[wink]

 
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 Very amusing, but what do you guys listen to? 

 
 Lots of different genres - except punk, heavy metal and (C)rap.
 
Heck, I even once listened to Lawrence Welk. And I was once even Shpongled...........
 
Mostly classical and Acoustic guitar, with some vocals  thrown in.
 
SP Wild can post for himself.
 
 
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A more logical discussion than LCD2 vs HD650...I think the comparison with STAX is far more logical.  The HD650s should never be brought up in this thread ever again...other than to say that there is no comparison. 

 Aw', c'mon youse guys, I still like my HD650's.
I still use them in spite of all my other cans.....
 

 

[pp312]

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A more logical discussion than LCD2 vs HD650...I think the comparison with STAX is far more logical.  The HD650s should never be brought up in this thread ever again...other than to say that there is no comparison.

Agree SP Wild, agree! I finally understand what you mean, LCD-2 is really a different level up to HD650.

I told you so, didn't I tell you so?  yes that's what I thought, indeed I told you so.  Just to be cheeky, one more time.  I told you so! 

S P Wild on another thread:  "spent some time with my HD650s, Reference 7 dac and Cayin HA-1A SET amp and I gotta say, the pairing has magical synergy.  Enough for me to not miss the LCD2s much at all.  And enough to want to replace the stock cable with some single crystal OCC wires.  I hear flaws with the HD650 and Lehmann Black Cube amp...but it's virtually flawless with the Cayin SET amp.  Its just as magical as the LCD2s."  """""""
 
Are their actually two SP Wild's or am I just reading an apparent contradiction here that doesn't really exist?  Or does it even matter?

 

[SP Wild]

I think I've entered some kind of festive season twilight zone...

 
(i.e.  I am far removed from sobriety) 

 

 

 
Cheers to all in head-fi.

 

[Happy Camper]

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A more logical discussion than LCD2 vs HD650...I think the comparison with STAX is far more logical.  The HD650s should never be brought up in this thread ever again...other than to say that there is no comparison.

I believe I am the guilty party. I used a loose analogy that the LCD-2 was like the HD650 on steroids. I will refrain from such comparisons.

 

[bauerpower]

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A more logical discussion than LCD2 vs HD650...I think the comparison with STAX is far more logical.  The HD650s should never be brought up in this thread ever again...other than to say that there is no comparison.

Agree SP Wild, agree! I finally understand what you mean, LCD-2 is really a different level up to HD650.

I told you so, didn't I tell you so?  yes that's what I thought, indeed I told you so.  Just to be cheeky, one more time.  I told you so! 

S P Wild on another thread:  "spent some time with my HD650s, Reference 7 dac and Cayin HA-1A SET amp and I gotta say, the pairing has magical synergy.  Enough for me to not miss the LCD2s much at all.  And enough to want to replace the stock cable with some single crystal OCC wires.  I hear flaws with the HD650 and Lehmann Black Cube amp...but it's virtually flawless with the Cayin SET amp.  Its just as magical as the LCD2s."  """""""
 
Are their actually two SP Wild's or am I just reading an apparent contradiction here that doesn't really exist?  Or does it even matter?

No you just come across many types on here and 1 common type is the dogmatic guy who always feels very strongly that they are right and every1 elses opinion is wrong even when the issue may be entirely subjective. 

 

[rhythmdevils]

IMO, the HD650 is similar to the LCD-2 in it's frequency response alone.  And it is only similar in that they both have bass impact and a complete lack of brightness, but they are not identical in FR.  The LCD-2 has better, more defined treble and a complete lack of bass bloat, as well as a lack of the upper bass hump that the HD650 has.  But that's where the similarities end.  They not only have drivers developed by different companies, they are completely different technology.  A dynamic headphone and an orthodynamic headphone having similar frequency response means very little, because there are so many differences in other areas.  It's a good comparison if you are like Mr. Green and and your number one priority does involve FR- having a cold, bass-light, treble laden sound like the ER4S.  In that case, you know that all the other differences don't matter to you, and you won't like the LCD-2 because it won't have the aggressive treble you prefer.  But the HD650 and LCD2 sound very different in the end.  It's kind of akin to saying that an apple and a banana taste the same because they are both fruit.  If you hate all fruit, then you know you won't like either one, but otherwise they are both worth a try on their own. 
 
