Westone ES5

[dogears]

^So sorry to hear that. I really do hope it doesn't happen to mine if ever. I'm on the other side of the continent!

 

[SolidSnake3]

Isn't the right the same ear piece that other people were having issue with it's sound cutting out?

 

[Joe-Siow]

Hmm... This is strangely all so familiar again. The right side failing incident.

 

[dj nellie]

That sucks, Parrots.  It is definitely troubling that this defect seems to be a pattern.  What was your reason for going with acrylic tips?
 
My ES5s have really opened up in the 20 or so hours I've put on them since my initial impressions.  Whereas the treble seemed rolled off and the overall presentation was compressed and congested, it now feels much more expanded and effortless. 
 
Did a quick A vs. B with Radiohead's "Just" on my WhipMOD and SR71-b, with the JH16s on a balanced TWag and the ES5 on a SE TWag OM.  Wasn't listening as critically as I could have, but to me the ES5 just provided the more engaging experience--imaging was slightly more precise, the acoustic guitar parts felt more tactile and visceral, and the vocals had a bit more body and presence to them.  The JH16s sound a bit more laid-back by comparison, although this may be due to the balanced cable, which I find tends to stretch sounds a bit to the left and right and leave the mids feeling slightly thin.
 
Westone seems to have nailed the fit on the first try, although the left tip is a bit pokey and tends to pop in and out if I'm walking around or eating.  What surprised me is how long and wide the vinyl part of the tip is, and how far recessed the bores are within the tip.  The JH16's bores are right at the end of the tip.  I wonder what, if any, effect this has on the sound.  A wild guess on my part is that moving the bores away from the ear drums can help create the illusion of an "out of head" sound and maybe reduce harshness/sibilance, but that is my uneducated speculation.
 
I'll report back with impressions on different genres and sources, but so far the ES5 has really engrossed me.  Part of it is the level of isolation that the ES5 provides; even in a quiet room, that extra bit of blackness in the background seems to bring you closer to the music and allow you to hear every low-level detail.

 

[dj nellie]

Just compared ES5 and JH16 on Cosmic Gate's "Open Your Heart" on the HM-801, with lineout to the SR71b.  ES5's volume level is much higher on the same volume level compared to the JH16, but that may be because the JH16 is on a balanced cable.
 
This is a beautiful trance ballad, with haunting female vocals and punchy, ominous synths.  Once again, I preferred the ES5's presentation:  The (synthesized) cymbal claps seemed slightly more accurately placed and crisp, originating from the top left and echoing down toward the middle, whereas the JH16 made it seem like the cymbals don't move much from the center and muffled them a bit.  Very interesting that the ES5 were able to make this subtle effect seem slightly more prominent.
 
The ES5s seemed to render the vocals with the sensuality and presence that I think they need.  On the JH16, the vocals seem slightly more polite and thin, but still very pleasing. 
 
The synth punches are a bit brighter and harsher on the ES5, which I imagine could cause some fatigue in a long listening session.  The JH16 provided slightly more low bass rumble, and its presentation felt slightly darker than the ES5's.  The bass impact of the low kick drums seemed roughly the same on both headphones.
 
I put on another of my favorite tracks from the same album, "Body of Conflict."  Both the ES5 and JH16 put on an incredible show that had me nodding my head.  But where the JH16 provided a slightly more "arena-like" presentation, the ES5 just fully captured the claustrophobic, robotic nature of the vocals much more accurately.  I had never heard the vocals on this song depicted quite that eerily, and it gave me even more appreciation for the producing skills of the guys in Cosmic Gate.  Although the JH16 gave the vocals the faded, ethereal feeling they should have, the ES5 just took it to the next level of detail and put the vocals in a prison cell.  I could really feel what the producers were going for--a woman trapped and emotionally tortured, struggling to make her voice heard. 
 
Also, as in the previous song, the various synth effects seemed more accurately placed and textured with the ES5 than JH16; for example, the "tock" sounds punctuating the intro just have slightly more realism, as they seem to evaporate into the air.
 
I should qualify these impressions by saying that I may not have a 100% perfect fit on my JH16's right side; the sound is very subtly muffled and sounds that are placed on the extreme right seem slightly more distant than they maybe should be.  Also, I'm listening in a somewhat noisy room with people talking, although it gets reduced to a faint murmur when music is playing with the JH16 (and gets blocked out entirely with the ES5).
 
A side note:  The SR71-b's SE output is surprisingly good, so much so that the ES5 with SE cable can sound as good or better to me than the JH16 with balanced cable.  This is a pleasant discovery for me, since I found the Protector's SE output to be somewhat grainy, although I never really tested it extensively and my sources have improved since then.

 

[Anaxilus]

Nice impressions!  I imagine the ES5 and JH16 use different connectors?  Otherwise you could try the ES5 balanced.  

 

[rawrster]

Do you mean the pins to connect the cable to the custom? I believe JHA and Westone uses the same cable as many members have used the twag cable for example for their JHA customs and some have it on the ES5.

 

[dj nellie]

Nah they use the same connectors, I just don't want to keep swapping the cable out (although maybe I should for a totally fair comparison). I figure, the TWag cable is the same in both, the amp is the same, and any dramatic difference in SE vs. balanced should be readily apparent and probably favor the JH16. But so far, the difference that the balanced cable makes hasn't been easily noticeable, and the ES5 has been beating the JH16 in my book on every song I've tried.
 
