The Watercooler -- Impressions, philosophical discussion and general banter. Index on first page. All welcome.
Apr 13, 2024 at 10:31 AM Post #86,491 of 89,875
Trifecta would be too boomy/imprecise in the bass for me
To my ears, quite the opposite, Trifecta has very precisely textured bass. It may be full and wide but all the details are there...
It doesn't. 6 dB on DD is the same as 6 dB on BA. Still, your brain will take into account how slow the driver is. Like, if you hit a 50 Hz note on DD it will decay longer than when you hit the same note on BA. The result is that if you have multiple notes the blanks in between are filled in more when using DD, and because of that slowliness / incorrectness (pleasantness for yours truly) your brain may interpret that as more bass. The peaks are still 6 dB only though.

drftr
Let's remember, however, that no driver is actually "adding" information to the source, it's either doing a more complete or a less complete job of allowing the information on the source to come through to your ears. This is something that I think about a lot when I read the majority of impressions about the sound of a cable or an IEM. They can't actually "add" anything. They do not produce sound, they pass it along. So they can suppress areas of the FR to a greater or lesser extent. This is how they tune, by taking away, not by adding. So if there is decay and sustain on a recording, to my ears, a DD driver does a better job of capturing it and relaying it to your ears - not of creating it - whereas a BA driver does not - it seems to finish its business and move on before capturing the entirety of the musical event as it appears at the source.
First time I see this about Ronin and interesting because of its BA drivers. Can you describe why it comes across muddy for you?

drftr
Ronin bass is incredibly fast but very full at the same time. I think the fullness can make one assume its not detailed. Plus ut is very impactful so that can mask the texture. It's also one of the few BA bass implementations that comes close to responding like a DD per my description above.
 
Last edited:
Apr 13, 2024 at 10:38 AM Post #86,493 of 89,875
For the retro geeks among you, did you know you can actually create your own 78 rpm records at home?

This article comes with a YT vid explaining the whole process:

http://normanfield.com/index.php/homemade78rpm/

drftr
Why?

Why would I ever want 78’s? 🤭

I’m laughing, but seriously, why make 78’s! The top tables don’t even play at that speed and the disk will hold like one or two tracks.
 
Apr 13, 2024 at 10:45 AM Post #86,494 of 89,875
I own the HE1000 SE, not the Stealth version. The SE is pretty balanced, reference tuned, but with a noticeable treble presence and slightly thinner lower mids. The IEM equivalent that comes to mind is the Ragnar, but since the OP claims to be treble sensitive that option would be ruled out. The other suggestions made such as Jewel would likely be a better match.

The Ronin is a large IEM. I did not have issues with the fit personally, but I know others have. I am not sure I would recommend it as a HEKSE alternative, as the bass is quite loose, somewhat muddy to my ears, and the overall tuning quite flat. I do think of adding it back to the collection occasionally, but as a vocals specialist. It is one of the best looking IEMs out there.

Xe6 for me. Why do you ask? Didn't you own both at some point?


Agreed with both. I own the Jewel and had a brief listen to the Camelot. I was quite impressed, despite the short listen. I think the bass is better than the Jewel's. I may add it to the collection some day.

I listen to a lot of metal. For my preferences, none of the monitors mentioned here are great for metal. FW is quite energetic up top, and metal exposes the peaks like no other music genre (but I think I could get used to this one). The others mentioned have too much bass for metal imo. But it depends what type of metal you listen to. I think they would be fine for melodic metal such as Nightwish, but for faster subgenres like death and black metal I prefer the leaner, tighter bass of more reference tuned IEMs, such as Traillii, Jewel, Camelot, Kublai Khan, or those with present but slightly less boomy bass, e.g. Nio, Volür, Legend X, Bonneville, Annihilator. Fourte, Z1R and Ragnar are options too if you are not treble sensitive.

The tip is to try various tips :). None of the Oriolus IEMs fit me very well, but I do manage to find a good fit by experimenting with different tips.
Thank you for your take, I'm definitely going the Raven route - unless the Novus turns out like an even better Raven, which given the fact it doesn't feature the same drivers seems unlikely. Do you think the SE300 would compliment it well or is too 'soft' for metal and I should rather take a delta / sigma DAC like a 320MaxTI or something of the sort?
 
