Cayin i5 Lossless Android DAP with AKM4490 DAC supporting 32/384 PCM + 64/128 DSD
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nmatheis

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Not trying to diss you @JaeYoon. We've had several pleasant PM conversations, and I've grown to enjoy these and your contributions here on HeadFi.

With that said, I personally think your post used melodramatic language that could enflame people. As with many, I wish circumstances were different and that i5 could see further development because it's my favorite design of any DAP running Android that I've tried to date and I'm really looking forward to seeing what Cayin brings to the table with their next attempt at an Android DAP. However, my i5 is pretty darn functional albeit with a few minor bugs, so I took exception to your verbiage is all. No offense intended, bro.

:vulcan:
 
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Not trying to diss you @JaeYoon. We've had several pleasant PM conversations, and I've grown to enjoy these and your contributions here on HeadFi.

With that said, I personally think your post used melodramatic language that could enflame people. As with many, I wish circumstances were different and that i5 could see further development because it's my favorite design of any DAP running Android that I've tried to date and I'm really looking forward to seeing what Cayin brings to the table with their next attempt at an Android DAP. However, my i5 is pretty darn functional albeit with a few minor bugs, so I took exception to your verbiage is all. No offense intended, bro.

:vulcan:
Sorry. :c I like you too! I would like i5 to have further development as well. It is one of the most beautiful made daps I've seen. I've never seen carbon fiber back, pictures won't display it like how it is in person. It's very high quality and reflective.

You have no doubt, I will be there when N5ii comes out in december!!! I also heavily support chi-fi companies like Shanling, Cayin. They have great products and their customer service is phenominal.

Andykong even mentioned he will bother to ask his engineers if implementing the Opus codec (I asked if that would be possible, did not think it would be worth a try) for those of us who like using lossy formats. Or in places where 400 sd card might be too expensive. A low cost SD card with transparency and limited space must be utilized in efficient manner. That's something that's above and beyond for me. No other company I know does something like that, as they are mostly focused on FLAC and hi-res
 
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@Brooko @nmatheis @JaeYoon

Cayin is so lucky to have sincere users like you around. Its easy enough to support a product when it is a rising star, or when it is an irreplaceable winner. Cayin had put in a lot of effort to this DAP since mid 2015 when we pull the product development team together. Too bad we had run into situation where we are not fully controlled and i5 is not as perfect as it was anticipated. I use i5 regularly right now, IMHO its is still one of the best Android DAP at its price range, it does a lot of things right, things that are important to me as a Jazz and Canton-pop lover. It has a bit of inconvenient here and there so I don't blame others when they are unhappy with i5. On the other hands, users who gave i5 and Cayin a fair chance are priceless.

JaeYoon has been very supportive to me and to i5, I understand her (his) language and I thank her (him) wholeheartedly. We have PM covering i5, N3 and N5ii, and I am still waiting for the lead Engineer's feedback as he shall evaluate whether we can support OGG Opus Codec with the current N5ii hardware design. Anyone who read JaeYoon's impression will notice her (his) humor and unique approach to explain (and resolve) complicated/abstract concepts, maybe that's why I didn't take her (his) comment with hard feeling, in fact I own her (him) a flavour because she (he) really has helped me out so that I don't have to repeat what I said previously.

Paul, I am glad that you like i5. The DAP arrived a bit late, I think we shouldn't have put you in the last of the tour group because a lot of users would definitely want to hear your impression. I'll make sure I correct my mistake when we start the N5ii tour.

Nikolaus, I still remember the day when you start the i5 thread, I told my CEO that it could have been anyone after we displayed the Engineering sample of i5 at Munich High End Show 2016, and I am glad that you did it because, as I told my CEO, if I were to invite someone to kick start a product thread for us, you will be my first choice. :beerchug:

Before I go to bed, I want to share my new toy with you all as I am really excited about it, and it is the highlight of my recent i5 venture .... I use my i5 very frequent recently. :ksc75smile:

20171006_133404.jpg
 
Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor profile on Head-Fi.
 
http://en.cayin.cn/
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As a "bad guy" of the thread I want to say one thing. There are some bugs in current firmware. But perfect sound quality compensate ALL of them. Maybe someday we will see new version of Hiby, maybe not. This DAP has unique API and this is the reason why Neutron devs can't port player. But maybe it is the same reason we have perfect sound? :) Sorry for my English and good luck to all!
 
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JaeYoon

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@Brooko @nmatheis @JaeYoon

Cayin is so lucky to have sincere users like you around. Its easy enough to support a product when it is a rising star, or when it is an irreplaceable winner. Cayin had put in a lot of effort to this DAP since mid 2015 when we pull the product development team together. Too bad we had run into situation where we are not fully controlled and i5 is not as perfect as it was anticipated. I use i5 regularly right now, IMHO its is still one of the best Android DAP at its price range, it does a lot of things right, things that are important to me as a Jazz and Canton-pop lover. It has a bit of inconvenient here and there so I don't blame others when they are unhappy with i5. On the other hands, users who gave i5 and Cayin a fair chance are priceless.

