The Watercooler -- Impressions, philosophical discussion and general banter. Index on first page. All welcome.
Dec 27, 2022 at 8:18 AM Post #44,386 of 91,365
Interesting. I have not heard any current stuff from Kenny G, but Songbird was one of the greatest jazz hits. Can’t say I like much else, so maybe he has a point.
Slippery slope to start judging what is good enough to be considered great music. So much preference and other factors involved. For someone like Pat Metheny who has spent his life making music that explores his vision and feelings through his music, to him the approach of Kenny G likely seems too trivial and without enough substance. I love Pat’s music personally and it has brought me much joy and inspiration, I cannot say the same for Kenny G, so I guess I agree with his main point. He was, I think trying to explain that Jazz is for everyone you just need to find the type that resonates for you, and other genres are similar.

I do wish he could have done that without discounting someone else’s career, though I understand why he wanted to use an example of what is to him clearly differentiated from the Jazz he appreciates.
 
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Dec 27, 2022 at 8:35 AM Post #44,387 of 91,365
Quite a number of people have PMed me about buying cables from less established cable brands. My advice is just avoid totally unless they can show proof that their wires are from leading cable suppliers such as Neotech & Cardas. I hope no audiophiles will get ripped off by these less established cable brands. 🙏🙏🙏
 
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Dec 27, 2022 at 9:28 AM Post #44,388 of 91,365
Slippery slope to start judging what is good enough to be considered great music. So much preference and other factors involved. For someone like Pat Metheny who has spent his life making music that explores his vision and feelings through his music, to him the approach of Kenny G likely seems too trivial and without enough substance. I love Pat’s music personally and it has brought me much joy and inspiration, I cannot say the same for Kenny G, so I guess I agree with his main point. He was, I think trying to explain that Jazz is for everyone you just need to find the type that resonates for you, and other genres are similar.

I do wish he could have done that without discounting someone else’s career, though I understand why he wanted to use an example of what is to him a clearly differentiated from the Jazz he appreciates.
Totally agree with you. There's plenty of people who shrug their shoulders at Pat's work too. Pretty sure that's the same for each and every artist. Would be sad if they all started making videos about why the other artist is worse. Keep your inspiration and energy and do something positive with it instead. Even though I personally agree with his taste the only one he disqualifies with this video is himself.

drftr
 
Dec 27, 2022 at 9:40 AM Post #44,389 of 91,365
I have found that drjuggles makes damn good performing. cables for the price. Also Plus sound and PWA.
Satin cables is a good performing vendor, especially for lower priced - $500 ones.
 
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Dec 27, 2022 at 10:16 AM Post #44,390 of 91,365
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Dec 27, 2022 at 10:44 AM Post #44,391 of 91,365
Dec 27, 2022 at 10:49 AM Post #44,392 of 91,365
I have found that drjuggles makes damn good performing. cables for the price. Also Plus sound and PWA.
Satin cables is a good performing vendor, especially for lower priced - $500 ones.
I have not tried drjuggles cables yet but I concur on your other points.

Basically, for less established cable brands, avoid their higher priced cables unless they can show proof that their wires are from leading suppliers such as Neotech, Cardas, etc.
 
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Dec 27, 2022 at 10:57 AM Post #44,393 of 91,365
Here is a list of established cable brands that audiophiles can buy from with confidence:
Plussound Audio
Toxic Cables
PW Audio
Effect Audio
Eletech
Null Audio
Han Sound Audio
OC Studio
Oyaide
Pentaconn
Brise Audio
Wagnus
Cross Lambda
Satin Audio
Labkable
Beat Audio

In the cable space, it is hard for a less established brand to breakthrough as capital is needed to acquire custom wires from the leading cable suppliers.
 
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Dec 27, 2022 at 11:05 AM Post #44,394 of 91,365
How's life treating you currently? Are you able to therapy your way around these festive days somehow? Wishing you and all in similar situations strength for the new year to come. The only way is up!

drftr
Hi, everything is going well, tired but everything will be fine
 
Dec 27, 2022 at 11:24 AM Post #44,395 of 91,365
To those who owns/heard both the UM Red Halo and the Mentor, how does these compare?
The Mentor and Red Halo FE share pretty much the same backbone but are handled differently in the bass.

Both earphones are the supreme rulers of midrange frequency in today's market, and in my personal view it's quite ahead of the competition in midrange frequency dynamics, timbre, resolution and low-level detail retrieval of nuance.

Where they are different is the bass to low mids transition. The easiest way to put it is the Mentor is the American sound to the more Eastern sound of the Red Halo.

I parted with my Red Halo after Canjam SoCal when I realized Mentor is all I could hope for in a do-it-all iem. I was also considering a Trailli + cash for it at some point as I do prefer the Trailli ease-of-listening despite its lesser fidelity - it just sounds more realistic than RH.