Last edited:
Apr 13, 2024 at 10:52 AM Post #86,495 of 89,875
Sorry for a late reply. But name or any information about that cable?

I'm not sure about the name as Mark never mentioned it, but it is Melodic Artification's 4W Silver Alloy Cable with 4.4mm jack, it's a dark grey cable and it is a separate cable that can be bought, not an upgrade option.
Here's a a pic of that cable that my friend @Loafy took:

Alter Ego with Silver Alloy Cable.jpg


while this is the stock cable, i believe it's either a SPC or Copper cable with 4.4mm jack:

Alter Ego Stock.jpg
 
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:00 AM Post #86,496 of 89,875
Let's remember, however, that no driver is actually "adding" information to the source, it's either doing a more complete or a less complete job of allowing the information on the source to come through to your ears. This is something that I think about a lot when I read the majority of impressions about the sound of a cable or an IEM. They can't actually "add" anything. They do not produce sound, they pass it along. So they can suppress areas of the FR to a greater or lesser extent. This is how they tune, by taking away, not by adding. So if there is decay and sustain on a recording, to my ears, a DD driver does a better job of capturing it and relaying it to your ears - not of creating it - whereas a BA driver does not - it seems to finish its business and move on before capturing the entirety of the musical event as it appears at the source.
I don't think that is necessarily true. If you have one very fast (electronic?) bass pulse then by design a dynamic driver after the impulse can't return to its original state as fast as some other drivers. You can't say that what you hear as decay or ebbing away of that very fast peak is in the recording per se. It's just its inability to be super fast.

Of course I agree that if the decay of that tone is in the recording it can sound more natural through that dynamic driver, but it's not a given.

drftr
 
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:03 AM Post #86,497 of 89,875
I'm not sure about the name as Mark never mentioned it, but it is Melodic Artification's 4W Silver Alloy Cable with 4.4mm jack, it's a dark grey cable and it is a separate cable that can be bought, not an upgrade option.
Here's a a pic of that cable that my friend @Loafy took:

Alter Ego with Silver Alloy Cable.jpg

while this is the stock cable, i believe it's either a SPC or Copper cable with 4.4mm jack:

Alter Ego Stock.jpg
The silver alloy cable looks very similar to the Liquid Links cable that came with the Eclipse. Wonder if LL is making these cables as well?
 
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:22 AM Post #86,498 of 89,875
The silver alloy cable looks very similar to the Liquid Links cable that came with the Eclipse. Wonder if LL is making these cables as well?

Now that you mention it... That might just be it! Tho i'm not sure what the spec of the Eclipse cable was
No wonder i had feeling that i've seen that kind of wire somewhere.. Let me look into it!
 
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:22 AM Post #86,499 of 89,875
Thank you for your take, I'm definitely going the Raven route - unless the Novus turns out like an even better Raven

I preferred Novus to the iteration of Raven I heard in NYC. Novus is also like $2k more expensive, so there's that.
 
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:31 AM Post #86,500 of 89,875
Everything has smoother, less bright highs than Ragnar. :p
What do you think about Raven? I saw your fun one-liner about it many pages back, "Animals as leaders" lol. But from the perspective I'm looking for, that HE1000 sound, how does it stack up?
 
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:32 AM Post #86,501 of 89,875
I don't think that is necessarily true. If you have one very fast (electronic?) bass pulse then by design a dynamic driver after the impulse can't return to its original state as fast as some other drivers. You can't say that what you hear as decay or ebbing away of that very fast peak is in the recording per se. It's just its inability to be super fast.

Of course I agree that if the decay of that tone is in the recording it can sound more natural through that dynamic driver, but it's not a given.

drftr
I guess I just don't believe a modern DD's response time is slower than any electronic pulse note you can throw at it. I am of the camp that it's not that DDs are too slow but BAs are too fast. I listen to a lot of electronic music on my Trifecta and Monachaa and never feel they are slow. They just sound better :wink:
 
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:35 AM Post #86,502 of 89,875
Xe6 for me. Why do you ask? Didn't you own both at some point?
I’m just doing a quick survey due to the negativity the Xe6 gets on mainstream reviews lol Wanted to know how the real ones feel .. Personally, I also prefer Xe6 Due to its unique abilities that I can’t get anywhere else
 
Last edited:
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:37 AM Post #86,503 of 89,875
This is very much agreeable. for me, the upper mids lend to a more relaxed listen, but the bass boost also adds the excitement to a lot of tracks to make them enjoyable for me. It makes for a unique listening experience for certain genres. Not unique so much so that its offensive, just enough to add a different flavor to my collection.

