Ultrasone Proline 750 with Moon Audio Silver Dragon Cable Review
Dec 31, 2006 at 4:02 AM Post #16 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sovkiller /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Sorry, you misunderstood me, I was talking about Drew and the Ultrasone future recabling relationship, not about the plug...


From what Drew tells me Ultrasone is very excited about this whole thing and is looking forward to working with Moon Audio.

Quote:

Originally Posted by terance /img/forum/go_quote.gif
it's nice to see a strong following from the ultrasone crew

i think these will be my next cans!!

i assume the 750's are closed? (judging by the picture)



Hi Terance,

Yes, the 750s are closed headphones. The Proline 2500s are the open version of basically the same model. And by all means give the Ultrasones a try, I don't think that you'll be disappointed.
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 4:03 AM Post #17 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by terance /img/forum/go_quote.gif
i assume the 750's are closed? (judging by the picture)


The 550, 650, 750, and E7/9 are all closed.
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 4:04 AM Post #18 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline /img/forum/go_quote.gif
From what Drew tells me Ultrasone is very excited about this whole thing and is looking forward to working with Moon Audio.



Hi Terance,

Yes, the 750s are closed headphones. The Proline 2500s are the open version of basically the same model. And by all means give the Ultrasones a try, I don't think that you'll be disappointed.



what is a good starter pair to get into? something around 150 bucks?

looking on headroom, it looks like they come in pairs, every closed phone has an open counter part? is this the case?

-mattk
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 4:07 AM Post #19 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by terance /img/forum/go_quote.gif
what is a good starter pair to get into? something around 150 bucks?

looking on headroom, it looks like they come in pairs, every closed phone has an open counter part? is this the case?

-mattk



Get any of the PROLines, and try them first...2500 is more airy and with more leakage, the 750 more intimate, similar presentation in both...Sorry no 150.00 PROLines unless used...
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 12:07 PM Post #20 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline /img/forum/go_quote.gif
From what Drew tells me Ultrasone is very excited about this whole thing and is looking forward to working with Moon Audio.


Hmmm, just not excited enough to provide him with a few measly threaded plugs.
rolleyes.gif
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 1:56 PM Post #21 of 79
Well guys, band news for now, I received the asnwer from him, and unfortunatelly his source has dried out. He got the last few ones to source his last cables from them, for the European versions of the "Sistema" which include the PROLines...He is looking into other sources, and as soon as he found one I would let you know...that is the major pain in the neck in audio, you found a source for prats, you base a production line based on that and later on they ran out of them or chage the size, and end of story...
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 2:19 PM Post #22 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline /img/forum/go_quote.gif
No, it's a single entry cable going only to the left ear cup. The internal wiring between the left and right side drivers was not changed.


Now this I don't understand. Isn't the whole point of recabling to replace the lesser cable the manufacturer supplied? Wouldn't one want the same cable going to both drivers? Logic would dictate that since one side is now different than the other, it therefore sounds different.
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 3:02 PM Post #23 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sovkiller /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Well guys, band news for now, I received the asnwer from him, and unfortunatelly his source has dried out. He got the last few ones to source his last cables from them, for the European versions of the "Sistema" which include the PROLines...He is looking into other sources, and as soon as he found one I would let you know...that is the major pain in the neck in audio, you found a source for prats, you base a production line based on that and later on they ran out of them or chage the size, and end of story...


As I keep repeating this is only a problem if one insists on having a removable cable for the 750s or any recabled Ultrasone Proline headphone, after all it doesn't appear that the Edition 7 or 9 has a removable cable.

The improvements to the overall sound of the 750s which the addition of the hardwired Silver Dragon cable has bought, particularity in the areas which have troubled so many of their biggest detractors, such as tightening up the bass and adding better definition to the midrange and treble, is well worth the loss of the convenience of a detachable cable. And remember that at first Drew did try to make a Silver Dragon cable with a 1/8" threaded mini jack but could not find the proper part.

