[protoss]

@SHAMuuu
No that's one of the worst headphones out.

Best headphone ever made so far is the Onkyo A800 with a Harman Curve at 90% with perfect price point at $399, and called itself flagship when it was released in 2016.
Probably 500 units only.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/onkyo-a800-–-master-class.965012/

 

[SHAMuuu]

@SHAMuuu
No that's one of the worst headphones out.

Best headphone ever made so far is the Onkyo A800 with a Harman Curve at 90% with perfect price point at $399, and called itself flagship when it was released in 2016.
Probably 500 units only.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/onkyo-a800-–-master-class.965012/

That is one of the craziest reviews on a headphone. Maybe the craziest one of all XD

Mostly due to your experience and collection, it seems so out of place.

And I'm also surprised by it's driver being multilayered with the stiff dome.

Nice to see it paired with the Eddie Studio. That's a combo you don't see everyday! Heck, any tube amp and 32 ohm is murky water, so it's quite the synergy combo you found.

 

[number1sixerfan]

My TOTL All-Time Ranking - Updated​

This is an all-time PERSONAL PREFERENCE ranking for me. I think through this in two ways: 1) what do I enjoy listening to most, inclusive of head time I give them; and 2) how likely or willing would I be to sell (007 and HE60 are exceptions, not keen on ever selling either regardless of ranking. I’ll also do a “technical” all-time ranking that is going to look different. Working on that now.

1. Shangri-La Sr.
2. Sennheiser HE90
3. Sony MDR-R10/Audio-Technica L3000
4. Stax x9000 (Stax Omega would be right here as well, but I haven’t owned it)
5. Raal Sr1a/Stax 009 & 007 MK1/Hifiman Susvara/Abyss TC (007 MUST be amped properly or it drops on this list significantly)
6. Sennheiser HE60 “Baby Orpheus”
7. Audeze CRBN/Focal Utopia
8. Audeze LCD-R/ZMF Verite Closed (these are really awesome values)
9. Audeze LCD-5 (I’m sorry, but I owned it, I have to add it lol)

I can't believe I missed the ES Labs ES-R10 and ES-1a. Both are really tremendous values, but ended up getting a bit less use than intended after picking up the R10 and HE90. I would probably have them somewhere between #6 and #7, but won't hard rank them as I didn't spend a ton of time with each.

Both are very easy recommends from me, and can be sold at very little loss, if any if someone finds they aren't a fit for them.

 

[Ciggavelli]

I can't believe I missed the ES Labs ES-R10 and ES-1a. Both are really tremendous values, but ended up getting a bit less use than intended after picking up the R10 and HE90. I would probably have them somewhere between #6 and #7, but won't hard rank them as I didn't spend a ton of time with each.

Both are very easy recommends from me, and can be sold at very little loss, if any if someone finds they aren't a fit for them.

The ES-R10 gets a strong recommendation from me too. I bought it early on and I’m not sure he has anymore for sale. I’ve never heard to real R10, but others have mentioned it’s like 80% similar to the Sony. The ES-R10 sounds wonderful and let’s people hear what the legendary R10 sounds like. I personally don’t want to buy a 30 year old pair of headphones for $6K or whatever it costs because it’s so risky. The ES-R10 supposedly gives you that house sound at a fraction of the cost. Some have even said the ES-R10 sounds better with modern music and the genres I like (metal and hip-hop) than the Sony R10.

 

[VandyMan]

Re: Vintage OG and Present Day TOTL Comparisons
I recently put the new Audeze pads on my LCD-2.1 purchased Feb 2011. This was the first revision of the LCD-2. I doubt many of them exist because Audeze was a very small company at that time and the LCD-2.1 was replaced by the LCD-2.2 less than six months later (ant then the fazor version). There was a lot of variation in Audeze headphones in the early days so I can't say if mine sound the same as other LCD-2.1s or not. Mine have a warmish mid-range, tons of bass, and are a tiny bit rolled off. Anyway, I gave them a listen for the first time in a few years. I was reminded what an enjoyable listen they are. The bass with the new pads is even better than I recalled.