But I think people get confused when they read these comparisons to the HD650 because they mistake frequency response for speed.  They are completely different things, but people usually think bright headphones are fast and warm headphones are slow.  I think what annoys most people about the HD650 is not really it's frequency response (and the LCD-2 has better treble and no bass bloat) but it's dull/slow sound, which the HD600 also shares, and which even my sister with completely untrained ears could hear in the HD600 (which has a very neutral FR- more treble and less bass than the HD650) when listening to it after the LCD2.  And this dull, slow sound is nowhere to be found with the LCD-2, it is faster then any dynamic headphone out there.  It's impossible to really say for sure and I haven't listened to the HD800 much, but I would guess it is faster then the HD800 (brightness =/= speed). 

 

[grokit]

 
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No you just come across many types on here and 1 common type is the dogmatic guy who always feels very strongly that they are right and every1 elses opinion is wrong even when the issue may be entirely subjective. 

I prefer to think of it as unbridled enthusiasm at work rather than a dogmatic personality defect 

 
 
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IMO, the HD650 is similar to the LCD-2 in it's frequency response alone.  And it is only similar in that they both have bass impact and a complete lack of brightness, but they are not identical in FR.  The LCD-2 has better, more defined treble and a complete lack of bass bloat, as well as a lack of the upper bass hump that the HD650 has.  But that's where the similarities end.  They not only have drivers developed by different companies, they are completely different technology.  A dynamic headphone and an orthodynamic headphone having similar frequency response means very little, because there are so many differences in other areas.  It's a good comparison if you are like Mr. Green and and your number one priority does involve FR- having a cold, bass-light, treble laden sound like the ER4S.  In that case, you know that all the other differences don't matter to you, and you won't like the LCD-2 because it won't have the aggressive treble you prefer.  But the HD650 and LCD2 sound very different in the end.  It's kind of akin to saying that an apple and a banana taste the same because they are both fruit.  If you hate all fruit, then you know you won't like either one, but otherwise they are both worth a try on their own. 
 
But I think people get confused when they read these comparisons to the HD650 because they mistake frequency response for speed.  They are completely different things, but people usually think bright headphones are fast and warm headphones are slow.  I think what annoys most people about the HD650 is not really it's frequency response (and the LCD-2 has better treble and no bass bloat) but it's dull/slow sound, which the HD600 also shares, and which even my sister with completely untrained ears could hear in the HD600 (which has a very neutral FR- more treble and less bass than the HD650) when listening to it after the LCD2.  And this dull, slow sound is nowhere to be found with the LCD-2, it is faster then any dynamic headphone out there.  It's impossible to really say for sure and I haven't listened to the HD800 much, but I would guess it is faster then the HD800 (brightness =/= speed). 

Great post, totally agreed. The FR is similar but as many have said the two cans play in completely different leagues. I tried the HD650 twice, with a Cardas S/E cable and also a balanced cable on a variety of setups and sold them off quickly both times. I still have my second HD600 though, and do prefer them to the 650 for their more balanced presentation but they get hardly any headtime anymore. I mainly keep them around because of their durability and versatility, and the fact that I have a variety of cables and a headroom bag to keep it all in lol. The one area where I might nitpick is that I think the HD600 may go a bit deeper in bass extension while the 650's midbass dominates, but no matter.
 
The HD800 is really the perfect compliment to the LCD-2 though. When the LCD-2 gets congested on certain recordings the HD800 is a great antidote, and the LCD-2 really shines when the HD800 starts to sound thin. Of course the HD800 soundstage is legendary, 'nuff said on that point but the LCD-2 has that outstanding ortho viscerality. Yes I think I just made up a word there. Between the two I feel I can handle just about any kind of mixing/mastering strategy out of my WA22, with both digital and analog sources. I will definitely be keeping the LCD-2 this time!

