[wualta]

Good grief, I go away for a couple of days and come back to find you kids have discovered EQ! EQ, of all things! Don't you know using it will keep you from getting into heaven?
 
I always wondered why I kept seeing Church Of No EQ religious fanatics marching up and down the forums here at HF. Now I think I know-- EQ on modern digital gear (probably digital fake graphic equalizers using maybe 4 bands) must be so absolutely execrably awful that no one in his right mind would seriously believe in it. But now you've discovered properly-implemented EQ with some grunt behind it (very important), and it can be very nice. It's also a handy tool for testing a headphone's mettle. So get out there and enjoy your forbidden fruit.
 

 

[Zida]

Quote:

 
@Zida i just thought of what u said about wanting something clean & neutral so im gonna throw u a coupla curve balls to catch. in my vintage travels, my ears have been telling me that Technics & Yamahas lean more toward that neck of the woods than the more popular standards like Marantz, 'Suis, & Pioneers. my Technics SA-400 sounds exceptional clean, quick & transparent - infact too much so for my orthos but great with the darker Senns. ditto for a Yami CA610 i've heard.
 
so these two particular makes mite be exactly what the doc ordered for u. indeed i personally would pick up the Yami CA810 & above series of integrated cos they have an internal switch that allows one to run in pure class A - i bliv 15w per for the CA810 up to 25w per for higher models. something for u to chew on. 

 
Thanks for the thoughts. I'm really most likely to wind up picking up whats quality and available. The guy with the Pioneer wants to hang onto it and have it fully fixed up before selling it (my hero!). I'm still planning on picking it up, but I'll keep my eyes open for some Technics and Yamahas. I'm not against owning two amps and running some A/B to pick out my favorite.

 

[Shahrose]

Quote:

Good grief, I go away for a couple of days and come back to find you kids have discovered EQ! EQ, of all things! Don't you know using it will keep you from getting into heaven?
 
I always wondered why I kept seeing Church Of No EQ religious fanatics marching up and down the forums here at HF. Now I think I know-- EQ on modern digital gear (probably digital fake graphic equalizers using maybe 4 bands) must be so absolutely execrably awful that no one in his right mind would seriously believe in it. But now you've discovered properly-implemented EQ with some grunt behind it (very important), and it can be very nice. It's also a handy tool for testing a headphone's mettle. So get out there and enjoy your forbidden fruit.
 

 
Not sure if you're referring to me but,
 
I use a parametric software EQ (64 band) and I've used it for years...If you know how to use it properly, then it can be way better than the hardware bass/treble controls that are on these amps. The latter are just more convenient, quicker, and nice-sounding for a 2-knob control, that's all I'm saying.
 
But, EQ can only change tone and takes time to properly use. The No-EQ purists exist because they know that component upgrades are a better way to change your sound as they yield improvements in more than just tonal balance.
 

 

[pp312]

 
Quote:

 
 The No-EQ purists exist because they know that component upgrades are a better way to change your sound as they yield improvements in more than just tonal balance.
 

That's true but there's another aspect, which is that no matter how satisfied you think you are with one setting you'll eventually find a recording it doesn't suit and be tempted to change it, thus setting off an endless cycle. EQ is great as a fun thing, but it's just too easy and tempting to fiddle with and for that reason alone I doubt it can lead to permanent satisfaction. Still, whatever floats the old boat...
 

 

[Shahrose]

Quote:

That's true but there's another aspect, which is that no matter how satisfied you think you are with one setting you'll eventually find a recording it doesn't suit and be tempted to change it, thus setting off an endless cycle. EQ is great as a fun thing, but it's just too easy and tempting to fiddle with and for that reason alone I doubt it can lead to permanent satisfaction. Still, whatever floats the old boat...
 

I agree. I try to avoid it as much as possible, but it's very useful for say, helping to remove room resonances for speakers in a room etc. (Sorry for the OT posts...no more from me).
 

 

[moodyrn]

Lets stay on topic here. Eq discussion is for another forum. This has been discussed enough on this thread.

 

[Frank I]

The question I have which were the best receiver from the 1970's What about some othe Sansui like the 8080B and 5000G were they good or just average. I know about the ones Rob has and the Pioneer. Would like some input on the lower power ones as well and Scottie I know you know so input appreciated. I can get the G5000 in the State for less than 150.00 and a 8080 for 250.00 would these be good receivers for the headphones as i really only use the tube amps with the speakers. The 8080B is in Kansas

 

[scottiebabie]

hey Frank u know u're asking a loaded question esp for someone with your discerning tastes. personally i like the G series as its the beefier macho looker of the two. sonics on headphones OTOH is a serious toss. only way to tell is to try it out for yourself.
 