JaeYoon has been very supportive to me and to i5, I understand her (his) language and I thank her (him) wholeheartedly. We have PM covering i5, N3 and N5ii, and I am still waiting for the lead Engineer's feedback as he shall evaluate whether we can support OGG Opus Codec with the current N5ii hardware design. Anyone who read JaeYoon's impression will notice her (his) humor and unique approach to explain (and resolve) complicated/abstract concepts, maybe that's why I didn't take her (his) comment with hard feeling, in fact I own her (him) a flavour because she (he) really has helped me out so that I don't have to repeat what I said previously.

Paul, I am glad that you like i5. The DAP arrived a bit late, I think we shouldn't have put you in the last of the tour group because a lot of users would definitely want to hear your impression. I'll make sure I correct my mistake when we start the N5ii tour.

Nikolaus, I still remember the day when you start the i5 thread, I told my CEO that it could have been anyone after we displayed the Engineering sample of i5 at Munich High End Show 2016, and I am glad that you did it because, as I told my CEO, if I were to invite someone to kick start a product thread for us, you will be my first choice. :beerchug:

Before I go to bed, I want to share my new toy with you all as I am really excited about it, and it is the highlight of my recent i5 venture .... I use my i5 very frequent recently. :ksc75smile:

OMG, enjoy Snow White Andromeda!!!!
Enjoy your night!
 
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As a "bad guy" of the thread I want to say one thing. There are some bugs in current firmware. But perfect sound quality compensate ALL of them. Maybe someday we will see new version of Hiby, maybe not. This DAP has unique API and this is the reason why Neutron devs can't port player. But maybe it is the same reason we have perfect sound? :) Sorry for my English and good luck to all!
I'm running Neutron on the i5, or do you mean something else?
 
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I'm running Neutron on the i5, or do you mean something else?
Andy is working with Neutron to have a generic driver to bypass SRC.

Just like fiio X5III and dx200 is fully supported with generic driver. It's more of a peace of mind for others so they know there isn't a android conversion rate going on while music is playing.
 
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@Andykong - Thanks for the kind words. It's been my pleasure to help spread the word about Cayin because you guys make great products and provide fantastic support for users on this forum. I hope to meet again one of these days. After our last exchange, I'm highly considering going to CanJam New York.

Cheers to one of HeadFi's true gentlemen!
leo-toast-9.w529.h352.gif
 
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@Andykong - Thanks for the kind words. It's been my pleasure to help spread the word about Cayin because you guys make great products and provide fantastic support for users on this forum. I hope to meet again one of these days. After our last exchange, I'm highly considering going to CanJam New York.

Cheers to one of HeadFi's true gentlemen!
yeah, not many places on headfi, you can pm a company with ideas to include in FW or features that could be implemented.
Andykong actually makes an effort to see how feasible it is and work out ways to make it happen.

95% of other companies will want to see how profitable or if the idea is extremely popular to implement if it's not a bugfix.

Andy and cayin got feedback for N5ii Gold wheel was too bling bling looking and it detracted people from wanting the dap. And a nice beautiful silver wheel was implemented to make the DAP look classy and low profile at same time.
 
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As a "bad guy" of the thread I want to say one thing. There are some bugs in current firmware. But perfect sound quality compensate ALL of them. Maybe someday we will see new version of Hiby, maybe not. This DAP has unique API and this is the reason why Neutron devs can't port player. But maybe it is the same reason we have perfect sound? :) Sorry for my English and good luck to all!
As I said, I don't blame others when they are unhappy with i5, they have their reasons to feel discontent with i5. Share your issues, tell everyone exactly what are the problem that make you feel so bad about i5, if you are sharing your experience, no one will stop you, I can promise you that. Its most unfortunate that I can't grasp your problems after your numerous negative statements towards Cayin:
Is there any news about firmware updates? They told me "Buy Cayin, It has super support service!" Oh, I see it rigth now...
Yeah... It's normal for this kind of companies. The motto "We have new model! Give us your money!" and they stop support for old devices
Maybe device was blocked? If so It's well known problem. And nobody will help us I suppose...
There is no support for Cayin I5 anymore. If you have some problem - it's your problem. If it is hardware problem - go to service. If not you ought to live with it )))
One question.
Why does the company not report this officially on their website ?! If they had been officially informed about this, I would have bought the newest FiiO model instead of the unpromising Cayin I5 with a bunch of errors in the HiBy player. Just a disregard for potential customers...
I have read all you posts in i5 thread, other then mentioning Neutron support, I really don't know the reasons behind all these. I am here to help, I try to provide support to Cayin's users as much as we should, but I can't do anything if I only see a bunch of hard feeling without quoting any problem specifically. You might be alarmed by @bluedolphin repeated complaint on i5, I hope you have read all the way back and notice his pattern. Maybe you are not aware that in one occasion when his i5 has drained its battery, he wrote 25 email on a Sunday morning within 1 hour to complaint about our product, our service, our integrity, literally everything. threading to sue us, and complaint us to the consumer council in his country, we cheat him with a bad product and he'll make sure we pay for that, etc etc. The last email we received from him was an apology saying he charged his i5 and it worked again. Our company has decided to enforce a new service pledge because of that abuse instance. Check out the history if you think we have not been providing support to i5 users because of his complaint.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cay...-pcm-64-128-dsd.802382/page-232#post-13756101

