[seacard]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IPodPJ /img/forum/go_quote.gif He just responded to several questions of mine, and apologized for any delays. You've got to be patient if he is moving. A little off topic here, I just wanted to tell everyone how phenomenal the Logitech Transporter is as a transport to the Ref1. I don't even think I need to mod it. It is that much better than what I was using. Someone on Audiogon says the Transporter (used as a transport, not a DAC) holds its own against a $20,000 mbl transport.

How does the Transporter sound? I also don't know if this how to go into the Science forum, but what is it about a transport that gives it a "sound"? In other words, why would a $2000 Transport sound different from a $20000 transport?

 

[Currawong]

It probably has a lower jitter and a better clock in it, so the signals have better timing.

 

[IPodPJ]

Bizarre problems with RE1:

Last night I'm listening to music and every once in awhile (like every minute) there is a split second skip in the music. I'm thinking "oh s***, what now..? <sigh>" I figured it had to be my Transporter because that was my newest component. I disconnected it and replaced it with the Squeezebox. Still occurred. So I tried removing my new 100 ohm headphone resistance adaptors. Nope, problem's still there. That leaves me with my Audio-gd Ref1 and Phoenix.

Since I was standing right next to them and the A/C wall unit was blasting right on me, I turned the power down a notch.. BINGO. The glitch came back. I turned the low/high dial again. BINGO. It happened again. I turned the power off on the unit. Same thing. It's causing a brief, split-second break in the music, and it does it on its own without me touching the switch. At least I hope this is what's causing the one that happens every 2 minutes. And the A/C wall unit is on its own, individual circuit and no gear is connected to it.

UPDATE:
It's got nothing to do with the A/C. It's the DAC. I opened it up and disconnected the NOS/OS and Reset switches. The clicking is still there and it still goes out of phase. And what's really awful is that if I turn the A/C on, sometimes the DAC goes back in phase, and the A/C is on it's own circuit. So there is some kind of power/grounding problem with the REF1. Kingwa needs to send me a replacement unit.

Yikes asked if it could be my PC:
No, it's certainly not a problem with the PC. My PS Audio DL3 always worked fine. This DAC hasn't worked properly since day 1 and now it's just getting worse with the clicking issue.

I plugged the Transporter's analog outputs into the amp and messed with the AC. No drop in sound. The transporter is plugged into a different outlet than the amp and DAC so I wanted to see if it's just the outlet. So I plugged my power strip into the outlet that the Transporter was plugged into and then plugged the Transporter and the Ref 1 into the power strip. The drop in sound came back.

It's a defective DAC and Kingwa needs to send me a replacement.

 

[The Monkey]

IPod, I agree that your DAC has been twitchy since you received it based on your reports, but I'm not sure I follow the basis for your conclusion that the DAC is responsible for this particular problem. Can you eliminate as many things as possible from the equation and start from there?

 

[les_garten]

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Monkey /img/forum/go_quote.gif IPod, I agree that your DAC has been twitchy since you received it based on your reports, but I'm not sure I follow the basis for your conclusion that the DAC is responsible for this particular problem. Can you eliminate as many things as possible from the equation and start from there?

Well, you might want to simplify your circuit as much as possible. I wojld take the dac elsewhere. You haven't convinced me that your circuit isn't an issue. Get a SPDIF signal in another location and take just the SE outs to another piece of gear. Before you ask Kingwa to send you more gear, you should make certain it's his piece of gear is the issue.

You said you monkeyed with the AC, which you said was on another circuit, and it produced the glitch. So there's just some strange stuff going on here. Take the ref 1 to someone else's house with an input from another computer. If it makes the issue happen every two minutes, this problem will be easy to identify. Let the cards fall where they may.

It is not trivial for him to send more gear.

.

 

[tim3320070]

It would fall under the warranty he has which is you return it to him at his cost to fix and he sends it back to you at his cost. Seems like you should be a little more forgiving given the amount of non-standard mod's you had done to it (for free, right?).
And Les is right to isolate the DAC- connect it to a laptop or CD, out of the way of all the other equipment.

