[regal]

Quote:

.  Digital receivers these days work off of 3.3V supplies.  
Have a nice weekend!
 

I lot of smart audiophiles are still using 90's models DAC's,  so I wouldn't make too broad of an assumption.   SPDIF spec is published and set for a reason,  and any transport manufacturer should follow the spec. Of course with the Hiface the best thing to do is use a Newata 1:1 output transformer and use a voltage divider to bring it into spec and maintain 75 ohms output impedance.  But should the average consumer have to disect a product and tediously solder components to make it meet the standard specification thats been held since the early 80's?

 

[regal]

I know there have been a lot of discussions of the Hiface and its relation to upsampling DACs.  System matching is critical,  something that just gets lost on head-fi.  The fact that price is no longer an indicator of quality/high end makes it even more confusing.  The battery powered Hiface is a very low jitter high end transport. 
 
I admit I haven't done a good job explaining why upsampling DAC's are inherently mid-budget level DAC's.  I thought this excellent post on Audiasylum would explain my position and many others on why you shouldn't spend the money on a Hiface for a budget DAC.  Of course not everyone agrees with this,  but at least if you have an open mind you can understand why I recommend a high quality oversampling DAC be purchased before buying a modded Hiface.
 
http://www.audioasylum.com/audio/digital/messages/15/154564.html

 

[Currawong]

I have removed a couple of pages of posts overall.  
 
First: Personal attacks of any kind, even veiled via insinuation, are not on. This will be the first and last warning about it. 
Second: Bans are not discussed publicly, ever. The issues are between the moderators and the member. Suffice to say, people are only ever banned when they break the rules repeatedly, even after warnings.  
 
 

---

 
 
Ok, the above being over and done with, here is my thought (as a member) on the discussion about the Hiface sounding 'bright'.  You guys need to read what Dan Lavry wrote about the audible effects on jitter.  It was discussed comprehensively in a thread elsewhere. The frequency response of a device when a sine wave is put through it doesn't show harmonic distortions and the like when music is playing. I've had, for example, issues with obvious (to me with my gear) distortion in the treble using 75 Ohm cable terminated with RCA plugs (rather than BNC), as well as with DACs using hard-cut-off filters (though that might not have been what was responsible) and under other circumstances. Now I can't obviously say exactly what was the cause without serious measuring equipment, but I believe there is enough information out there that I can speculate, or, at the very least, it is teaching me what things to avoid in the future.  Also, has anyone thought to look up how up-sampling works?
 
You guys need to be less aggressive about this.  Like many of you, I have experimented with the equipment I have with varying results. There is somewhat of a lack of useful technical info for us to be able to usefully understand what is going on though.  More worrying is the lack of effort, from what I can see, of people wanting to research and learn.  None of you, as far as I know, are engineers of the type capable of understanding what is going on, so can I suggest adopting an attitude more towards what you are, that is, curious end-users?

 

[K3cT]

PS Audio PerfectWave DAC is considered high-end and getting rave reviews and I'm fairly sure it's an upsampling DAC... 

 

[upstateguy]

Quote:

PS Audio PerfectWave DAC is considered high-end and getting rave reviews and I'm fairly sure it's an upsampling DAC... 

It is an upsampling dac, but the upsampling is defeatable for use with low jitter sources like the HiFace. 
 
From the PS Audio web site:  (read the entire discussion here)
 
"It is technically possible to raise any sample rate and bit rate to a higher level through the use of a sample rate converter (SRC).  These devices are amazing number crunching mathematic marvels that have been used since the beginning of the CD.  They perform their magic by what is known as data manipulation.  Their principal value is to reduce jitter , increase bit depth and sample rate so subsequent digital filters can sound better.......
 
The PWD has one of the most sophisticate SRC's made providing 6 choices of sample rate improvement through the front panel touch screen.  We included this sophisticated SRC for two reasons: it is expected and in some cases, beneficial.  We also included a way to defeat the SRC.
 
We labeled the SRC bypass as "Native Mode" because it allows you to bypass completely the SRC's data manipulation and listen to the raw data as it is sent natively from the source.  In most cases, Native Mode sounds far superior to any of the SRC choices, including 24 bit 192 kHz. (when using low jitter sources)..........."
 
