[m8o]

The BT adapter for the iSine was very dark, I don't know if Audeze actually applies and EQ to them using the adapter, but if they do, they really missed the mark with it. I know with the normal Lightning Cipher cable with the iSine there is an EQ applied and it's really good there. The Cipher BT for the iSine is a no go for me.

The BT adapter for the Euclid doesn't change tonality too much. Though that's in comparison to the UTWS3 that I've had them paired to since I got them. I really haven't used them wired in a long time. I feel like the Cipher BT cable for the Euclid give a bit more tightness/punch and impact to the bass while toning down the upper midrange a hair, but this is in comparison to the UTWS3 (though I didn't feel like that colored the Euclid much compared to wired through the Apple 3.5mm adapter). I feel like the Cipher BT that Audeze has for the Euclid is a very good pairing; it also helps keep it more portable compared to the UTWS3 I had before.

The iSine BT definitely has the EQ applied; if I remember correctly it is the simpler "gen 1" of the iSine Cipher EQ curve, not "gen 2" or later revisions.

I guess I'm not as big a critic of the iSine BT cable's tuning. I mean, it's not ideal. But for convenience when I have to make a trip to the vet or doctor so need to hear my name called, or do some shopping, and want to have an IEM inserted in the ears but still hear everything around me when I turn off the music w/o removing the iem, it's perfectly 'serviceable' for me. I'd just much prefer the sizzle and sparkle the iSine is capable of still be there with it. And Bluetooth itself could be responsible for loss of some of that treble I wish was there, as that is where BT does a lot of its squelching to minimize wireless bandwidth.

My bigger critique of it is power i.e. absolute volume it is capable of ... if used listening to recordings that were produced with wide dynamic range maintained, or produced decades past before brick wall compression. In many cases the iSine BT cable just doesn't get loud enough for me to be entirely satisfied.

I was about to pull the trigger on the Euclid BT device but then realized I still had that as an unknown. And that would be make or break, as someone who had affected hearing and tends to need to listen louder than most. To help me decide, can you comment on maximum volume capability of the Euclid BT cable, vs. the iSine's. Do you need to turn the volume up or down or stays the same if you were to listen to a song using the iSine BT then change to the Euclid BT? ... this, assuming you still have the iSine and BT cable to compare them. Thanx if so.

 

[tinyman392]

That’s interesting, I am still using the old-style Cipher Lighting cable with my iSine 10 and the Cipher BT sounds very different from that. The BT cable makes the iSine sound extremely smooth, thick, and warm while the Lightning cable gives it a brighter EQ, it’s much closer to the Euclid in tonality with the Lighting cable. I’m pretty sure I have the V1 cable (the bigger bulky one).

That said, I do still have my iSine 10 with the Cipher BT cable. Here are the volumes I play at with my iPhone. 256 AAC, more modern stuff with sound check on. In terms of sound levels, I try to limit the peak vs getting the volume at a specific “frequency.” I use hard clicks on my iPhone when listening, so you get to the nearest 16th:

• iSine 10 + Cipher Lightning: 43.75% (7 clicks), peaks in the upper midrange.
• iSine 10 + Cipher Bluetooth: 62.50% (10 clicks), peaks in the upper bass/lower midrange. If you want to match up with the upper midrange you’d need to boost to 68.75% (11 clicks).
• Euclid + Cipher Bluetooth: between 50.00 - 56.25 (8-9 clicks), peaks in the upper midrange.

I can kind of see why you’d want to push the iSine 10 with the BT cable as you really need to push the volume to get the midrange and upper end to get through the thicker low-end.

 

[m8o]

...
In terms of sound levels, I try to limit the peak vs getting the volume at a specific “frequency.” I use hard clicks on my iPhone when listening, so you get to the nearest 16th:

• iSine 10 + Cipher Lightning: 43.75% (7 clicks), peaks in the upper midrange.
• iSine 10 + Cipher Bluetooth: 62.50% (10 clicks), peaks in the upper bass/lower midrange. If you want to match up with the upper midrange you’d need to boost to 68.75% (11 clicks).
• Euclid + Cipher Bluetooth: between 50.00 - 56.25 (8-9 clicks), peaks in the upper midrange.