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Monkey /img/forum/go_quote.gif IPod, I agree that your DAC has been twitchy since you received it based on your reports, but I'm not sure I follow the basis for your conclusion that the DAC is responsible for this particular problem. Can you eliminate as many things as possible from the equation and start from there?

I did that

and am one pissed-off <expletive>.

I tried my computer plugged into speakers. No problem.
I plugged my CD player into my amp. No problem.
I tried everything, everywhere. It's the DAC that is bad.
I tried the DAC on every circuit in the house, it still goes out of phase.
But I will gladly take it to my office tomorrow and try it there. I'm confident it won't make a difference.
Every other piece of gear in my place works fine, and I've never had an issue like this.

I do think it's bizarre that the AC is sending some kind of spike through the home that will trip the DAC to go in phase or out of phase. That is another issue that I will look into. But the fact that the DAC starts up out of phase and doesn't go in phase until I turn on the air is bizarre and means there is something wrong with the unit.

Like I said, the phase issue was there since day 1. It's unfortunate I had to disconnect the switches because they weren't the problem.

My Transporter tells me the line voltage in my apartment. It has never dropped lower than 118 and has never been higher than 124.

Also, what is worthy of note (and this may not be relevant at all and perhaps Kingwa changed the design since he took the pictures) but in the picture on his website of the DSP1 there is one spot where there are two holes with solder on them like something is soldered below the DSP1 board. On my DSP1, these is no solder there at all. So perhaps they just missed something.

Another thing worthy of note is that the solder points between CAST and XLR are touching eachother, if this means anything. Also there are areas where there are gobs of hot glue dripped on different areas, and one big glob right on the side of a capacitor where there is no need for glue to be there. Other than that, everything looks very cleanly built inside.

And I know Kingwa will repair it. I'm not worried about that. I'm upset that I might be without my DAC for a month after I just got it.

 

[tosehee]

I've been burning my RE-1 non-stop ever since I got it. Fortunately, I do not have any of these issues (so far) that PJ is reporting.. Lucky me I guess.

The sound is very clear and neutral. It might be 'too neutral' region. But, it's still burning-in, so I will reserve any impressions for now.

 

[Pricklely Peete]

I'd wait until your PSA PPP arrives PJ. That might be the cure to your current problems although the possibility remains that something is amiss with your DAC.

What is on that same circuit in your apartment that the audio gear is on ? What physical location and orientation is your gear rack to things like a wifi router or other wireless devices ? What about the 18ft COAX and routing ? has it changed since the Transporter arrived (slight location change or maybe a power line running parallel to it ) ?

Do you keep your cell phone close by at all times ? What about switch mode PSU wall warts for recharging such devices ? Get all of that stuff well away from the DAC/Amp/T/Comp and see what happens.

Peete.

 

[tosehee]

PJ. Did you get your cryo custom CAST cable yet? If so, how does it compare against Kingwa's?

p.s.: Hope you get your RE1 fixed asap.

 

[les_garten]

What I was getting at is related to this. You said: 1) it occurs every two minutes, and 2) It is the REF1.

That's good, it is reproducible and you're sure which component it is.

Prove it. It costs Kingwa a lot of cash to ship stuff back and forth. The least you can do is prove his gear is bad.

Take the gear to a new location and make the simplest stack of gear possible. Preferably with everything different except the REF1. Should take 2 minutes to confirm your diagnosis, according to you. At that point, Kingwa will be on the hook for about $300 shipping costs or more.

We would love to hear the results.

.

 

[sandchak]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tosehee /img/forum/go_quote.gif The sound is very clear and neutral. It might be 'too neutral' region. But, it's still burning-in, so I will reserve any impressions for now.

RE1 is very neutral and transparent DAC, and the fact is that it will not change its character no matter how much you burn in.. at least thats what I found with my ears and REF1.

