[gimmeheadroom]

Thanks for the long reply's, I appreciate it, spatially the long ones, makes more understandable all this, that I could solve doing a test, or a demo, but I started the hobby 2 months before corona, and before that my life was less boring that I am willing to spend now 1000€ in a headphones instead of holydays or travelling or visiting the family or... hehe... anyhow.

Everything is relative of course. Of course, and I know the difference between detailed driver and the highs not rolling off and appearing as detailed. I do know that, non audiophile but sound and music lover for few decades now almost...

The thing is this, i have sennheiser hd6XX and I have sennheiser hd25. HD 6XX I call it detailed, HD25 I call them not detailed, at all, but hey, for 99€ and for the ipod, more than good enough, for outdoors, for putting them on abag and not breaking, marvelous, sound signature, even more marvelous, detail; amazing for 99€. Now, if I spend 900€ and I get the same detail level than the HD25, I may return them the very same day, and order LCD X. So because everything is relative, and since I haven't tested them, detail needs to be kind of rated, as well as any other of the sound specs. You do not get out of my pocket 1000$ so easily. I mean, I´m deeply stupid, good, ok, but so so stupid, no my dear, no. Now, when you say, when I put those lcd2 in my head I am going to crap on my pants pretty much, that's what some people said, that is what I need confirmation about. Lot of people say that hd6XX or sundara have better detail retrieval than 2C, although maybe it is actually the sound signature of those with the highs rolled of. HD6XX has highs rolled off a bit to, but they sund detailed, they can retrieve the detail, with them it's easier to notice, sound quality, sampling rate. With non detailed headphones, sounds the same a high quality mp3 against a red book or a DSD/real high res stuff.

Anyhow, 610€ shipped gets me an LCD-2C new "b-stock", returned and vat free. 990€ shipped gets me an LCD-X. Hard to decide. The third candidate DT770 80 Ohm, the other was the Neumann 500€ closed cans, I already removed that candidate.

Amp will be the SIngxer SA1.


About the DT1770, after so much people telling me that is pure crap, without wanting to tell me that they are crap, I give up on them.

You will not miss any detail between HD 6XX and the LCD-2C. It's a different presentation. The HD 600 (and probably 650/6XX) get outta the way of the music, they just let you hear it. The LCD-2C is more impactful, more romantic, warmer. But it doesn't lose anything. It's just more laid back while it can get down when the music calls for it. I doubt very much the Sundara can come close but I didn't hear one.

The HD 25s can be amazingly detailed. I listened to some 384 KHz PCM out of my RME and I couldn't believe what I was hearing. Sennheisers scale big time.

The DT1770s are good for a closed headphone. No glaring problems or weaknesses in the sound except the separation can be pretty extreme. The DT1770 is a much better all around headphone than drop TR-X00 for example since the Fostex has a bad V that kills vocals and mids.

I didn't hear the LCD-X. You could check the threads on that if the difference might be worth it. One thing is for sure, nobody is going to be disappointed with LCD-2C. Even after I got my 3F I am not selling my 2C. Different kind of sound. The 3F requires my full attention. The 2C is just easy to listen to.

 

[Lolito]

Detail is very relative, again. HD25 yes, they are very detailed, specially if you do not compare it with anything else. When you compare it with the detail retrieval of hd6xx, which cost just 2 times the price, the detail resolution is way higher than 2x in my book of relatives. And tonality hd6XX sounds way more neutral, less colored, less distorted, less changed, than when using hd25. HD25 I like the sound curvature, that bass punch that the hd6xx can't get no matter how much you eq them.

Thing is, all that thing of laid back, warm, yes, good, I like all that, but let me tell you something about my experience and preferences; give me a full range, flat, capable system, speaker or headphones, capable of going very very very low in sub bass, flat, no roll off, and same with the highs, flat to the infinite. You know why? because that setup I can colour it myself, specially for audeze that need EQ to make them perform their best anyways. Now, a too colored system, or uncapable technically of doing either low end, or detail retrival, you are not gonna get the sub bass and you are not gonna get the resolution, if the device is simple uncapable... That is why, there is a point in which you think, if 600€ is quite a rip off, and 1000€ is quite a rip off too, but the 1000€ give you the proper option and the other is just a step in the middle of nowhere really, I go for the 1000€ option, rather than spend 600€ have a partial deception, having to return them, argue with a central european person that you want to return a headphones, during corona, some shops new rules do not accept headphones returns due to hygiene, no kidding. You gotta agree with them in advance for this possibility, even when you are buying b-stock already returned stuff... yes, crazy stupid, but anyhow...

600€ the 2C, a set of leather earpads would put them already at 700€.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

Detail is very relative, again. HD25 yes, they are very detailed, specially if you do not compare it with anything else. When you compare it with the detail retrieval of hd6xx, which cost just 2 times the price, the detail resolution is way higher than 2x in my book of relatives. And tonality hd6XX sounds way more neutral, less colored, less distorted, less changed, than when using hd25. HD25 I like the sound curvature, that bass punch that the hd6xx can't get no matter how much you eq them.

