[TheNameIsGerald]

What store in the EU has the C9 in stock? (By now the Chinese New Year break is upon us, so if it's not already in stock it would take quite some time to arrive.)

 

[Andykong]

That is the right way to put transparency for an amp, but you see ? My post was regarding directly to @twister6 comparison between the BX2 and the C9. The C9 was especially into the fuller body and textures. That was why I posted the above....I would rather pick Fuller body and warmer rather than Colder and thinner and that is my preferences

Most of the time, equipments compromises body density to get that airiness and transparency. We all know that there is no such thing as “perfection”. So there will be no perfect transparency either.

Staying true to the source ? Now that is an interesting topic.

Amplifications in essential is a conversion or modification, and whenever there is a conversion happening, then that original signal is no longer original. Now, you can color it, tune it, to get your desired result, but there is no perfect amplifications for the most true to the original signals.

I will always want to try to avoid “conversions” as much as possible, and that is another reason why I chose C9 for the stack, at least it is running directly from 8.8V positive rail and 8.8V negative rail with Ground references. The BX2 + is doing multiple boosts to get it from 3.7V battery into 8.8V or higher.

We can debate whatever ways the C9 sound signature is, but the fact remains, technically speaking, the less conversions is the better.

Now comes preferences, personal preferences will always be a thing and is the king of this hobby

Listening to C9 in Solid State and Class AB, the C9 carrying the typical Cayin house sound that is similar to the N8 for sure. This is why I paired up the C9 with the Max as a source with Max having that Neutral and colder signature already. This is where the beauty lie for being a dedicated Amp, once you understand your desires and the amp voicing, you can pair up and match up whatever you want to get the results....but you can not change how the Amp is running from the power supply that easy

I have a slightly different view on the topic of transparency, personally.

To start with, there can be audio attributes that are not obvious in DAC line out stage but more likely to develop at amplification stage. For example, texture.

Let's assume the sound system is composed of four modules: Transport, DAC, Preamp, and Power amplifier. In my experience, I seldom audition a Transport, DAC or CD player and said "the texture is good", but I have audition Preamp, power amp or integrated amplifier and said "the texture is good". Maybe "texture" is one of the thing that the information is there in the file or CD, but it won't develop a later stage of audio signal processing. Therefore if you heard a DAC feeding to two different amplifiers, Amp1 offers excellent texture but Amp2 didn't, my logical thinking is Amp 1 can retrieve the hidden signal and "amplifier" it correctly so that it become obvious in the playback. Alternatively, you can think that Amp1 is colored, it added texture to the playback that you can't find in Amp2.

Since Whitigir was referring to an impression from @twister6, so I'll keep him in the loop of the discussion as well.

In addition, we can check out a very interesting observation from Stereophile audio glossary, transparency is described as:

1. A quality of sound reproduction that gives the impression of listening through the system to the original sounds, rather than to a pair of loudspeakers.
2. Freedom from veiling, texturing, or any other quality which tends to obscure the signal. A quality of crystalline clarity.

So transparency is about an audio experience with reality instead of hearing it from two distinctive point source, or remove obstacles so that you can discover more. It is not necessarily keeping everything upstream unchanged. In fact, if we learn from graphical or video processing, there are "post-processing" that can ENHANCE the clarity of a picture (or video). Enhance is not necessarily creating something from nothing. When you hear something that is not "there" originally, it can be coloring, but it can also be an enhanced effect through unveil or unmask something.

Recently I have attended a Sony VPL-VW790ES projector presentation and the heart of that was the introduction of their new DSP Engine "X1 for Projector" Processor that offers new features such as Super Resolution Reality Creation and Dynamic HDR Enhancer. Apparently videophiles accepts these "enhancing" technologies, but audiophiles will classify these enhancers as color or "conversion" as Whitigir has described.

 

[Whitigir]

I have a slightly different view on the topic of transparency, personally.

To start with, there can be audio attributes that are not obvious in DAC line out stage but more likely to develop at amplification stage. For example, texture.

Let's assume the sound system is composed of four modules: Transport, DAC, Preamp, and Power amplifier. In my experience, I seldom audition a Transport, DAC or CD player and said "the texture is good", but I have audition Preamp, power amp or integrated amplifier and said "the texture is good". Maybe "texture" is one of the thing that the information is there in the file or CD, but it won't develop a later stage of audio signal processing. Therefore if you heard a DAC feeding to two different amplifiers, Amp1 offers excellent texture but Amp2 didn't, my logical thinking is Amp 1 can retrieve the hidden signal and "amplifier" it correctly so that it become obvious in the playback. Alternatively, you can think that Amp1 is colored, it added texture to the playback that you can't find in Amp2.

Since Whitigir was referring to an impression from @twister6, so I'll keep him in the loop of the discussion as well.

