[kramer5150]

Quote:

 
Sony SA3000, no discussion as far as I'm concerned.
 
I've had the HD600/650, DT880, K701 and while they all come close to neutrality they can't touch the Sony's for detail retrieval.

I am thinking about adding a sa3k... I'm in no hurry though.  Is it really 70 ohms?, or is that an Amazon typo?  I always thought sonys were in the vicinity of 16-30 ohms.  If its 70 then that works better with all my amps too.

 

[Graphicism]

Quote:

I am thinking about adding a sa3k... I'm in no hurry though.  Is it really 70 ohms?, or is that an Amazon typo?  I always thought sonys were in the vicinity of 16-30 ohms.  If its 70 then that works better with all my amps too.

 
Yes they're 70 Ohm at 1 kHz ~ I use them with my Tube amp.
 
Oh and I believe they are or going to be discontinued.

 

[obobskivich]

For OP - the AKGs are an easy suggestion. A very enjoyable and balanced headphone, good imaging and fairly balanced/neutral sounding.

 

[papamogl]

Ouch, that listening session didn't go well.  No Sony SA3000 there - pitty. No HD600 too, so the HD650 had to step in. I still prefer the sound signature of the AKG K701, but boy is it ugly (doesn't bother me too much), and boy is it uncomfortable! Not only the headband, but the earpads too were somehow squeezing (I know, my had is oddly shaped

).
So I went out of the shop empty handed and back to square one. I'm now very interested in the LFF Paradox, but it's risky to order without hearing them first (which I can't in switzerland). How would a Paradox compare to a K701 in terms of neutrality, detail retrieval and soundstage? These were points where the K701 really impressed me. Listening to a Haydn string quartet I could hear every oh so subtle intake of breath etc. - far more so than on the HD650

 

[paul02]

Sennheiser HD600 (velour pads removed)
 
BOOM! close to neutral sound
 

 

[papamogl]

What other pads would you recommend? I've tested a HD650 today but liked the K701 better. To my ears it's soundstage was more open and I could hear more details than on the HD600

 

[kramer5150]

Quote:

Ouch, that listening session didn't go well.  No Sony SA3000 there - pitty. No HD600 too, so the HD650 had to step in. I still prefer the sound signature of the AKG K701, but boy is it ugly (doesn't bother me too much), and boy is it uncomfortable! Not only the headband, but the earpads too were somehow squeezing (I know, my had is oddly shaped

).
So I went out of the shop empty handed and back to square one. I'm now very interested in the LFF Paradox, but it's risky to order without hearing them first (which I can't in switzerland). How would a Maddog compare to a K701 in terms of neutrality, detail retrieval and soundstage? These were points where the K701 really impressed me. Listening to a Haydn string quartet I could hear every oh so subtle intake of breath etc. - far more so than on the HD650

I posted some commentary on this in my post above.
-Maddog is more colored less neutral, slightly boosted in the lower midrange tones from ~350-900Hz.
-Both are very dynamic, fast and detail revealing cans.  In terms of driver transient response I give the Ortho-dog the edge.  Those drivers COMPLETELY stop resonating once the notes and tones stop.  The slight added brightness of the K701 however makes it sound "faster" and therefore more revealing.
-Soundstage is farther reaching on the K701.  They both are very layered, in their presentation but the 701 can put sounds farther away off in the distant.  The mad dog, despite having the best soundstage image of the closed cans in its price range... I think still  has that classic/distinctive closed can sound-stage.

 

[papamogl]

Sorry, I meant the Paradox, not the Maddogs. But thanks for your description. According to this I think the AKG K701 was the way to go for me if it was between it and the Maddogs. But from what I've read the Paradox is still more neutral than the Maddogs, so it might be a contender because of the K701s uncomfortable fit.