I then realized that I could compare one of Audeze's earliest headphones to their very latest. So I got out my LCD-5 and listened to the same tracks (without EQ). I had planned to do back and forth comparisons, take notes, and write something up. However, from the first track it was clear that the LCD-5 is better than the LCD-2.1 in every single category (sound, comfort, fit, etc). It was so obviously and overwhelmingly better in every way, there is really not much to say about it. Perhaps the LCD-2.1 has slightly more bass, but it is bloated and blurry in comparison to the LCD-5's bass.

I don't think I'll ever sell my LCD-2.1 because it has sentimental value, but they will go back on the shelf, not on my head.

 

[number1sixerfan]

The ES-R10 gets a strong recommendation from me too. I bought it early on and I’m not sure he has anymore for sale. I’ve never heard to real R10, but others have mentioned it’s like 80% similar to the Sony. The ES-R10 sounds wonderful and let’s people hear what the legendary R10 sounds like. I personally don’t want to buy a 30 year old pair of headphones for $6K or whatever it costs because it’s so risky. The ES-R10 supposedly gives you that house sound at a fraction of the cost. Some have even said the ES-R10 sounds better with modern music and the genres I like (metal and hip-hop) than the Sony R10.

I didn't really realize that the run would be the short, may have kept them if I thought about that. I didn't want to buy the original R10s for the same reason and I don't blame anyone that feels the exact same way. Definitely wouldn't have if I didn't hear them in person. And I have said it quite a few times, I do think the ES-Labs version is at least 80% there, they just do sound a bit different.

The other downside is I use the R10 more sparingly and at lower volumes intentionally to preserve them. I've been able to be really consistent, but I honestly rather not have to feel the need to do so. Worth it so far, but worth mentioning.

 

[dleblanc343]

Hi all I'll probably be sending my ES-1a to Mitch @ accuratesound in an effort to have a convolution filter calibrated to fine-tune its neutrality.

As outrageous as this may seem, I think the ES-1a has the best handling of low bass and its note fundamentals of any e-stat I've heard besides HE1 and is currently a very raw & unpolished gem with tons of potential so long as its tonality can be linearized and so without compressions + artefacts. It sounds very much like SR-009/ SR009S though utilizing technology borrowed from the original OMEGA. To be 100% fair, it sounds pretty terrible tonally as it is, but the potential is sky-high.

I really hate to be "that guy", but I really do think - albeit less technical - the ES-1a is more capable of a "proper" tonality than X9000 is, and therefore better sound. These tonal quirks and bass issues being a STAX & not an e-stat specific problem where bass is never able to hit a benchmark of quality thus never a full-range dynamic reproduction. The SR-007MK1 & MK2 with blue tack mod being the best STAX bass I've heard to date, but not nearly at the level of HE1 or Aperio (though Aperio has its issues too). CRBN has good bass, but it's unfortunately victim of a bit of compression & not in the same playing field resolution wise.

X9000 would probably absolute end-game with some tonal adjustments - we're working with an extremely strong foundation with this headphone.


Cheers!

 

[AudiophileJargon]

Re: Vintage OG and Present Day TOTL Comparisons
I recently put the new Audeze pads on my LCD-2.1 purchased Feb 2011. This was the first revision of the LCD-2. I doubt many of them exist because Audeze was a very small company at that time and the LCD-2.1 was replaced by the LCD-2.2 less than six months later (ant then the fazor version). There was a lot of variation in Audeze headphones in the early days so I can't say if mine sound the same as other LCD-2.1s or not. Mine have a warmish mid-range, tons of bass, and are a tiny bit rolled off. Anyway, I gave them a listen for the first time in a few years. I was reminded what an enjoyable listen they are. The bass with the new pads is even better than I recalled.

I then realized that I could compare one of Audeze's earliest headphones to their very latest. So I got out my LCD-5 and listened to the same tracks (without EQ). I had planned to do back and forth comparisons, take notes, and write something up. However, from the first track it was clear that the LCD-5 is better than the LCD-2.1 in every single category (sound, comfort, fit, etc). It was so obviously and overwhelmingly better in every way, there is really not much to say about it. Perhaps the LCD-2.1 has slightly more bass, but it is bloated and blurry in comparison to the LCD-5's bass.