Look I'm not trying to sell anyone on the idea of recabling their Ultrasone headphones nor am I in any way shilling for Drew or Moon Audio. I'm just reporting back my impressions on a little experiment a undertook for the for the sake of sharing with this community. That the results turned out positive in some ways (sonic improvements) and negative in others (lack of parts for DIY cable builders) is just how it is. I would reported the results no matter what the outcome.

The fact remains that Moon Audio is now familiar with recabling Ultrasone headphones and is available to anyone as a resource looking to improve the sound of their headphones. I also know that many people don't believe that cables make even the slightest difference in the sound of any audio equipment and hopefully they're not reading this thread
icon10.gif


But for the those who do believe in the magic of cables the era of the recabled Ultrasones has now officially begun and it's either get on board or watch as the train passes you by!!
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 3:14 PM Post #24 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by jpelg /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Now this I don't understand. Isn't the whole point of recabling to replace the lesser cable the manufacturer supplied? Wouldn't one want the same cable going to both drivers? Logic would dictate that since one side is now different than the other, it therefore sounds different.


Part of what you say is true but there are other factor involved. In the case of the Ultrasones the stock cable is connected to headphones via a threaded 1/8" mini jack which goes to the left ear cup and left side driver, from the left ear cup a hardwired connection runs through the headband to the right ear cup and right side driver, all hardwired. The internal headband wiring is not the same as the wiring used in the stock detachable cable and it has the added advantage of being hardwired.

Drew and I discussed the option of going single entry versus double entry and Drew feels that something like 90% (I'm not sure of the exact number) of the sonic benefits of recabling are gained with a single entry cable. So sure a double entry is the absolute best method but I felt it was a bit of overkill and I was paying the freight so I went with the (cheaper) single entry method
eek.gif
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 3:59 PM Post #25 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline /img/forum/go_quote.gif
As I keep repeating this is only a problem if one insists on having a removable cable for the 750s or any recabled Ultrasone Proline headphone, after all it doesn't appear that the Edition 7 or 9 has a removable cable.

The improvements to the overall sound of the 750s which the addition of the hardwired Silver Dragon cable has bought, particularity in the areas which have troubled so many of their biggest detractors, such as tightening up the bass and adding better definition to the midrange and treble, is well worth the loss of the convenience of a detachable cable. And remember that at first Drew did try to make a Silver Dragon cable with a 1/8" threaded mini jack but could not find the proper part.

Look I'm not trying to sell anyone on the idea of recabling their Ultrasone headphones nor am I in any way shilling for Drew or Moon Audio. I'm just reporting back my impressions on a little experiment a undertook for the for the sake of sharing with this community. That the results turned out positive in some ways (sonic improvements) and negative in others (lack of parts for DIY cable builders) is just how it is. I would reported the results no matter what the outcome.

The fact remains that Moon Audio is now familiar with recabling Ultrasone headphones and is available to anyone as a resource looking to improve the sound of their headphones. I also know that many people don't believe that cables make even the slightest difference in the sound of any audio equipment and hopefully they're not reading this thread
icon10.gif


But for the those who do believe in the magic of cables the era of the recabled Ultrasones has now officially begun and it's either get on board or watch as the train passes you by!!



Once you remove the jack and hardwire it, you face several "problems" IMO, of course you did what you consider better and that is your decision and I respect it, but let's face other points of view, just as a general knowledge or to try to lead others as well....Well one is that you void the warranty which in the case of Ultrasone is a problem given that they do not sell parts, as drivers, directly to the public, and the warranty is fantastic, and the service is top notch, but of course given that they know Drew, maybe you can deal with them, and that is the less problematic one IMO.
wink.gif

The second is that, later on you can't use the cable in any other simlar model, or any other simlar heapdhone, let's say you can have only one cable and 3 different models, there is no need of getting the 2 extra cables, just change the cable from one to the other, this way you save money, as the cables are really expensive (100+).
blink.gif

Another downside, is that later on if you decided to sell the headphone, you are forced to sell the cable with it, or if you decided to upgrade to a better or different model, you will not have the cable. As we have seen here, in case of the senns for example, many times people sell the heapdhone and keep the aftermarket cable, as they retain a better resell value, that the heapdhone itself, or simply becasue they are going for example from HD580 to 600, or 650, and they all share the same cable.
frown.gif

And the last but not the least IMO, is that if you can purchase the cable and attach it yourself, there is no need of sending the headphone to them for recable, just get the cable attach it and period, the way I did it...you can keep on enjoying the headphone in the meanwhile, and this way I'm 100% sure that the sales would be faster and more numerous...