In addition, we can check out a very interesting observation from Stereophile audio glossary, transparency is described as:

1. A quality of sound reproduction that gives the impression of listening through the system to the original sounds, rather than to a pair of loudspeakers.
2. Freedom from veiling, texturing, or any other quality which tends to obscure the signal. A quality of crystalline clarity.

So transparency is about an audio experience with reality instead of hearing it from two distinctive point source, or remove obstacles so that you can discover more. It is not necessarily keeping everything upstream unchained. In fact, if we learn from graphical or video processing, that are indeed "post-processing" that can ENHANCE the clarity of a picture (or video). Enhance is not necessarily creating something from nothing. When you hear something that is not "there" originally, it can coloring, but it can also be an enhanced effect through unveil or unmask something.

Recently I have attended a Sony VPL-VW790ES projector presentation and the heart of that was the introduction of their new DSP Engine "X1 for Projector" Processor that offers new features such as Super Resolution Reality Creation and Dynamic HDR Enhancer. Apparently videophiles accepts these "enhancing" technologies, but audiophiles will classify these enhancers as color or "conversion" as Whitigir has described.

Thanks Andy, and I totally agree. That is why I always jump in, head first, when I hear “better textures and fuller body” .

 

[jonstatt]

I have been trying different sources and I found that with an SP2000 in line out mode, it causes distortion with certain tracks . I have to come out of line out and turn the volume manually.

 

[bluestorm1992]

I have been trying different sources and I found that with an SP2000 in line out mode, it causes distortion with certain tracks . I have to come out of line out and turn the volume manually.

Could this be due to the interconnect? I know that for AK DAPs, you may need an adapter to connect the 4.4 with the 3.5 to use its ground; otherwise, you get noise.

Edit: add a pic of such an adapter.

 

[jonstatt]

Could this be due to the interconnect? I know that for AK DAPs, you may need an adapter to connect the 4.4 with the 3.5 to use its ground; otherwise, you get noise.

Edit: add a pic of such an adapter.

Sorry I should have said, I do have the DD Hifi adapter that taps both outputs

 

[bluestorm1992]

Sorry I should have said, I do have the DD Hifi adapter that taps both outputs

Have you tried both 3.5 and 4.4 as LO, or perhaps just the 3.5 without the adapter. Maybe this will help.

 

[noplsestar]

Could this be due to the interconnect? I know that for AK DAPs, you may need an adapter to connect the 4.4 with the 3.5 to use its ground; otherwise, you get noise.

Edit: add a pic of such an adapter.

Maybe also because the SP2k doesn’t have a true line-out but just a „line-out mode“:
https://forum.headphones.com/t/aste...-digital-audio-player-official-thread/4016/16

 

[bluestorm1992]

Maybe also because the SP2k doesn’t have a true line-out but just a „line-out mode“:
https://forum.headphones.com/t/aste...-digital-audio-player-official-thread/4016/16

With this, I am thinking maybe to try the SP200 in its regular phone-out, and use C9’s pre-in. Andy mentioned that this should generate interesting results as well.

However, do be careful when you want to activate the pre-in mode. It will set the volume of C9 to the highest.

 

[jonstatt]

Have you tried both 3.5 and 4.4 as LO, or perhaps just the 3.5 without the adapter. Maybe this will help.

I have tried the 2.5mm on its own and it still distorts. Line out says 6V on the SP2000. I need to see if the C9 is meant to handle that

The N8 4.4 line out doesn't distort it seems.

 

[jmills8]

I have tried the 2.5mm on its own and it still distorts. Line out says 6V on the SP2000. I need to see if the C9 is meant to handle that

The N8 4.4 line out doesn't distort it seems.

Cause the N8 is better.

 

[LabelH]

I have been trying different sources and I found that with an SP2000 in line out mode, it causes distortion with certain tracks . I have to come out of line out and turn the volume manually.

Not sure if this the correct way, I run PRE mode without activating line out mode in AK SP2000, to my ears it sound clearer than using line-out mode

 

[bluestorm1992]

Not sure if this the correct way, I run PRE mode without activating line out mode in AK SP2000, to my ears it sound clearer than using line-out mode

I think this is the intended way to use the PRE mode.

 

[jonstatt]

Not sure if this the correct way, I run PRE mode without activating line out mode in AK SP2000, to my ears it sound clearer than using line-out mode

If you can, could you try in sp2k line out mode (make sure to switch back the c9) and play

Lianne la havas, Good Goodbye

The whole album is brickwalled which is adding to the problems here but this track obviously distorts at several points during the track

 

[Nostoi]

Anyone able to test the C9 on a pair of ZMF Veritie Closed? I'd like to see if they can drive them with conviction (not expecting it to be the case but happy to hear otherwise).