 

[kramer5150]

Quote:

Ouch, that listening session didn't go well.  No Sony SA3000 there - pitty. No HD600 too, so the HD650 had to step in. I still prefer the sound signature of the AKG K701, but boy is it ugly (doesn't bother me too much), and boy is it uncomfortable! Not only the headband, but the earpads too were somehow squeezing (I know, my had is oddly shaped

).
So I went out of the shop empty handed and back to square one. I'm now very interested in the LFF Paradox, but it's risky to order without hearing them first (which I can't in switzerland). How would a Maddog compare to a K701 in terms of neutrality, detail retrieval and soundstage? These were points where the K701 really impressed me. Listening to a Haydn string quartet I could hear every oh so subtle intake of breath etc. - far more so than on the HD650

Solo wind instrumentation (woodwinds and brass) I give the edge to the Ortho-dogs.  That lower midrange warmth really give a NICE presentation of acoustic resonance.... you know that sound a clarinet player gets when the take a deep breath and belt out the note so it sustains from their chest / deep in their gut?... thats the sound of the mad dogs... and they have that aspect of the K701 beat outright.  They can back off too, and play lighter, more airy, "fluffy" notes with elegant, grace and ease too.
 
My niece is a clarinet player so I know what that instrument is supposed to sound like, when its played live infront of you... the HD650 (and my HD580) is definitely NOT it IMHO of course.
 
I was talking to Dan at a recent meet, and he's a classical flute player.  So he tunes those RP50s with an ear towards the live instrument played in person.  He spent some time with me sifting through his music library on his demo table, specifically picking out tracks and artists with well recorded flute.  It was a very educational discussion, but I came away with a strong liking for his Ortho creations.  On a more subjective note, this to me is how a headphone should be designed (using the live instrument played in person as the sonic reference).  Its probably why I prefer the RS1 (and the wood grados in general) so much as a guitar player.  I am a huge Ian Anderson / Martin Barr (Jethro Tull) fan.  I could see myself picking up a maddog just for how well it presents solo flute.  Now if I could combine that with the RS1 into one headphone that would be Tull-heaven.

 

[lostmage]

Quote:

For OP - the AKGs are an easy suggestion. A very enjoyable and balanced headphone, good imaging and fairly balanced/neutral sounding.

If the k701s are a bit too crisp or harsh at all, the q701 is supposedly better in that regard. I've only used the q701 here, but I can say that I think I cured myself of the upgrade bug with q701s and a E9/E10 combo.

 

[papamogl]

Wow, kramer5150 that sure sounds tempting. The q701 is not an option for me right now. It has the same uncomfortable design that refrains me from buying the K701, plus it costs more than 100$ more - not willing to spend that on just a slight bass upgrade. In this pricecategory I'd go for Paradox or a Maddog. If only I could try one before buying

 

[kramer5150]

Yeah... thats my honest opinion.  On a final note I comment on the maddogs as though they are a one-trick pony / situational can.  I don't think thats a fair assessment at all.  They are GOOD all-rounders too.  I didn't hear anything that sounded off or offensive in any way when I was demo-ing them.   If it were me, I'd pair them up with a good, transparent, neutral sounding solid state amp... something that spaces the sounds out and energizes the ends of the 20-20k spectrum a bit.  Something maybe that uses the OPA2227, OPA627... or even an 18V JRC4556.  Of course bassier, warmer sounding OP amps would be a great pairing as well.
 
I 'd love to hear the mad dogs on discrete Dynaloo / head amp GS-1 
 
Yeah I have a huge head too, clamp pressure is a problem with my 701.

 

[Oxide36]

I just picked up a pair of Audio Technica AD900X's and it sounds like they may be what you are looking for.  The soundstage is great, bigger and better than the Q701s.  The mids and highs are also more forward and more detailed and very enjoyable.  The Q701s do win out in the bass department, but unless you're doing a side by side comparison you may not even notice.  Brand new they only cost $180 from Amazon.jp shipped via Tenso.com.

 

[pataburd]

Quote:

... you're recommending a $1300 model for someone on a ~$400 budget?

Yes.  Why not?  The HE-6 can be found used for about $800.  So wait a while longer and save the extra money.
As far as the K701 go: "been there, done that".  The nasty upper midrange smear was their downfall to my ears.

 

[kramer5150]

Quote:

Yes.  Why not?  The HE-6 can be found used for about $800.  So wait a while longer and save the extra money.
As far as the K701 go: "been there, done that".  The nasty upper midrange smear was their downfall to my ears.

Because the OP clearly states a price limitation of $400-450.  You are mis-leading him and potentially others who read your recommendation, as now they will be google searching for a retailer who sells it for that price.  Eventually folks may post a thread... " Who sells the HE-6 for such and such price?".
 
Its not against HF rules to post mis-leading information.  But it does mis-lead readers in this way... it results in a lot of head-fi "noise" and readers are left to try and separate fact from fiction.