I can kind of see why you’d want to push the iSine 10 with the BT cable as you really need to push the volume to get the midrange and upper end to get through the thicker low-end.

Much thanx for taking the time! I really appreciate it. So assuming I'm reading this correctly it seems the combo of the Euclid + BT cable's amp is a bit more efficient and capable of a bit more volume than with the iSine if with "point of equivalency" at differing points of the frequency spectrum, and even more so if compared at the same/similar frequency range. I am glad to read that.

 

[vsg28]

FYI I had a sneak peek at the new update of Reveal+ (2.2.0.35, coming soon), which supports the LCD-X (2021), LCD-XC (2021), and also the Euclid.

The individualized HRTF profiles with the Euclid were quite good, worth checking out when the update hits an imminent public release.

 

[tinyman392]

Much thanx for taking the time! I really appreciate it. So assuming I'm reading this correctly it seems the combo of the Euclid + BT cable's amp is a bit more efficient and capable of a bit more volume than with the iSine if with "point of equivalency" at differing points of the frequency spectrum, and even more so if compared at the same/similar frequency range. I am glad to read that.

Yes, the Euclid is definitely louder on the BT cable than the iSine is. Though it is possible the cables use different DACs/amps. Note that the iSine has a sensitivity of 110 dB/mW and impedance of 16 ohms while the Euclid has a sensitivity of 105 dB/mW and an impedance of 12 ohms. Both Cipher cables have the same specs though and feature Cipher DSP, but it likely isn’t the same target (possibly?). Based on stats, the iSine should be the louder one despite the impedance measurements. It could also be possible that the DSP that the BT cable is lowering the upper midrange on the iSine causing the need to push volume higher vs the Euclid where I don’t hear as much deviation from a non-DSP setup.

 

[m8o]

P.s. this iem has me seriously considering selling my Ether Flow C (and I -never- sell anything). This gives me everything I expect from that and more, plus greater isolation than that. I guess I'll have to go back and forth some before making a snap decision. But that's probably the 2nd or third thing that entered my mind when I plugged the Euclid into my MHA-100 and listened to my favorite playlist. ... which made me put off lunch for three hours as I couldn't pull myself away.

Since I made that statement a while ago, I've rediscovered my Ether C Flow, importantly w/the 1.1 tuning kit. I feel compelled to set the record straight for any that read this above.

Let me just say no, the Euclid is no 'replacement' for that. Dont get me wrong, I love my Euclid. And it is definitely my best iem & compact portable performer But the Ether C Flow 1.1 takes equalization -so- much better than the Euclid. It is definitely worthy of remaining in my collection, and will.

 

[macsearcher]

Hey folks,
I've got a pair on the way. Thanks for all of the input from everyone!
I'm wondering if a few of you could chime in on thoughts for tip rolling on these.
The spinfits have been mentioned, which version are you using?

 

[tinyman392]

Hey folks,
I've got a pair on the way. Thanks for all of the input from everyone!
I'm wondering if a few of you could chime in on thoughts for tip rolling on these.
The spinfits have been mentioned, which version are you using?

They used to be (or will eventually be agin) supplied with CP145 which work very well in terms of SQ. The only issue I have with them is that the nozzle portion of the tip tends to wear with time and eventually doesn't hold anymore requiring me to get another pair (like within a month or two). I've since moved over to the CP100 which are a tighter fit, but can fit and aren't likely to have that issue nearly as quickly. There is a slight loss of bass presence and dynamics with them though, but its slight. The Euclid also come with Comply Foam tips which would likely be the best in "fixing" the tonality of the headphones, but I've ever been a fan of foam tips (cumbersome to use and constant replacement).