FWIW pricing on both seems to be within reason. if u arent in a big rush or have a need for instant gratification, i'd wait a while til a unit comes along locally. if it were me, i'd wait for a G8000 or G9000 as those are real collectables with very good SQ, to my ears. better yet, keep a lookout & invest in a G22000 & u'd have it all.
 
seems to me u already have/had your share of amps so why dick 'round. same advise for u as skylab - go for the top echelons of receivers & u wont look back. bliv in the God Nike & JUST DO IT!!! LOL 
 
ps:if u really want a Sansui to power headphones, look into the all dual mono designs of 'Suis AU517/717 819/919 quad amps. one can pick up a 517 for round $200 (i think) & its a serious amp. only 65w per but unbelievable build & absolutely over designed for what it is - dual trafos down to the output. its one of the best vintage intergrateds evar! its my fav esp for hifiman orthos. as Arsenio Hall use to say......Hmmmmmmmmmm....! heh

 

[Frank I]

 
Quote:

hey Frank u know u're asking a loaded question esp for someone with your discerning tastes. personally i like the G series as its the beefier macho looker of the two. sonics on headphones OTOH is a serious toss. only way to tell is to try it out for yourself.
 
FWIW pricing on both seems to be within reason. if u arent in a big rush or have a need for instant gratification, i'd wait a while til a unit comes along locally. if it were me, i'd wait for a G8000 or G9000 as those are real collectables with very good SQ, to my ears. better yet, keep a lookout & invest in a G22000 & u'd have it all.
 
seems to me u already have/had your share of amps so why dick 'round. same advise for u as skylab - go for the top echelons of receivers & u wont look back. bliv in the God Nike & JUST DO IT!!! LOL 
 
ps:if u really want a Sansui to power headphones, look into the all dual mono designs of 'Suis AU517/717 819/919 quad amps. one can pick up a 517 for round $200 (i think) & its a serious amp. only 65w per but unbelievable build & absolutely over designed for what it is - dual trafos down to the output. its one of the best vintage intergrateds evar! its my fav esp for hifiman orthos. as Arsenio Hall use to say......Hmmmmmmmmmm....! heh

thanks

 

[Inkmo]

I have an old Pioneer SX-828 that I had fixed up recently.  Been thinking about new speakers for it.  Guy at the hifi shop near my house said it should be able to drive most of the stuff in his shop on its own.  I think it's pretty warm sounding and there's noticeable hiss with my easier to drive headphones.  I don't spend much headphone time with it, though I should.  I have a pair of Fostexes and a pair of Grados I use with it.
 
One thing I've noticed is that my turntable playing through it seems to be at a bit lower level and much bassier than sources coming through the tape monitor or aux input (I have to turn the volume up further to achieve similar sound levels).  Don't know if it's the Pioneer's phono amp or if it's my Thorens or Shure cart.

 

[Skylab]

That the phono input is lower in level is not a great surprise - a modern CD player will have a much higher voltage level hitting the AUX input than what was available back then.  The "much bassier" part is harder to say, might be the cartridge, might be the Pioneer's phono stage.

 

[ACDOAN]

Quote:

Good grief, I go away for a couple of days and come back to find you kids have discovered EQ! EQ, of all things! Don't you know using it will keep you from getting into heaven?
 
I always wondered why I kept seeing Church Of No EQ religious fanatics marching up and down the forums here at HF. Now I think I know-- EQ on modern digital gear (probably digital fake graphic equalizers using maybe 4 bands) must be so absolutely execrably awful that no one in his right mind would seriously believe in it. But now you've discovered properly-implemented EQ with some grunt behind it (very important), and it can be very nice. It's also a handy tool for testing a headphone's mettle. So get out there and enjoy your forbidden fruit.
 

May I add that there is also a Church Of No EQ / No Tone Control ?

 

[InnerSpace]

Quote:

One thing I've noticed is that my turntable playing through it seems to be at a bit lower level and much bassier than sources coming through the tape monitor or aux input (I have to turn the volume up further to achieve similar sound levels).  Don't know if it's the Pioneer's phono amp or if it's my Thorens or Shure cart.

If you're playing U.S. vinyl with a Shure cartridge, the signal reaching your phono amp "expects" to be de-emphasized via the U.S.-standard RIAA curve.  But - amazingly - that standard wasn't respected internationally in the 70s (even the 80s) ... foreign manufacturers used their own local interpretations, and were happy to, especially if they gave a little warmth in markets expecting something different.  Thus, what you're hearing is almost certainly because Pioneer's RIAA tuning was individual to Japan, and perhaps even to them.
 
And yes, today's 0db=2v line levels were an 80s invention, much higher than previously.
 

 

[Aris488]

Hi,
 
Is anyone know about vintage amp PIONEER SA 9100 and how it compare with vintage MARANTZ and SANSUI?
 
I plan to buy one on EBAY for about 400 USD, restaured and in mint condition.
 
Thanks.
 
Cheers.
 
Chris.

 

[wualta]

Quote:

I have an old Pioneer SX-828. ...I think it's pretty warm sounding and there's noticeable hiss with my easier to drive headphones. One thing I've noticed is that my turntable playing through it seems to be at a bit lower level and much bassier than sources coming through the tape monitor or aux input.  Don't know if it's the Pioneer's phono amp or if it's my Thorens or Shure cart.

This is arguably even more OT than EQ, but WTH. You've had these for a few years, correct? So I'm assuming this is not a new problem. While it's possible the cables on the Thorens are old high-capacitance cables which would tend to roll off the highs, my gut feeling is it's the RIAA section drifting off spec. It might just be time to swap your old Pioneer for something a bit newer and but still TOTL. Alternatively, you could put the 828 under the knife and replace parts in the RIAA network.