[scootermafia]

It's the same chip but I guess Kingwa renamed it, different implementation as the chip is programmable. They serve entirely different purposes in different products.

Yeah, the Diverter has some high tech stuff to purify the incoming USB power. I'll be trying out the Diverter pretty soon, I trust Lee as he's handled more gear than I ever have or will and thus his opinions are more informed. I'd like to A/B it against a Squeezebox or even a Transporter, though.

 

[Pricklely Peete]

It might be the Cyclone III revision from Altera. It's been around for a while now. The RE1 uses the older Cyclone II rev. I'm not sure there is any difference between the two without studying the data sheets of both. Then again I could be full of beans on this one......taking a wild guess in other words.

Peete.

 

[tosehee]

Peete.

Isn't there more chance of missing a 1s and 0s from the CD7 than computer based transport?

 

[Pricklely Peete]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tosehee /img/forum/go_quote.gif Peete. Isn't there more chance of missing a 1s and 0s from the CD7 than computer based transport?

Nope....the CD7 use's a DVD-ROM/RAM drive (SONY). There is way too much noisy stuff in a comp based system that impacts the data stream in a negative fashion....I really wish I could bring the CD7 over so you can hear for yourself the vast difference it makes vs the Comp Transport.

Peete.

 

[tosehee]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pricklely Peete /img/forum/go_quote.gif Nope....the CD7 use's a DVD-ROM/RAM drive (SONY). There is way too much noisy stuff in a comp based system that impacts the data stream in a negative fashion....I really wish I could bring the CD7 over so you can hear for yourself the vast difference it makes vs the Comp Transport. Peete.

Yah. Wish you could.

But, don't you get more chance of CD scratches affecting the reading of 1s and 0s?

 

[Pricklely Peete]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tosehee /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yah. Wish you could. But, don't you get more chance of CD scratches affecting the reading of 1s and 0s?

Yup...one of the drawbacks for sure...luckily I archive the hard copy and burn a second for regular use. When that CDR gets banged up I simply burn another one. Most of my collection is in great condition with very few scratched retail copies. I'm really careful with any of the media I use....habit from the Vinyl days (to make sure things remain in as good a condition as possible).

Peete.

 

[tosehee]

If I use the Ref3 between the macpro (optical out) and Ref1, would it reduce the jitters?

Put another way, would the DSP-3 in Ref3 function as a master clock and provide the cleaner/lower jitters to Ref1?

Or would I get even more jitter with this setup?

Mac Pro -> Optical out -> Ref3 (24/96) -> Ref1 (24/96)

 

[some1x]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tosehee /img/forum/go_quote.gif If I use the Ref3 between the macpro (optical out) and Ref1, would it reduce the jitters? Put another way, would the DSP-3 in Ref3 function as a master clock and provide the cleaner/lower jitters to Ref1? Or would I get even more jitter with this setup? Mac Pro -> Optical out -> Ref3 (24/96) -> Ref1 (24/96)

I wouldn't bother with Ref 3 in is application. Look at Lynx AES16, Empirical Off Ramp Turbo, Weiss Vesta ($$$$), or something of that caliber.

 

[XXII]

I bought a ref-3 partly because I needed some jitter attenuation for my lowly squeezebox and also because I had a few sources that I wanted to connect to my DAC.

I already had a Monarchy DIP superdrive which I felt made a noticeable difference. On replacing the Monarchy DIP with the Ref-3 it immediately made a huge difference with the clarity of the lows and highs. (Although I haven't done a detailed A/B comparison yet).

The effect on the bass drum in particular was the most noticeable. The sound was more crisp and sharp and just more real.

In fact, the ref-3 made SUCH a difference that I initially couldn't believe it. I thought there was something wrong with the signal.

All in all, I think it's a good product that is worth it's asking price. All these impressions are with no upsampling. I don't really feel it's right to upsample the signal from the Ref-3 but Kingwa is of the opinion that it sounds better upsampled. I personally think that the differences are minor.

 

[tosehee]

I asked the same question to kingwa, and here is the response.

Dear Lee,
A lot people think the Jitter is the only reason let the sound bad or good.
But I don't think so. Except Jitter, there is a lot reason let SQ bad. So you can see, all high End DAC, connect to a cheapest DVD player and a high End CDP, sound much different, if the jitter is only one reason, not a lot DAC can reduce jitter, why there are still a lot CD transmit still sale high price.
Except Jitter, I think other reason like the output digital wave (sorry I can't correct describe this in English) if follow the original wave can effect the sound, and other like clock phase noise, clock wave,ect.
But RE3 only for mid/low grade source to upgrade SQ, if the source already good, RE3 maybe let the sound become bad.
Kingwa


Can someone decipher this for me?

 

[AtomikPi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tosehee /img/forum/go_quote.gif I asked the same question to kingwa, and here is the response. Dear Lee, A lot people think the Jitter is the only reason let the sound bad or good. But I don't think so. Except Jitter, there is a lot reason let SQ bad. So you can see, all high End DAC, connect to a cheapest DVD player and a high End CDP, sound much different, if the jitter is only one reason, not a lot DAC can reduce jitter, why there are still a lot CD transmit still sale high price. Except Jitter, I think other reason like the output digital wave (sorry I can't correct describe this in English) if follow the original wave can effect the sound, and other like clock phase noise, clock wave,ect. But RE3 only for mid/low grade source to upgrade SQ, if the source already good, RE3 maybe let the sound become bad. Kingwa Can someone decipher this for me?

Well, first he says that it's only worthwhile if you don't have a high end transport already since they produce lower jitter or if you have a high end dac since they have better jitter protection and better optical implementation than the RE3.
I see no reason to believe that you're better off with the RE3 in between since the RE1's optical implementation is presumably of a high quality. If you were using a lower caliber DAC, he claims it would then be worthwhile. I think you would be degrading quality if you used the RE3 with RE1 because you're sticking an extra box in the signal path - at the very least it wouldn't improve the signal.

 

[tosehee]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AtomikPi /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well, first he says that it's only worthwhile if you don't have a high end transport already since they produce lower jitter or if you have a high end dac since they have better jitter protection and better optical implementation than the RE3. I see no reason to believe that you're better off with the RE3 in between since the RE1's optical implementation is presumably of a high quality. If you were using a lower caliber DAC, he claims it would then be worthwhile. I think you would be degrading quality if you used the RE3 with RE1 because you're sticking an extra box in the signal path - at the very least it wouldn't improve the signal.

Thanks.

 

[Currawong]

Interesting. Because I intend to use a computer as my source, regardless, it was worth it for me, making an improvement over my PCLink II. It's also $1000 or so cheaper than an RME Fireface 400 or Logitech Transporter, which would have been more ideal purchases.

 

[some1x]

You could get an Empirical Off Ramp for not much more. You get 24/96 support, probably better implementation of USB->SPDIF, and native I2S support.

For cheaper firewire, there is Focusrite Saffire, which is supposed to be pretty good and supports high-res.

I'm not sure the Ref-3 has much value as a pure USB->SPDIF converter if you have a good DAC (i.e., one with good reclocking). I'd just get a HagUsb instead, if all I cared about was 44.1.

 

[tim3320070]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Currawong /img/forum/go_quote.gif Interesting. Because I intend to use a computer as my source, regardless, it was worth it for me, making an improvement over my PCLink II. It's also $1000 or so cheaper than an RME Fireface 400 or Logitech Transporter, which would have been more ideal purchases.

I didn't see a review from you, can you comment on the improvements you found?