I haven't heard Aroma products, so maybe i cant speak on the brand. Its a very popular brand in this forum. I don't really hear many negatives with it. If i mention KR5 or frontier series, bass-bloat will be a topic of discussion. This is not the same treatment. You understand, yes? I'm saying i haven't heard Aroma products, and I'm sure that with all the variables, KR5 and FW bass sound different, but is bass-bloat not a thing with Fei Wan? If i listen and i hear a similar bass, i would say "yes, bass-bloat is present". So maybe there's none, since no one mentions it. If people like the brand maybe they don't feel the bloat is a big enough issue with them to mention, or maybe there is none to speak of? Now I'm thinking i have to listen to FW!
KR5 is definitely under-appreciated. I've no complaints of KR5 paired with its stock cable. The kinetic bass DD and the tubeless BA implementation provides the entire frequency range in a very satisfactory way to me to enjoy my music. What FIR Audio has achieved with their frontier series is unique and phenomenal. The presentation of music in KR5 is quite unique and distinct from the other offerings in the market.

I've Fatfreq Maestro MSE and I don't find the bass of FR5 lacking in any way or overpowering in any way. The impressions on RN6 & Xe6 indicate more bass than KR5 and that is quite something.
 
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:40 AM Post #86,504 of 89,875
I was able to test the Xe6 a total of one time at Fir Audio and two at home over several days in peace and quiet and at the beginning I just couldn't understand it. It was too... weird. But each time after returning it, a thought remained in my head that was always directed towards the Xe6. Moral of the story: as much as I ended up liking it, I bought it and am now considering buying it as a custom. That would be my first custom ever. Such a full, warm, colored and at the same time technical sound is just addictive.
I see you have your Xe6 for sale. If that is because you are considering getting a custom, you can also trade in your universal with FiR audio, by way of ‘upgrading’ to a CIEM.
Thank you for your take, I'm definitely going the Raven route - unless the Novus turns out like an even better Raven, which given the fact it doesn't feature the same drivers seems unlikely. Do you think the SE300 would compliment it well or is too 'soft' for metal and I should rather take a delta / sigma DAC like a 320MaxTI or something of the sort?
Ah, if you have already decided on the Raven I won’t rain on the parade any further… it was not my cup of tea for metal but I hope you will love it :). I have not heard the SE300 so I cannot comment on that.
I’m just doing a quick survey due to the negativity the Xe6 gets on mainstream reviews lol Wanted to know how the real ones feel
I don’t read mainstream reviews anymore :). The Xe6 is a bit of an ‘acquired taste’, similar to Trifecta in a way. For many of us anyway. Both monitors have their critics but lots of supporters around here too. I own both and do not plan to part with either.
 
Last edited:
Apr 13, 2024 at 11:40 AM Post #86,505 of 89,875
A quick photoshoot of IEMs accompanying me on my travels.

IMG_0203.jpeg


IMG_0210.jpeg
 

Attachments

  • IMG_0214.jpeg
    IMG_0214.jpeg
    1.9 MB · Views: 0
  • IMG_0211.jpeg
    IMG_0211.jpeg
    1.8 MB · Views: 0
  • IMG_0218.jpeg
    IMG_0218.jpeg
    1.6 MB · Views: 0
  • IMG_0212.jpeg
    IMG_0212.jpeg
    2.1 MB · Views: 0
  • IMG_0215.jpeg
    IMG_0215.jpeg
    2 MB · Views: 0
  • IMG_0204.jpeg
    IMG_0204.jpeg
    2 MB · Views: 0
  • IMG_0209.jpeg
    IMG_0209.jpeg
    2.1 MB · Views: 0
  • IMG_0213.jpeg
    IMG_0213.jpeg
    2.5 MB · Views: 0

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top