Thing is, all that thing of laid back, warm, yes, good, I like all that, but let me tell you something about my experience and preferences; give me a full range, flat, capable system, speaker or headphones, capable of going very very very low in sub bass, flat, no roll off, and same with the highs, flat to the infinite. You know why? because that setup I can colour it myself, specially for audeze that need EQ to make them perform their best anyways. Now, a too colored system, or uncapable technically of doing either low end, or detail retrival, you are not gonna get the sub bass and you are not gonna get the resolution, if the device is simple uncapable... That is why, there is a point in which you think, if 600€ is quite a rip off, and 1000€ is quite a rip off too, but the 1000€ give you the proper option and the other is just a step in the middle of nowhere really, I go for the 1000€ option, rather than spend 600€ have a partial deception, having to return them, argue with a central european person that you want to return a headphones, during corona, some shops new rules do not accept headphones returns due to hygiene, no kidding. You gotta agree with them in advance for this possibility, even when you are buying b-stock already returned stuff... yes, crazy stupid, but anyhow...

600€ the 2C, a set of leather earpads would put them already at 700€.

I have enough headphones to compare the HD 25 to. I'm saying they scale like I couldn't believe. Sure the HD 600 and family are tonality kings, that is what they're all about.

Anyway if you want impactful LCD-2C. Tyll said the bass is the lowest distortion bass he ever measured. You won't be disappointed. But they should cost 760 euros new. I agree don't waste time on returns. Whether the X is worth the money I am sure it is, but I don't know if sounds like you want it to.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

I know this is the 1770, but I'll say the 177x is just thunderous with the sheepskin pads. Easily among the most fun headphones I've ever experienced.

 

[Toddy]

… the other was the Neumann 500€ closed cans, I already removed that candidate.

Why did you remove them from the list?

 

[Lolito]

Because those are not very enjoyable long term maybe, red some reviews, also not cheap, and they look very bad so much silver. But, they have a great construction, and they are precise, and I did not test them properly enough and time enough. If maybe I get ones for 2 weeks, maybe I would love them, but I did nt have the chance, so do not removed them of your candidates because of me. They sounded very precise, compared to hd25, for example. could not compare them to any other.

 

[vibess]

One thing I forgot to mention about the DT1770s, the channel separation is pretty extreme. It might because they are closed and seal very well. But it's distracting for me. For most music I need crossfeed.

I can attest to that, on some tracks I had to double check balance settings on both pc and receiver twice, but yea they were in balance lol.

I've had these now for little more than a week and I can say that I couldnt be more pleased. I bought based on reviews and comments since I couldnt try them on before hand. By hooking them up to a an onkyo surround receiver with optical from my pc I was able to improve the feed a bit. The bass goes so deep I get goosebumps.

I need a new dac and amp, and hopefully when Schiit get their......together and can deliver from Europe distributor I plan to get a modi+magni stack. The surround reciever does not sit will on my desk and I believe that amp may even able to control them even better. Of course im open to anything else that is a good match for these within reasonable price. I guess there really so many options which make it even harder...

 

[gimmeheadroom]

A great amp for Beyers is the ATROX V2 from Norway, not sure if it's available now though. And look at Jan Meier's site for amps like the Corda Jazz-ff. He has DACs too, depending on your budget. https://meier-audio.homepage.t-online.de/amplifiers.html

 

[vibess]

Atrox V2 certainly looks competent, but seems like he stopped making those, wouldnt dare to buy a used one, it would probably cost more than It did new at this point.

 

[veritg0]

Just curious has anyone tried this? Having both the 1770 and 177x side by side and playing around with pads and damping materials, I found to get the best sound from both headphones the damping materials need to be swapped between the two. 1770 has a thin layer of damping foam which allows too much treble through and benefited from the thicker 177x damping. It loses a small portion of the subbass but brings the treble down a couple db and made it much more easy to listen to. Funny enough it made it less v-shaped and more balanced but still fun and not considered neutral in anyway.

On the other hand, 177x with its 32ohm impedance than the 250ohm sounds less resolving already, combined with the Dekoni sheepskin that came with the headphones and thick damping materials is just a tad too much and made the headphones sound like a one note bass thump with rolled off treble lacking details on either end. Swapping the thick damping on 177x for the thin foam on the 1770 brought back the treble and subbass but not to the extreme level of the 1770. Made the headphones much more enjoyable to listen to.

Seems Drop/Beyer is on to something with the thick damping materials on 177x. It was subsequently included in many Beyer cans after that: Tygr 300 r, Amiron Wireless, new T1 & T5 3rd gen.

 

[Chastity]

Seems Drop/Beyer is on to something with the thick damping materials on 177x. It was subsequently included in many Beyer cans after that: Tygr 300 r, Amiron Wireless, new T1 & T5 3rd gen.

I have the new driver foams on my DT-1990 Pro. I like what they do for the cans without destroying the signature sound.

 

[veritg0]

I have the new driver foams on my DT-1990 Pro. I like what they do for the cans without destroying the signature sound.

For sure it fixed most of Beyer cans of the infamous "Mt Beyer" treble peaks that most complained about...problem is most of the cans that they included the new foam don't really need it but the old ones really do i.e. 770/880/990/T70/T90/T1/T5p 1st gen

 

[Stevko]

I decided to return to Amazon my DT-1770. As I use them on the go they there come crackling sounds from the plastic cups and it's really annoying. Already ordered new DT-1770 to check if it's a common problem or it's only my pair. Anyway it's a bit frustrating to observe such quality issues with a respectable German brand like Beyerdynamic is.

Hi! Bought some second hand. Serial nr 0993. Reading some have issues with cables and crackling sound.
Hope mine are ok

 

[veritg0]

There seems to be some QC issues for the newer DT series 1770/1990/177x, the plastic part that holds the wire running from one cup to another will eventually crack and break from tensions depend on how often you move the cups. This does not happen on the older DT series 770/880/990 nor the higher end T series.

 

[Stevko]

Thank you. Plastic is fine here.
Edit: and they sounds good with my Magni. No bad noises