In a sense, Mentor is exactly the hybrid of Red Halo FE & Trailli, but perhaps more so tilted to the Trailli ever slightly.

Red Halo is Mid forward with a slight midbass hump, but the upper mids are too forward and it lacks a bit of air.

Mentor Multivverse is mid-forward too, with a significant bass hump and the upper mids are slightly south of Harman, and treble is a bit boosted.

Mentor Multiverse:
Sub-bass, slightly boosted (9/10)
Midbass, notably boosted (9.5/10)
Low mids, perfect and organic (10/10)
Midrange, perfect with phenomenal transient attack (10/10)
Upper midrange/ presence, dancing on the edge of both relaxed yet somewhat forward, great dynamics (9/10)
Mid treble, crystaline clear with sharp attack but never shrieky, hashy or grainy (10/10)
Upper treble, slightly relaxed sense of air, brings mids into focus and images front and depth forward more so than enveloping you in space (9.5/10)

Red Halo Fe:
Sub-bass, severely lacking presence (7/10)
Midbass, slight;y above neutral (9/10)
Low mids, perfect and organic (10/10)
Midrange, perfect with phenomenal transient attack (10/10)
Upper midrange/ presence, quite forward and extremely detailed/transparent, great dynamics. Impressive but also can be tiring (9/10)
Mid treble, crystaline clear with sharp attack but never shrieky, hashy or grainy (10/10)
Upper treble, slightly relaxed sense of air, brings mids into focus and images front and depth forward more so than enveloping you in space. Perhaps a bit wider sounding than Mentor, simply due to the lower amount of bass off-setting perception here (9.5/10)

Trailli:
Sub-bass, slightly boosted, 1-2 dB more elevated than Mentor (9/10)
Midbass, wonderfully done and above neutral but in a satisfying way (9.5/10)
Low mids, near-perfect and organic, even syrupy sometimes (9.5/10)
Midrange, one of the bests our there, and my favorite if favoring a bit of lushness/ sweetness to its timbre (10/10)
Upper midrange/ presence, quite relaxed which is tonally pleasant and inoffensive. However, hurts electrics guitars and engagement factor/ dynamics (8.5/10)
Mid treble, crystaline clear with nice tone, never shrieky, hashy or grainy. Lacks a bit of attack (9/10)
Upper treble, slightly relaxed sense of air, brings mids into focus and images front and depth forward more so than enveloping you in space staging & imaging is fantastically done (9.5/10)

I would easily take both MM & Trailli over the RH, but I can see the appeal of the latter for the traditional audiophile.

RH gets 64.5; MM gets 67; Trailli gets 65 out of 70 (whatever this metric means lol)
 
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Dec 27, 2022 at 11:38 AM Post #44,396 of 91,365
Here is a list of established cable brands that audiophiles can buy from with confidence:
Plussound Audio
Toxic Cables
PW Audio
Effect Audio
Eletech
Null Audio
Han Sound Audio
OC Studio
Oyaide
Pentaconn
Brise Audio
Wagnus
Cross Lambda
Satin Audio
Labkable
Beat Audio

In the cable space, it is hard for a less established brand to breakthrough as capital is needed to acquire custom wires from the leading cable suppliers.
Just thought I'd mention that Labkable before marketed some of their cables as gold-silver alloy, and was discovered that only the ear hook part of the wire contained gold. Rest of the wire was copper or something else. Also there were lots of accusations about them deliberately misleading customers in their marketing back in the days. I'd stay away from them.
 
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Dec 27, 2022 at 11:41 AM Post #44,397 of 91,365
Cross-posting from the Trifecta thread -- I suppose this is truly my last purchase for 2022!



Finally compiling all my notes now that my Trifecta has seen 150+ hours of burn-in. As you guys know, I am absolutely loving these IEMs but I want to document my thoughts as much as I could considering how divided people are about these IEMs... Of course, I am not a professional reviewer, so I am just going to try my best to describe my experience and hopefully it helps someone interested in the Trifecta.

Highlights of the IEM:
  • + Widest soundstage. Has to be the widest and most dynamic soundstage I've ever heard in an IEM. Beats out the Mentor (from my demo-ing) and the Traillii + Chiron by an edge.
  • + Absolutely beautiful high-quality bass. Extraordinary fun with that timbre and reverb from the music.
  • = Mids do take a step back in the spectrum, depending on your preference, this drawback might not be to your taste even though the Trifecta captures the breathiness of the vocals very well still
  • = Resolution and details also take a step back for musicality factors. Not that Trifecta is weak at trebles or can't deal with speed, it absolutely can, but if you want to have an IEM that allows you to hear the TOTL level of every subtlest pluck of strings or breath before singing, Trifecta is likely not the GOAT for you.
Burning in for Trifecta?

