it.. But, that doesn't mean someone else will love it or hatred it for the same reasons you did. Let people give a player a shot. Explain to us why the AK Jr didn't work out fornyou 3 separate times. Perhaps that would've been more helpful.

 

[Raketen]

I've owned both the Plenue D and the AK Jr.. In terms of sound, it's subjective. But honesty.. The AK Jr is better. You get way more details... In addition, you get a cleaner better soundscape than the Plenue D.
What the Plenue D does excel at, is vibrant visceral bass. That is one area the Ak Jr fails at in a direct comparison.

I didn't get to compare them directly (keep posting then deleting my thoughts because I don't really want to argue about it), but +1 to this.
IDK "better"- de gustibus non est disputandum - but I definitely preferred it even taking Cowon EQ into consideration.

That said I found the experience of using Jr. to be borderline hateful and traded it away after a few weeks

 

 

[jmills8]

Jmills, I understand most people have an issue with the customer service or technically, the lack there of, in reference to Astell & Kern.. Or maybe even the supposed lag in thebUI, another thing I never experienced.. I found myselfnreally liking both the AK Jr and Plenue D for completely different reasons.. So depending on what your music genre is, or personal preference is towards sound signature or just soundscape I'm general, younwill either love it or hate it.. But, that doesn't mean someone else will love it or hatred it for the same reasons you did. Let people give a player a shot. Explain to us why the AK Jr didn't work out fornyou 3 separate times. Perhaps that would've been more helpful.

I had the 100, 120, and 240.

 

[hypersonic]

I've owned both the Plenue D and the AK Jr.. In terms of sound, it's subjective. But honesty.. The AK Jr is better. You get way more details and spacious sound. In addition, you get a cleaner better soundscape than the Plenue D.
The Plenue D is a great player don't misunderand me, I just just wanted to make sure people don't go over board in saying it's better than the AK Jr..
I get the fact that the Plenue D has more customization options, to tailor the sound.. But if you do too much, you get a very artificial sound. On the AK Jr, it always sound very natural. I am a detail freak, I love hearing the echo in the reverb of a guitar on Heavy Metal, in general, you can never hear that, especially newer modern Death/Progressive Death Metal, ultras compressed music, so to listen to that genre and still hear the ring in a tom or echo of the room the drums were being played in is a rarity.. One that the Plenue D doesn't offer.
What the Plenue D does excel at, is vibrant visceral bass. That is one area the Ak Jr fails at in a direct comparison. That's not to say the AK Jr is completely lacking bass.. It is thick, but its a natural bass, it's not that sub-woofer in your carnbass that can be produced on the Plenue D which by the way, the Bass response on the Plenue D is pretty much 2nd to none in my book. I haven't used another placer that has that kind of Bass quantity. And in that regards, sure, the Plenue D is better than the AK Jr.. But with most genres, that heavy bass isn't conducive to good sound.

Did you try the D without EQ on?
I understood a fact that eq is a must on this player. 
Without it, I would even describe it's sound BAD. Just like what you said, mushy, lack of details.
If you don't like tweaking it too much, just put it in "BBE" and leave it there.
That's what I do. I am never a eq guy. 

 

[jmills8]

Jmills, I understand most people have an issue with the customer service or technically, the lack there of, in reference to Astell & Kern.. Or maybe even the supposed lag in thebUI, another thing I never experienced.. I found myselfnreally liking both the AK Jr and Plenue D for completely different reasons.. So depending on what your music genre is, or personal preference is towards sound signature or just soundscape I'm general, younwill either love it or hate it.. But, that doesn't mean someone else will love it or hatred it for the same reasons you did. Let people give a player a shot. Explain to us why the AK Jr didn't work out fornyou 3 separate times. Perhaps that would've been more helpful.

So you are using the Jr. Cause its such a great dap?

 

[Raketen]

  Did you try the D without EQ on?
I understood a fact that eq is a must on this player. 
Without it, I would even describe it's sound BAD. Just like what you said, mushy, lack of details.
If you don't like tweaking it too much, just put it in "BBE" and leave it there.
That's what I do. I am never a eq guy. 

As useful as the EQ on the D is, I'm not sure if it is capable of matching the character difference between sources past a certain point, not to mention the measurable differences like output power and such.

 

[hypersonic]

  As useful as the EQ on the D is, I'm not sure if it is capable of matching the character difference between sources past a certain point, not to mention the measurable differences like output power and such.

The point I was trying to make is the D only shows it true performance with EQ on.
So to compare it with other players fairly, people should at least turn the eq on (even without any extra tweak).
I do not believe it's the most amazing sounding thing ever. In fact, I just compared the D with my humble desktop setup on the same headphone, it doesn't stand a chance. 
It certainly could be not as good as some other portable players. 
I still admire it as a very very good portable music device though. That battery is insane! 