 

[disastermouse]

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IMO, the HD650 is similar to the LCD-2 in it's frequency response alone.  And it is only similar in that they both have bass impact and a complete lack of brightness, but they are not identical in FR.  The LCD-2 has better, more defined treble and a complete lack of bass bloat, as well as a lack of the upper bass hump that the HD650 has.  But that's where the similarities end.  They not only have drivers developed by different companies, they are completely different technology.  A dynamic headphone and an orthodynamic headphone having similar frequency response means very little, because there are so many differences in other areas.  It's a good comparison if you are like Mr. Green and and your number one priority does involve FR- having a cold, bass-light, treble laden sound like the ER4S.  In that case, you know that all the other differences don't matter to you, and you won't like the LCD-2 because it won't have the aggressive treble you prefer.  But the HD650 and LCD2 sound very different in the end.  It's kind of akin to saying that an apple and a banana taste the same because they are both fruit.  If you hate all fruit, then you know you won't like either one, but otherwise they are both worth a try on their own. 
 
But I think people get confused when they read these comparisons to the HD650 because they mistake frequency response for speed.  They are completely different things, but people usually think bright headphones are fast and warm headphones are slow.  I think what annoys most people about the HD650 is not really it's frequency response (and the LCD-2 has better treble and no bass bloat) but it's dull/slow sound, which the HD600 also shares, and which even my sister with completely untrained ears could hear in the HD600 (which has a very neutral FR- more treble and less bass than the HD650) when listening to it after the LCD2.  And this dull, slow sound is nowhere to be found with the LCD-2, it is faster then any dynamic headphone out there.  It's impossible to really say for sure and I haven't listened to the HD800 much, but I would guess it is faster then the HD800 (brightness =/= speed). 

But is it safe to say that if you like the HD 650, you'll also like the LCD-2?

 

[Anaxilus]

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But is it safe to say that if you like the HD 650, you'll also like the LCD-2?

 
Or if you don't then the opposite?  It seems he made the differences apparent enough for my reading though.  I'm not a fan of the 'typical' Senn sound but it sounds like it is not a concern w/ the LCD2.
 

 

[Frank I]

The Taboo and its 6W of power agree with the LCD2. It has opened the sound stage up significantly. No longer is it small and compressed. It is wide and deep and no sign of any stress with demanding music. The amp is certainly a contender and as it burns in I feel it will only get better. I am glad I  ordered it and will keep posting impressions and get some pictures up in the next few days.

 

[grokit]

 
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But is it safe to say that if you like the HD 650, you'll also like the LCD-2?

 
Or if you don't then the opposite?  It seems he made the differences apparent enough for my reading though.  I'm not a fan of the 'typical' Senn sound but it sounds like it is not a concern w/ the LCD2.

I would say yes, but not the opposite.

 

[jamato8]

I have the feeling that underpowered LCD-2's must give the negative signature some have heard. I don't feel my WA6 would have been enough. So far I have not had a problem power them since the main amps I use have pretty good power so I get a large sound field and I have never, even in the most complex and demanding music, heard congestion in any way. 

 

[grokit]

The congestion I was referring to was from poor recording quality, not the music itself. The HD800 tames this considerably on the same rig. I doubt power is a problem with the WA22 but I am using it single ended ATM with the LCD-2. Hopefully a new cable will help, I have ordered a matching (my cable on the HD800) Double Helix balanced OCC.
 
Anyways the congestion I am referring to is only relative to the HD800, and only on certain recordings. The LCD-2 OTOH really does excel on bad 70/80's vinyl, where it can sound like there's a couple of octaves missing on the bottom end when using the HD800.

 

[rhythmdevils]

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But is it safe to say that if you like the HD 650, you'll also like the LCD-2?

yes, like others have said, I think this is safe to say, but not the opposite.  I think it depends on your priorities though.  for some people, speed and clarity and detail are more important than the right tonal balance, and for some it's the other way around (me).  I think there are some people who didn't like the HD650 because while they prefer a warm/neutral non-fatiguing sound, detail and perceived clarity/speed is more important, so with dynamics, they gravitated towards very treble happy phones because they were willing to sacrifice the tone they preferred for that fast sound.  But with the LCD-2 they didn't have to. 
 
If you prefer a a signature that highlights the treble, where the mids and bass are just there to support the treble, ala ER4s, then the speed and detail of the LCD-2 won't matter because you won't get that attack and aggression from the treble.  But if you like treble to be in balance with everything else, so treble is just one part of the spectrum, or you like a warm/neutral balance, I don't see how the speed and detail of the LCD-2 could be a bad thing.  It is intense at first, but you soon realize how much better you can feel the instruments when you are given that much detail. 

 

[rhythmdevils]

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I prefer to think of it as unbridled enthusiasm at work rather than a dogmatic personality defect