Disclaimer: I personally thought the Trifecta was fun listening fresh out of the box, fatigue aside -- but YMMV may vary if you are extremely picky.
I did think I am only finding Trifecta at its fullest potential now. Possibly I might be wrong after 200 - 300 hours! But who wants to seal away this addictive IEM for almost two weeks just for burning in? 😂

For the sake of discussion, I have been listening to the Trifecta only in the morning for a few hours. For the rest of the day (or as much as possible), I listen to one of the other IEMs I own. I do try to give each of them a rotation during this period, so I'd be able to appreciate all of their strengths and weaknesses in comparison. The Cyberblade (being the least technically capable and also TWS) is what I consider to be my evening reboot, so I can appreciate the strengths of these TOTL IEMs.

I used my AK ACRO1000 to drive the Trifecta. While I do think that AK2000T drove it, the bass does feel a bit flatter from the lack of extra juice. Since Trifecta's best quality is that bass and timbre, I opt to give it a bit more juice via the ACRO1000. Having said that, I did find that there is hissing present with this setup.

Fresh Out of the Box (0 hours): Fun! Timbre was already present. The sparkle was very present and the sound profile is very, VERY U-shaped. Will admit that the mids sounded veil and recessed at this point. If I was to really point fingers here, I'd say that the Trifecta isn't being very cohesive here and that if I was to nitpick, that'd be the key weakness for a TOTL price.

15 hours: Mids are starting to loosen up and come a bit more forefront, the trebles continue to be really bright. The soundstage really wowed me here and the timbre is REALLY rumbly. Found myself getting fatigued from listening due to the trebles at around 2 hours mark -- which is surprising because I've never had that issue before and I actually think of myself as a treble fiend. Time is changing...

30 - 50 hours: The biggest difference within this time is that the IEM is starting to adopt less of a U-shaped sound profile and becoming warmer now. Cohesiveness has a massive improvement at this point and the sound profile is really coming together. Now that it is settling into its sound signature, the mids have improved in its resolution but you can feel that the timbre isn't really quite reaching through yet...

100 - 150 hours: Starting to not hear much of an improvement in comparison to the earlier stages of burning in, 100 hours and 150 hours sounded pretty similar to me. The only big difference is that you can feel that the timbre is coming through across all spectrums now and sounds more natural and less forced to my ears. Very, very coherent now when compared to my memories and notes when listened to it fresh.

The general gist I got from this is that I definitely recommend giving Trifecta at least 30 hours of burn-in. It seems more is better, but I definitely see a diminishing return to it after a while.

Conclusion
First thing. WHAT A GOAT. Despite the divisiveness, I genuinely don't think Trifecta is bad at anything. To my ears, Trifecta does everything well, but we all know how that can go. YMMV and all that. Overall, the Trifecta is a warm-leaning IEM that has enough sparkle to bring clarity and resolution while using the timbre -- easily the IEM's best attribute -- to control how it presents the soundstage and layers of music. And boy, does it deliver. To me, this is the replication of an orchestra playing in a concert hall. Is it the most resolute and detail-oriented? No, but it will definitely make sure you feel the music. Its bass is absolutely top-class -- powerful and superbly controlled -- and I think every basshead and DD lover will enjoy this IEM. I don't think of myself as a basshead and I am absolutely in love with it.

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In other news we're on page 2960-- 40 pages in 4 days...we can do this team!
 
Dec 27, 2022 at 11:54 AM Post #44,398 of 91,365
Here is a list of established cable brands that audiophiles can buy from with confidence:
Plussound Audio
Toxic Cables
PW Audio
Effect Audio
Eletech
Null Audio
Han Sound Audio
OC Studio
Oyaide
Pentaconn
Brise Audio
Wagnus
Cross Lambda
Satin Audio
Labkable
Beat Audio

In the cable space, it is hard for a less established brand to breakthrough as capital is needed to acquire custom wires from the leading cable suppliers.
Plenty agreed. 👍

Oc Studio= very good yes. Sound and construction wise. The Frozen is a great cable.
Penon audio = the same and very competitives prices. Osg and Totem.
PlusSound = real luxury and quality.
Fiio (mmcx) = really good, in a budget, but... Really good (the same). LC-RE Pro and LC-RE Pro 2022, excellent.
 
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Dec 27, 2022 at 12:13 PM Post #44,399 of 91,365
Just thought I'd mention that Labkable before marketed some of their cables as gold-silver alloy, and was discovered that only the ear hook part of the wire contained gold. Rest of the wire was copper or something else. Also there were lots of accusations about them deliberately misleading customers in their marketing back in the days. I'd stay away from them.
Nice to point that out. I only know that they are using cables from legit suppliers.
 

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