USG

 

[upstateguy]

Quote:

 
Ok, the above being over and done with, here is my thought (as a member) on the discussion about the Hiface sounding 'bright'.  You guys need to read what Dan Lavry wrote about the audible effects on jitter.  It was discussed comprehensively in a thread elsewhere. The frequency response of a device when a sine wave is put through it doesn't show harmonic distortions and the like when music is playing. I've had, for example, issues with obvious (to me with my gear) distortion in the treble using 75 Ohm cable terminated with RCA plugs (rather than BNC), as well as with DACs using hard-cut-off filters (though that might not have been what was responsible) and under other circumstances. Now I can't obviously say exactly what was the cause without serious measuring equipment, but I believe there is enough information out there that I can speculate, or, at the very least, it is teaching me what things to avoid in the future.  Also, has anyone thought to look up how up-sampling works?
 

 
Hi Currawong
 
Could you go into a little more detail about they type of treble distortion you heard when a 75 Ohm cable was terminated with RCA plugs? 
 
Since My HiFace is terminated with a 75 Ohm RCA, maybe this what is responsible for the brightness (or treble tilt) I've been experiencing?
 
USG

 

[Currawong]

I haven't been methodical about nailing it down, but between the Reference 3 and Reference 1, if I used a Van Den Hul The First Ultimate as a digital cable, I'd get a kind of annoying glare around the mids and treble with some music.  Replacing it with a proper BNC Belden cable rectified this.

 

[Happy Camper]

USG
 
Your cable copper or silver?

 

[upstateguy]

Quote:

USG
 
Your cable copper or silver?

 
This one:  3ft. Dayton Digital Coaxial Cable
 
USG

 

[Pacha]

I had more irritating treble peak with my silver Oyaide cable than with my current RCA/RCA male adapter fitted directly between DAC and HiFace. Less harshness with same level of details.
I'd like to see how it could have sounded with BNC, but I have no BNC input on my DAC-19DSP anyway.

 

[Pacha]

Yes I know the differences between my jkeny modded version and the stock HiFace. I do own the modified version and should have specified it for those who don't know. It's already in my profile anyway.
 
I have two adapters like this.
 
Real Cable :
http://www.cables-hifi.fr/102-157-thickbox/real-cable-a6071-prolongateur-rca-rca-male.jpg
 
HQ :
http://www.transistek.com/photos_produits/1p/1_HQS-SAC064.jpg
 
I tried both and didn't see much of a difference. Real Cable one is gold plated (don't know to how much carat though), HQ one is 24K gold plated. Both seem to use Teflon as dielectric, the latter PTFE as far as I know, and I don't know if they're 75 ohms or not unfortunately. Nothing mentionned on the websites.
Each was sounding more or less as good as my Oyaide DR-510 cable for me, with less emphasized treble and smoother sound so I sold the Oyaide as these cost $5 while the Oyaide was $250. It helped to upgrade my DAC.

 

[Sebhelyesfarku]

 
Quote:

Btw, referring to your battery powered modification as a "HiFace" is quite misleading, as the term "HiFace" is usually applied to the stock version sold by m2tech.
 
USG

Maybe the jkeny modded hiFace should be called jFace?

 

[xdanny]

Quote:

Btw, referring to your battery powered modification as a "HiFace" is quite misleading, as the term "HiFace" is usually applied to the stock version sold by m2tech.  If the two units sounded the same no one would pay hundreds of dollars more for the battery powered version, nor put up with the hassle of constantly charging it nor dealing with accidentally draining the batteries because they forgot to turn it off......  The only thing they have in common is that an upsampling DAC will mask their low jitter effects.

 
USG

There is no hassle whatsoever.  In fact, a very well thought out design, plug it in and forget about it. I have it next to my gear and I turn it off and on with my amp and preamp.

 

[Pacha]

I agree. Charging is pretty quick, and you can listen for more than 12 hours non stop (I let the music play when I wanted to burn-in my new DAC). You just turn it ON when you put the cans on your head, and OFF when you take them off. There is more practical but no big deal here.

 

[upstateguy]

 
Quote:

There is no hassle whatsoever.  In fact, a very well thought out design, plug it in and forget about it. I have it next to my gear and I turn it off and on with my amp and preamp.

Hiya Danny
 
LOL, I wish I could say the same thing.  I've often left my amp and dac on all night after late night headphone sessions.  I'm sure a lot of the headphone guys can relate to this..  Interestingly, that never happens with my speaker system.
 
USG