 

[macsearcher]

They used to be (or will eventually be agin) supplied with CP145 which work very well in terms of SQ. The only issue I have with them is that the nozzle portion of the tip tends to wear with time and eventually doesn't hold anymore requiring me to get another pair (like within a month or two). I've since moved over to the CP100 which are a tighter fit, but can fit and aren't likely to have that issue nearly as quickly. There is a slight loss of bass presence and dynamics with them though, but its slight. The Euclid also come with Comply Foam tips which would likely be the best in "fixing" the tonality of the headphones, but I've ever been a fan of foam tips (cumbersome to use and constant replacement).

Thanks tinyman392.
Audeze are sending SpinFits for me so I'll report back on my findings. Looking forward to trying a few options out!

 

[caustic386]

@debullet I'm on 'sabbatical' you might say from tech and headphones atm; I haven't turned a computer or a dap on for over two months. Once I return to my Euclid and verify I still agree with my peq parameters, I'll share them.

Did you ever land on any EQ you're happy with?

 

[Tex Irie]

Using the Euclids with a balanced Kimber Kable [MUC-M12SB1] and the small comply T-200 ear tips on all my gear, no equalizing, plug-ins, or mods.. Sublime is the only word that comes to mind.. I spent hours listening to music yesterday. The Euclid is very comfortable. I wear glasses and totally forgot they were there. The Euclid is an excellent pairing with the DX300 Amp 11| Digital Filter D5.

@Audeze Good Job! This definitely reminds me of positive attributes of the LCD-X/XC/MX4/5 and to some extent the Hifiman HE1000se in a smaller package.. Very engaging, resolute, enjoyable listen.... Fun and Goosebumps/Chill inducing especially with Female vocalists (Teena Marie, Mariah Carey, Mary J. Blige, Anita Baker, Toni Braxton, Minnie Riperton)

 

[Tex Irie]

I recollect comments that mentioned the Euclid lacked in Bass... That may be a ymmv/source dependent thing.. For me this has excellent bass not boomy but taut low end. Sounded excellent when listening NERD, Larry June, Big KRIT, UGK, Outkast, Kendrick Lamar, etc.... I don't find the Euclid to be bass shy or anemic. In the end it's all about the music.. Invest in your downtime wisely.. One man's opinion..

 

[tinyman392]

I recollect comments that mentioned the Euclid lacked in Bass... That may be a ymmv/source dependent thing.. For me this has excellent bass not boomy but taut low end. Sounded excellent when listening NERD, Larry June, Big KRIT, UGK, Outkast, Kendrick Lamar, etc.... I don't find the Euclid to be bass shy or anemic. In the end it's all about the music.. Invest in your downtime wisely.. One man's opinion..

I wouldn’t call it anemic, but I would describe it as bass light. That doesn’t mean the bass is bad, it actually does have just enough presence IMO. It is also very source, tip, and fit dependent as well.

 

[Tex Irie]

I wouldn’t call it anemic, but I would describe it as bass light. That doesn’t mean the bass is bad, it actually does have just enough presence IMO. It is also very source, tip, and fit dependent as well.

I can appreciate your perspective.. I'm kind of wondering what the Euclid would sound like with iFi's portable DACs and XBass enabled? I don't think it's necessary for a good portion of my music collection but I'm looking to purchase an xDSD Gryphon. Has anyone here tried the Euclid and xDSD Gryphon together?

 

[Devodonaldson]

I recollect comments that mentioned the Euclid lacked in Bass... That may be a ymmv/source dependent thing.. For me this has excellent bass not boomy but taut low end. Sounded excellent when listening NERD, Larry June, Big KRIT, UGK, Outkast, Kendrick Lamar, etc.... I don't find the Euclid to be bass shy or anemic. In the end it's all about the music.. Invest in your downtime wisely.. One man's opinion..

Lived this post and the one mentioning Mary J and Anita Baker. A man with similar listening habits. "Cadillactica"! Waiting for my euclid along with my Oriolus SE02 balanced 5 band eq to go with my ba300s balanced tube amp and Shanling m8. Loved what I heard of Euclid at Canjam, and I can just boost the 64hz freq when I play "My Sub" pt 1-4