By the way, if you believe Fiio offers better service and less bug, by all means you should try their products or at least read through their product discussion. They offers competitive products and is a market leader, and I am not surprised that users will switch among the "popular" sub-1K DAP brands such as Fiio, Shanling, Opus or even our partner HiBy Music as they are going to release R6, a new Android DAP that deserve serious attention.
 
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Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor profile on Head-Fi.
 
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As I said, I don't blame others when they are unhappy with i5, they have their reasons to feel discontent with i5. Share your issues, tell everyone exactly what are the problem that make you feel so bad about i5, if you are sharing your experience, no one will stop you, I can promise you that. Its most unfortunate that I can't grasp your problems after your numerous negative statements towards Cayin:





I have read all you posts in i5 thread, other then mentioning Neutron support, I really don't know the reasons behind all these. I am here to help, I try to provide support to Cayin's users as much as we should, but I can't do anything if I only see a bunch of hard feeling without quoting any problem specifically. You might be alarmed by @bluedolphin repeated complaint on i5, I hope you have read all the way back and notice his pattern. Maybe you are not aware that in one occasion when his i5 has drained its battery, he wrote 25 email on a Sunday morning within 1 hour to complaint about our product, our service, our integrity, literally everything. threading to sue us, and complaint us to the consumer council in his country, we cheat him with a bad product and he'll make sure we pay for that, etc etc. The last email we received from him was an apology saying he charged his i5 and it worked again. Our company has decided to enforce a new service pledge because of that abuse instance. Check out the history if you think we have not been providing support to i5 users because of his complaint.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cay...-pcm-64-128-dsd.802382/page-232#post-13756101

By the way, if you believe Fiio will offer better service and less bug, by all means you should try their products or at least read through their product discussion. They offers competitive products and is a market leader, and I am not surprised that users will switch among the "popular" sub-1K DAP brands such as Fiio, Shanling, Opus or even our partner HiBy Music as they are going to release R6, a new Android DAP that deserve serious attention.
Andy that is crazy.... ok that is beyond a frustrated user...that is insane, I apologize to bluedolphin for saying this. But in no way to disrespect a company, like that. I mean I understand if it's in certain cases where the company was like a multi-leveling marketing company scamming people out of money, (amway, herbalife, etc)

I would definitely consider asking service@cayin.cn nicely and see if anything could resolve the issue, if not send it in for repair. Probably ask people here if they have any solutions. but 25 emails on 1 hour!? and threatening to sue. I think that's a bit way too far....

I do appreciate he apologized to you cayin.
 
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I'm running Neutron on the i5, or do you mean something else?
I believe he is referring to bypassing Android SRC when using Neutron. We have a plan to work this out, but since the process involve sharing IP among three companies at different country, it is kind of complicated and will take a while from kick start to complete.
 
Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor profile on Head-Fi.
 
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@Andykong - Thanks for the kind words. It's been my pleasure to help spread the word about Cayin because you guys make great products and provide fantastic support for users on this forum. I hope to meet again one of these days. After our last exchange, I'm highly considering going to CanJam New York.

Cheers to one of HeadFi's true gentlemen!
And I am looking forward to meet you in person again, CanJam New York will be the perfect place to have fun. I am flying all the way to New York alone on Chinese New Year, there is no better thing then meeting good friends on the freezing Manahattan Time Square.

Cheers. :beerchug:
 
Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor profile on Head-Fi.
 
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OMG, enjoy Snow White Andromeda!!!!
Enjoy your night!
yeah, not many places on headfi, you can pm a company with ideas to include in FW or features that could be implemented.
Andykong actually makes an effort to see how feasible it is and work out ways to make it happen.

95% of other companies will want to see how profitable or if the idea is extremely popular to implement if it's not a bugfix.

Andy and cayin got feedback for N5ii Gold wheel was too bling bling looking and it detracted people from wanting the dap. And a nice beautiful silver wheel was implemented to make the DAP look classy and low profile at same time.
Well, to certain extend, my practice is unusual, and I am glad that Cayin has been extremely accommodating and offer complete free hand so that I can do whatever I consider "appropriate".

To me, its important to create a product that users (I don't use the word customer very often, that's my mentality) will feel attached to, or the product can blend into the user's daily life. Being a DAP users myself, I think this is the easiest benchmark when I need to make whatever non-technical decision. On the other hand, technical issue are straight forward: feasibility, necessity, C/P contribution are my simple guidelines.

The Snow White is gorgeous, love at first sight. :blush:
 
Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor profile on Head-Fi.
 
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