PJ, Sorry to hear about your problems, like everyone is saying - try and isolate the REF1, use it in a different environment altogether with a simple setup and see if the problem still persists. If it still does, your REF1 is still under warranty and A-GD will surely repair/replace it, if the problem is not inflicted by the user. Hope it gets sorted out.

EDIT. btw, the two things you are pointing out as noteworthy - why don't you post those pictures/or send Kingwa - maybe he can help - if that is something which is causing the problem.

 

[Currawong]

IPodPJ: The board in the Ref 1 pictures is the original, which I had to replace to get 24/96 to work properly. They are different in a couple of areas. What you need to do is contact Kingwa and troubleshoot it with him rather than frantically post here.

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pricklely Peete /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'd wait until your PSA PPP arrives PJ. That might be the cure to your current problems although the possibility remains that something is amiss with your DAC. What is on that same circuit in your apartment that the audio gear is on ? What physical location and orientation is your gear rack to things like a wifi router or other wireless devices ? What about the 18ft COAX and routing ? has it changed since the Transporter arrived (slight location change or maybe a power line running parallel to it ) ? Do you keep your cell phone close by at all times ? What about switch mode PSU wall warts for recharging such devices ? Get all of that stuff well away from the DAC/Amp/T/Comp and see what happens. Peete.

Nothing is on the gear rack yet as the outlets are too far apart. That is one of the reasons for getting the regenerator so I can plug them all in.

Nothing else has changed. Like I mentioned, I tried it with the Squeezebox rig too and the same thing occurs. Remember, from day one it was playing out of phase, or what I think sounds like it being out of phase. Instead of the soundstage being in front, it was far to the sides and the sound was coming from behind you head. We figured it just had to do with the NOS/OS switch or maybe even the Reset switch. Well I disconnected both of those and it was not the problem, so his modification was fine. There is something else amiss.

And the sound issues make no difference whether you use CAST, XLR, or RCA. I tried all of them.

After my last post at 6:35, I decided to take a short drive. By the time I got everything in the car it was about 6:50. Since my office is just down the block, I decided to drive down there. I got there 5 minutes later. I took my Blu-ray player (for use as a CD player), my HD800 and the Ref1 with me. (You need to set up the Blu-Ray player to output normal PCM with a TV screen, which I had done a few weeks back. It must save it's settings to flash memory inside because the audio output through coax perfectly.) We have a receiver there we use with speakers to listen to music. It's actually my very old Yamaha receiver which we are going to dump soon and replace, but luckily we didn't. It has a headphone output. I disconnected my balanced XLR cable and put back the original Sennheiser cable before I left for the office. I plugged everything into the wall and fired it up. Guess what? Same problem. Although I have no wall unit A/C there, we do have central air there which I fired on and off several times, and I didn't hear any clicking noise, but the sound was out of phase (or whatever causes it to sound that way). Only after turning the power off and on on the unit about 20 times did it once play in phase -- until it got to the next song on the CD and then went out of phase again. So I spent about an hour and a half there futzing with it.

So I think there may be something wrong with the clock and how it's handled by voltage, which may be built into the DSP module. Some kind of ground/voltage issue is causing it to go out of phase, as well as make the clicking noise here. Here at home when I started it up and it was out of phase, turning the A/C on must have sent a signal through the line and made it go in phase, and of course that is short-lived. Why it occurs I couldn't even begin to guess.

I'm not an engineer so I don't know what the actual problem is but I just know there is one and that it wasn't related to the modifications he made, at least not that I can tell since disconnecting them made no difference, which what was he suggested I do several days ago.

I'm waiting to hear back from him, so we will see what he says.

Edit: Oh, I forgot to mention I even brought with me my Belkin Isolator & Conditioner power strip. Neither here nor there did it have any effect on the Ref1.

 

[soundlogic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Currawong /img/forum/go_quote.gif IPodPJ: What you need to do is contact Kingwa and troubleshoot it with him rather than frantically post here.

frantic? FRANTIC?? F-R-A-N-T-I-C????? iPodJ???
NEVER!