I don't think I'll ever sell my LCD-2.1 because it has sentimental value, but they will go back on the shelf, not on my head.

I certainly will not let go of my LCD3 pf any time soon

Slightly modded to my preferences, and I remove my dust cover when listening

Edit: Added a few different materials to my mod. (If anyone is interested pm me)

 

[number1sixerfan]

Hi all I'll probably be sending my ES-1a to Mitch @ accuratesound in an effort to have a convolution filter calibrated to fine-tune its neutrality.

As outrageous as this may seem, I think the ES-1a has the best handling of low bass and its note fundamentals of any e-stat I've heard besides HE1 and is currently a very raw & unpolished gem with tons of potential so long as its tonality can be linearized and so without compressions + artefacts. It sounds very much like SR-009/ SR009S though utilizing technology borrowed from the original OMEGA. To be 100% fair, it sounds pretty terrible tonally as it is, but the potential is sky-high.

I really hate to be "that guy", but I really do think - albeit less technical - the ES-1a is more capable of a "proper" tonality than X9000 is, and therefore better sound. These tonal quirks and bass issues being a STAX & not an e-stat specific problem where bass is never able to hit a benchmark of quality thus never a full-range dynamic reproduction. The SR-007MK1 & MK2 with blue tack mod being the best STAX bass I've heard to date, but not nearly at the level of HE1 or Aperio (though Aperio has its issues too). CRBN has good bass, but it's unfortunately victim of a bit of compression & not in the same playing field resolution wise.

X9000 would probably absolute end-game with some tonal adjustments - we're working with an extremely strong foundation with this headphone.


Cheers!

You're not being "that guy" at all. At the end of the day it's all subjective, and people have had their individual quirks with every single TOTL stax model. Between the 009, 007 (of which people don't even agree on the individual models lol), the x9000 etc. there's just a lot of varying opinions which is perfectly fine. You'll never get Stax fans to agree on what "proper" tonality is in the first place lol

But on the ES-1a I've agreed with your assessment before. I think it has really enjoyable bass and actually a generally solid overall presentation and performance. The only thing was that it trended on the darker side, similar to the 007.. but many people prefer that in comparison to the brighter tradeoff of a more clearer sound in that of say the 009. I also found it really lively, especially in the lower region, similar to the 007 (although keep in mind I was only using the T2 at this point). In my time with it, it felt like a mashup of many of the top stats. I think a hair more neutral and it would be better than out of box.

 

[mulveling]

Another shout-out to both ES Lab offerings - which I'm just so impressed by, and still thoroughly love & enjoy. So yeah they're not peak ultra-fi, and the "giant killer" trope is so tired, but they sure hit a certain sweet spot for the price, and can hold up well beyond that. From what I can overlap with, I think @number1sixerfan's rankings are very fair!

ES-1a with the Nascent Audio / Kerry T2 is truly sweet & musical. Is there a tube-roller's thread for this amp? I feel it benefits from a little more energy & air up top, and I'm actually preferring Russian Mullards (NOT British, which were too dark) over Holland / Amperex EL34, which were my long-time favorite in other Stax tube amps. Haven't been able to grok my feelings on 6922's yet - have used a few NOS there (Siemens E88CC A-frame, Mazda 7308, Holland 6DJ8 A-frame), all good so far.

 

[SHAMuuu]

I didn't really realize that the run would be the short, may have kept them if I thought about that. I didn't want to buy the original R10s for the same reason and I don't blame anyone that feels the exact same way. Definitely wouldn't have if I didn't hear them in person. And I have said it quite a few times, I do think the ES-Labs version is at least 80% there, they just do sound a bit different.

The other downside is I use the R10 more sparingly and at lower volumes intentionally to preserve them. I've been able to be really consistent, but I honestly rather not have to feel the need to do so. Worth it so far, but worth mentioning.

