The Watercooler -- Impressions, philosophical discussion and general banter. Index on first page. All welcome.
Nov 10, 2022 at 11:01 PM Post #39,706 of 87,770
https://www.txnaudio.com/en/txn-dest

First time I've come across them too, looks great!
The best way to contact them is via Facebook messenger, their English is no good.
My DesTi is 4 ba + 2 est, specially tuned for me.
I chose Titanium shells, wooden faceplates and even the cable of the internal wiring (Nordost Odin 2)
I'm confused as their website mentions "1 Dynamic driver, 2 Balanced Armatures per side". And also that they're a whopping 55 Ohm so you may need to work on the amping part a bit.

Guys may you please advise what is considered now to be a top copper cable with tight mids and bass?
I’ve finally came to a conclusion that Kublai Khan sounds the most engaging way using 1960 Traillii cable and N8ii in class A amplification, but maybe there are better cables currently with more precise controlled and not relaxed mid and low regions?
I feel the 1950s are quite a bit richer in the mids and easier on the ear in the treble region than the 1960s 4-wire but the bass is a bit less tight. If you can find a used First Times (there was one for an incredible $1,250 or so a few days ago if I'm not mistaken) then you'd have the best of the 1960s 4-wire and 1950s combined, with better dynamics, staging, and imaging as a bonus.

drftr
 
Nov 10, 2022 at 11:18 PM Post #39,707 of 87,770
Bought a new car today…

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Are vehicles still expensive right now? I am so used to buy cars at $ below invoice, and the recent supply chain disruption has created a new trend to pay $ above MSRP.
 
Nov 10, 2022 at 11:50 PM Post #39,710 of 87,770
Did anyone try an IEM from Livezone?
It's an italian 🇮🇹 brand building IEMs since 2006.
https://www.livezoner41.com/
Music Sanctuary used to have their demos way back in the day. They never really took off in Singapore, and their founder, Oliver Marino, is now the main IEM designer/tuner over at VE. He's responsible for everything from the VE8 onwards. So, I don't think Livezone will have any new products anytime soon.
 
Nov 11, 2022 at 12:40 AM Post #39,712 of 87,770
I do unfortunately.

In other news, this is the most emotionally engaging set for me. I love the note weight and tuning coupled with top tier technicals. This set has brought me on the verge/to tears more times than I’ve ever experienced in this hobby combined over the years. I might have to be careful where I use these 🥲😂


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What set is that?
 
Nov 11, 2022 at 12:57 AM Post #39,713 of 87,770
A few people pinged me asking if I'm taking a break from reviewing. Unfortunately, had a few rough months at work and at home. Hopefully, moving forward I can get back to more consistent reviewing and Watercooler participation. And, as the first step forward, here is my CFA Supermoon review I just finished. Enjoy the read!

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Nov 11, 2022 at 1:39 AM Post #39,715 of 87,770
N8ii vs M2.....

Sat having my morning coffee with M2 on day two and thought I'd post some thoughts....

Quite a difference between these two and I 100% expected N8ii to still hold the crown for me. Had it since launch and nothings come close to knocking it off its perch until now. For reference, that includes M9, 300 MAX, LP6 Gold and the highly revered LP6Ti 7Th AE. How wrong I was...

Physically M2 is far more pocket friendly. Smooth rounded edges, not nearly as fat as N8ii and a lot cooler to touch. Both 4.4mm and 3.5mm ports are back to the usual on top position. As much as N8ii bottom port irked me when it came out, for listening whilst DAP is laid down, the bottom port is actually quite nice on N8ii, now I appreciate it!

Finish is superb and gold looks the mutts nuts although it'll be covered by a case tomorrow. Side buttons are excellent. When using them they feel precise, no wobble, both vol+ and play/pause have a raised nipple so you can find them easily without looking. I also particularly like the physical lock button on the other side, makes it easy to unlock the side buttons when it's in your pocket.

One thing that surprised me is weight. M2 is a heavy brick for its size, feels heavier than N8ii in hand, I'll need to go check the specs to confirm.

Despite not having the latest and greatest SOC, I've found zero issues with UI. I've disabled a few apps / services I don't require and it's been silky smooth. Maybe not quite as sharp as N8ii but no complaints. Having come from N8 / LP6, it's still a gift of a UI. Screen is nice, touch sensitivity great, all menus are easy to get through, typical android. Sonys music app also gets a big thumbs up, really easy to navigate and can even sort music based on res! Want some DSD on, no problem, here's all the DSD in your library. Cool stuff. It was also lightnig quick importing 12k+ songs.

Sound....

The things that stand out straight away...

N8ii has better stage separation, not particularly width but it seems to create more space between everything. Haven't paid much attention to depth and height between them yet but I don't feel M2 is lacking at all.

N8ii has better layering to my which was notable on vocal harmony, it's got a little more separation (just like stage). Struggling to describe this one!