Also now you can not compare before and after...
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(that's a joke, who cares if you are happy with it)

Honestly I would never think in removing any useful feature from any audio device, just to "upgrade" but that is my personal point of view, and in this particular case there was absolutelly no option for you guys so this is IMO somewhat justified...Now enjoy it...
wink.gif


BTW I have an upgraded cable as well, made out of very good rodium silver plated, and several of the stock ones, and honestly the differences IMO do not justify the hassle of the recabling, and are IMO being a little overkill, the stock cable sounds very very good...even sometimes I still use it, as the upgraded is a little short for the distance I'm siting from the amp...but maybe the Moon one sounds far better...
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Just my two cents on this topic...
wink.gif
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 4:01 PM Post #26 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline /img/forum/go_quote.gif
So sure a double entry is the absolute best method but I felt it was a bit of overkill and I was paying the freight so I went with the (cheaper) single entry method
eek.gif



Quote:

Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline /img/forum/go_quote.gif
But for the those who do believe in the magic of cables the era of the recabled Ultrasones has now officially begun and it's either get on board or watch as the train passes you by!!


So what exactly is the price of admission to board the Moon/Ultrasone Luv-Train?
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 4:16 PM Post #27 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sovkiller /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Just my two cents on this topic...
wink.gif



Some excellent points from Alberto in the post above here. As I stated in another thread, I have managed to reterminate my Stefan Audio Art cable with a threaded Ultrasone plug cannibalized from one of my coiled stock cables. It does sound different but I'm gonna wait until my Heed CanAmp arrives before attempting any critical comparisions with the stock Ultrasone cable. But at least I'll be able to do so, since it's not hard-wired.
wink.gif
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 4:22 PM Post #28 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Part of what you say is true but there are other factor involved. In the case of the Ultrasones the stock cable is connected to headphones via a threaded 1/8" mini jack which goes to the left ear cup and left side driver, from the left ear cup a hardwired connection runs through the headband to the right ear cup and right side driver, all hardwired. The internal headband wiring is not the same as the wiring used in the stock detachable cable and it has the added advantage of being hardwired.


So what seems to be happening is that the Moon Audio cabling is equalizing the sound between your amp and the internal Ultrasone wiring scheme, rather than "opening up a better pipeline" directly between the headphone & source/amp.

Not that this is a bad thing. It only paints a different perspective on why different cables make things sound different. You are not necessarily getting more information, but altered information.
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 4:46 PM Post #29 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by jpelg /img/forum/go_quote.gif
So what seems to be happening is that the Moon Audio cabling is equalizing the sound between your amp and the internal Ultrasone wiring scheme, rather than "opening up a better pipeline" directly between the headphone & source/amp.

Not that this is a bad thing. It only paints a different perspective on why different cables make things sound different. You are not necessarily getting more information, but altered information.



I'm not sure that I understand your distinctions here, James. What you're saying can be applied to any cable or indeed series of connections in the audio chain. Whether they actually provide more or altered signal information or any combination thereof would be difficult to measure and is mainly down to listener perception. But so goes the discussion of cables.
wink.gif
 
Dec 31, 2006 at 4:54 PM Post #30 of 79
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dexdexter /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I'm not sure that I understand your distinctions here, James. What you're saying can be applied to any cable or indeed series of connections in the audio chain.


Absolutely. Quote:

Whether they actually provide more or altered signal information or any combination thereof would be difficult to measure and is mainly down to listener perception.


Not necessarily, as signals can be measured. But that's a debate for another thread.

Back on topic, anyone have pics of the Proline internal wiring?
 

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