It's interesting your comment about the low volume for r10. I research that one head-fi;er (who is also an owner of headphone company) theorized that the voice coil has some issue or design defect , and the excursion cause the driver to fail, as opposed to some views of long ago that it was biocellulose degrading (LMAO)

But apparently he spoke to sony engineers and they denied this.

I think that is what adds so much mystique to it, that one is utterly in fear while listening to this , which is the total opposite of the intended purpose of this holy grail. The irony!

And you're one lucky fellow.

Its funny, but the only "r10" cups I've seen with my naked peepers was the hifman ones. How sad. I actually laughed when I saw them. It was a weird moment. But I'm sure one day I will see a pair of those Sony cups in the flesh.

 

[number1sixerfan]

Another shout-out to both ES Lab offerings - which I'm just so impressed by, and still thoroughly love & enjoy. So yeah they're not peak ultra-fi, and the "giant killer" trope is so tired, but they sure hit a certain sweet spot for the price, and can hold up well beyond that. From what I can overlap with, I think @number1sixerfan's rankings are very fair!

ES-1a with the Nascent Audio / Kerry T2 is truly sweet & musical. Is there a tube-roller's thread for this amp? I feel it benefits from a little more energy & air up top, and I'm actually preferring Russian Mullards (NOT British, which were too dark) over Holland / Amperex EL34, which were my long-time favorite in other Stax tube amps. Haven't been able to grok my feelings on 6922's yet - have used a few NOS there (Siemens E88CC A-frame, Mazda 7308, Holland 6DJ8 A-frame), all good so far.

I really should do more tube rolling. I've just been so content AND refraining from spending more money lol. I think I will go down the rabbit hole a bit more once I move and am settled.

It's interesting your comment about the low volume for r10. I research that one head-fi;er (who is also an owner of headphone company) theorized that the voice coil has some issue or design defect , and the excursion cause the driver to fail, as opposed to some views of long ago that it was biocellulose degrading (LMAO)

But apparently he spoke to sony engineers and they denied this.

I think that is what adds so much mystique to it, that one is utterly in fear while listening to this , which is the total opposite of the intended purpose of this holy grail. The irony!

And you're one lucky fellow.

Its funny, but the only "r10" cups I've seen with my naked peepers was the hifman ones. How sad. I actually laughed when I saw them. It was a weird moment. But I'm sure one day I will see a pair of those Sony cups in the flesh.

I'm not utterly in fear of anything lol, this is just how I reasonably treat gear that is OG/Vintage and really expensive. The R10 is 30+ years old. I treat it, the HE90 and my L3000 with care and concern. I listen to all three at lower volume and treat as if more fragile than any of my newer gear, as one can only assume that they are more fragile than any of the newer headphones due to age (which absolutely may not be true, it's just an assumption to be on the safer side). I don't expect to be in this hobby forever and will one day sell everything, I want to be able to tell the next person I treated them just as good as the person I bought them from before. And if I do stay in the hobby, chances are they'll last me a very long time because of the precautions.

 

[number1sixerfan]

I would add that although the HE60 and MK1 are vintage, I don’t treat them special listen time or volume wise as above, as they are much easier to replace. Still take great care of them obviously, just no restrictions.

 

[jamato8]

Using the ES R10 with Whiplash cable, excellent results. Seems closer to my memory of the Sony R10.

 

[mulveling]

I play loud. I feel like low frequency distortion on the OG R10 gets very high at a much lower threshold than other dynamic headphones. It's not the amp. It's the drivers. I'd back off and not push them tooo hard, but there was more than 1 pair like this. They should be fine as long as they're play clean, but I wouldn't want to find out the hard way. Meanwhile, Stax drivers are quite hardy - there it's the amps that have a hard time

You know, sometimes vinyl sources cause the headphone drivers to flap with high excursion (like woofers in speakers), so I've also been careful to not subject suspected "delicate" drivers to that (like Focal Utopias). Of course when you get everything in a turntable right - no more flapping, even without a subsonic filter - like in my main rig with 15" Tannoy drivers, which will easily show any such issue