 

[jmills8]

The point I was trying to make is the D only shows it true performance with EQ on.
So to compare it with other players fairly, people should at least turn the eq on (even without any extra tweak).
I do not believe it's the most amazing sounding thing ever. In fact, I just compared the D with my humble desktop setup on the same headphone, it doesn't stand a chance. 
I still admire it as a very very good portable music device though. That battery is insane! 

I use all the powers I bought. AK 120 and 240 have bad eq though

 

[Paulus XII]

   
I'm kinda hinting that tho with the C2 and the PD, both are Cowon, both carry same DSPs, so with all things being equal, same headphones, same settings used, is the sound quality different, and if so by how much?

 
Because the D uses a 192/24 Wolfson DAC. Seriously, the D plays in a different league.

 

[sledgeharvy]

I didn't get to compare them directly (keep posting then deleting my thoughts because I don't really want to argue about it), but +1 to this.

IDK "better"- de gustibus non est disputandum - but I definitely preferred it even taking Cowon EQ into consideration.


That said I found the experience of using Jr. to be borderline hateful and traded it away after a few weeks  

I never want to argue in this site. Everyone has their own opinion, earphones, and personal tastes as to what is "Perfect" for them. What works for me, won't work for you, you equipment, and personal tastes.

I personally loved it, it really made a good impression on me. For me, my music, my earphones, my personal tastes, it works. I feel like it's priced accordingly. Now, ask me about the AK120, 240, 380, That's a whole other topic. Those are priced very high, possibly justified in their eyes and the people who own those products. I just can't justify spending that much when I feel very good about products like the Shanling M2, Plenue D, and iBasso DX80.. They have great sound, and do it at a relatively affordable price range.

 

[sledgeharvy]

So you are using the Jr. Cause its such a great dap?

I'm sure you can read my justification as I posted above to Raketen. But I feel the need to respond to you as well, as you are a person I have a lot of respect for.

As you know through experience, everyone has different earphones, that range from 4ohms to 300 ohms (yes, there's higher and lower, job st saying in general.) Furthermore, each earphone is either dark, warm, neutral, bright, or even hot as their sound signature. Those two contributing factors are already a big enough reason/detractor or proponent to like or dislike a specific DAP.

For me, and my equipment, I absolutely love the AK Jr. But I can't stay monogamous to one DAP, which is not the Players fault, it's my own curiosity's fault. Right now in terms of overal sound the Shanling M2 has my heart, but I consider the AK Jr to be right there with it, then coming in 3rd place is the DX80, and then the Plenue D holding the 4th place position. It's not that it's bad, it's just there are others that offer sound more suited to my personal tastes and preferences with my earphones.

I'm sorry the AK Jr wasn't right for you 3 separate times, as I vaguely recall, you had the same experience with the DX80, you owned it 3 separate times as well. Hoping the firmware bugs would be resolved.. Sadly haven't been amended, as of writing this (March 28'th) But unlike Astell & Kern, at least iBasso is actively trying to fix those issues. Honestly, they've made headway, but still aren't there yet.

I just pulled the trigger on the Shanling M5, because of the specs alone, AK4490, Muses8920, and the AD8610 leading to the Buf634.. By the way, Dualed out.. So that should be an interesting listen. I may get it, and find that it's not worth twice as much relative to the M2 for my equipment and personal tastes, but that doesn't mean it's a bad player, for someone else and their equipment.

I just hope you understand my reasoning for making the statements I've made. I am not trying to start any arguments. Just felt like there was a lot of bashing of equipment going on, where I felt it was a little unnecessary to do so. So I chimed in with my two pence.

 

[sledgeharvy]

Did you try the D without EQ on?
I understood a fact that eq is a must on this player. 
Without it, I would even describe it's sound BAD. Just like what you said, mushy, lack of details.
If you don't like tweaking it too much, just put it in "BBE" and leave it there.
That's what I do. I am never a eq guy. 

Lol.. Yes, I definitely used the Plenue D with and without any EQ/BBE/JetFx, I have consistently stated it is a very good player and has a brilliant sound. I sincerely feel like it has a very fun energetic sound quality to it. Nothing wrong with that.. Then you add in the UI and other features that are absolutely unique to the Plenue D, like the AB loop, or rewinding between songs because the ending of songs are always the best. Those are reasons I absolutely love the Plenue D amongst others, I just feel like other players provided me with a sound more suitable to more critical listening (for my equipment, my personal tastes). I still highly recommend this product to plenty of people I come in contact with. I do feel it's a fantastic player.