The comparison has been quite an eye-opening experience, considering how much I loved the JH16.  The improvements that the ES5 shows me are subtle but nonetheless noticeable and really enrich the listening experience:  the isolation, the more varied and accurate placement of sounds and images, and the more textured nature of sounds and instruments are the biggest differences for me.  Vocals just have a bit more magic to them, although whether you consider this a coloration and the JH16's vocals more neutral may depend on your preferences.  The JH16 definitely seems darker overall by comparison, maybe because of a subtle low bass presence that the ES5 doesn't quite have.

 

[rmappita]

Hi dj Nellie,

Are you getting a harsh and sibilance tremble with your JH16 or ES5?

Rodrigo

 

[Donnyhifi]

Thanks Kaneman! You've answered alot of my questions on how these two compare. I have the SM3 now and planning to get the ES5 or the EM3Pro soon. BTY, which tips did you use with the SM3? I'm using the sensorcoms with abit chopped off going over an Shure olive core, this makes sticking em in your ear a cinch.

 
The Sensorcoms also boost up the treble a little bit which helped with the veil. I didn't hear the veil much at all in the beginning but I hear it more with certain tracks lately. Having said all that they are the best universals I have ever used.
 
Quote:

So after getting some time with the SM3s and going back and forth with a variety of material? (Classical, dubstep, jazz, metal, rock, country, and some folk thrown in for good mix) It's not really a fair comparison. The SM3s are great 'phones but the ES5s are in a different league.
 
Biggest difference to me? The mids. They're quite a bit more pronounced on the ES5 throughout the vocal range. Not a bad thing at all, it's a GREAT thing. In comparison? The SM3s sound quite recessed. They're also quite a bit more shut in on the highs, and I hear them getting overwhelmed in the lows in a way I never noticed before. The bass is still solid and very good, but the deepest subsonics have 'em 'running to catch up' so to speak whereas the ES5s simply let fly. The SM3s still can shake your ear canals, but the ES5s do so with complete ease and lack of strain.
 
Soundstaging was one thing I really loved about the SM3s. The ES5s are far more intimate, and 'closer in perspective' if that makes sense. In that sense? I like what the SM3s do. But what has to be given up to get there? No thanks. Overall they just sound more veiled, slower, and while they're excellent in their own right just can't keep up.
 
I don't own another 'phone that can hold a candle to the ES5s.
 
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[dj nellie]

No, no sibilance with either JH16 or ES5. The ES5 is probably more aggressive in the upper mids and treble, but so far it has not been too harsh for me and I haven't noticed sibilance in vocals. I've never really noticed sibilance in any headphone that I've owned, including the Westone 3, which some people swore had painful treble (although I think they were in the minority).

 

[rmappita]

 
Quote:

No, no sibilance with either JH16 or ES5. The ES5 is probably more aggressive in the upper mids and treble, but so far it has not been too harsh for me and I haven't noticed sibilance in vocals. I've never really noticed sibilance in any headphone that I've owned, including the Westone 3, which some people swore had painful treble (although I think they were in the minority).

Yes =/  I've sold my Westone 3 because the sibilance problem, to much for my ears... The best universal IEM that I've had was the Triple.fi 10 PRO ( Free of sibilance for me ). I asked you that, bc I get sibilance and a harsh tremble  out my JH16s, but this is not a JH16 nature problem, because I know a lot of people that don't hear any sibilance with their 16s. JH Audio is helping me to fix that. BTW my fit is perfet! Thank You
 
Rodrigo

 
 

 

[Anaxilus]

It would take a horribly mastered track to produce objectionable sibilance on the ES5.  Listening to Glenn Frey right now on Tequila Sunrise and I can actually listen to it comfortably.  That's one of my tracks I use for testing sibilance.

 

[Anaxilus]

Ahhh.....I'm listening to Los Lobos right now and the plucks of the guitar strings and reverb of the body are so vivid and realistic.  Listening to Guantanamera  I swear the singer picked up his Guiro and started running the stick up and down the grooves right in front of my face.  Like for real.  For those that don't know.
 

 
Any other users notice that the vinyl tips seem to actually maintain the shape of your ear canal better the more you use them?  I don't they have a totally default cold resting shape.
 
Any ES5 users NOT notice their phones change from out of the box? 

 

[googleli]

Quote:

 

Yes =/  I've sold my Westone 3 because the sibilance problem, to much for my ears... The best universal IEM that I've had was the Triple.fi 10 PRO ( Free of sibilance for me ). I asked you that, bc I get sibilance and a harsh tremble  out my JH16s, but this is not a JH16 nature problem, because I know a lot of people that don't hear any sibilance with their 16s. JH Audio is helping me to fix that. BTW my fit is perfet! Thank You
 
Rodrigo

 
 

If you liked TF10 Pro then definitely go for UE18 Pro, UE18 Pro is a 10 times improved version of the TF10 Pro. The Westone ES5 has a wider soundstage and an amazingingly full mid to upper range, but when it comes to timbres I think the UE18 Pro has an upper hand, and that's why I have been using ES5 and 18 Pro interchangeably. I haven't heard JH16 Pro yet but UE18 Pro's bass is amazingly deep and accurate yet balanced. With the UE Reference model in place, one would imagine that the UE18 Pro is more like a "fun" phone. But it is not. Its representation of music is in fact more accurate than the ES5 (IMO), although in terms of the body / lushness of the mid-rhigh range, ES5 is better.
 
As an owner of both, I'd say go for UE18 Pro rather than ES5 if you really like TF10 Pro.