Bass is interesting. N8ii isn't lacking in this area at all but M2 has more body. When the kick drum hits, N8ii has a good "thwack", the higher FR part of the strike, M2 the same but its got more "thump" / body which makes it sound more natural and takes the emphasis off the "thwack". Maybe someone with a better ability than myself to put this into words could describe what's happening here better than I!

M2 has really nice body to bass up into mids, listening with Jewel, there's more meat on the bones than N8ii and this pushes right up to the toms. It's like the difference when adding BCD into the mix, with M2 you can feel more impact. Quite impressive and one of the things that's sold me on M2. Overall a little more rounded and more impact moving up to mids.

Mids are rich / lush, effortless. Maybe the star of the show here, especially with Jewel. Nothing I've heard will come close to Red Halo on N8ii but the balance of M2 / Jewel is fantastic IMO. Acoustic guitar has just about the right note weight, warm tilt vs N8ii is noticable but doesn't tilt too far for my preference. Its still clean but with a nice touch of...flavour. Electric guitar doesn't have the same rawness of N8ii but still has nice crunch and great weight, more bodied than N8ii. Probably what you'd expect from Sony house sound.

Treble is quite different. M2 is more polite / relaxed whilst still having the sparkle we all crave. When A/B'ing them, M2 doesn't walk the thin line like N8ii can. When I changed Orph out for First Times seeking more treble, FT can at times cross that line with a bit of glare up top, with M2 that edge is gone. Hi-hat, ride, splash etc all sound utterly natural, lovely decay, texture.

Overall I think it's bass and percussion that have sealed the deal for me with M2. There's a slight boost to bass / touch of roundness (typical Sony) but it's still clean, full, textured, not the usual Sony lower end emphasis, theyve reigned it it. Drums sound absolutely fantastic.

This is the 1st "warm" DAP that's clicked with me. Rather than just saying warm, I'd say its reference with a warm tilt. It's the 1st warm dap that keeps the FR balanced, doesn't muddy any part, and keeps a totally natural sounding treble. From top bottom, it's clean and absolutely effortless.

There's no playing about with power, class, tubes etc. It's just sounds good right off the bat. What's really impressive is right now all of my SACD ISO's are converting to DSD so I'm sat here listening to Tidal rather than RB, and as I said to damz in PM, it sounds that good I could easily ditch my library and convert to being a streamer. That'll never happen as no online streaming service has all the masters I like but if they did, then I'd be signing up. DSEE on, little change to the phase setting and now have the best streaming I've heard to date tbh.

So yeah, loving it and now deservedly holds top spot for me now. RS8 will hopefully be on the way soon and from initial impressions, it looks like it'll be a tough fight. One to look forward to!

Crap at pictures so here's a zero effort one just because...

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Nov 11, 2022 at 2:11 AM Post #39,717 of 87,770
Better and pinpoint imaging perhaps?

Wonderful write-up! Very interested to read your M2-RS8 shoot-out already!

drftr
Just pulled apart a bit more which adds to the texture. Specific album that really highlighted it was Alice In Chains Dirt. Lot of harmonising between Jerry and Layne, N8ii separated/ layered left / right / centre vocal better giving harmony that great texture it gets when it hits the sweet spot. I guess that's just one aspect of layering, to me anyway, but it stood out.

Imaging I've not really paid attention to yet. Take that as a good thing. Pink Floyd "Time" is my go to track for that, I'll stick it on later this morning and see how it fairs vs N8ii. Tbh, apart from from a small handful of obvious differences from N8ii that stand out, I've not been doing any critical listening, not felt the need as M2 overall just sounds really good to my ears, and a great pairing with Jewel / FT, easy listening with underlying technical prowess. Magic.
 
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Nov 11, 2022 at 3:15 AM Post #39,718 of 87,770
DAP apps / personalization. What do you guys use to personalize your android devices, eg, keyboard, browser etc etc. It's something i've never really played about with on Android so keen to hear what you guys use for tweaking them whether it's just aesthetic or actual application.
 
Nov 11, 2022 at 3:44 AM Post #39,720 of 87,770
So i finally got to try Odyssey and spend a good session with it. Thanks to my good buddy @Sayed2020 and Spiritland where the demo unit is.
This also meant that i could throw a fair comparison against freshly owned Anima.
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Sources i have used were Gryphon and SP3000(also a demo at Spiritland)

Odyssey is for sure the best thing EE (and A&K) have created. It brushes up most the of both Odin and EVO and also takes it to another level of technical performance.
I think tuning is going to bridge the gap between Odin and EVO fans. But i kind of liked them both equally for their own reason, and disliked for others.

While on their own both EVO and Odin were impressive products, I always felt they were not cutting it against the top dogs like Fir Xe6 or KR5, elysian X traillii etc. At least on a technical level.
Its not black and white of course. There are traits on EE products that cannot be matched by anything i.e. the legendary W9 bass exceptional comfort etc.
Obviously i could also name a lot more iems that are worse than them two at this price.
But anyway...
Odyssey is now full on in the big boys game for sure and does that without loosing EE DNA too - the legendary bass is still there. But you now also get the treble which is a significant improvement over EVO. And they now sound a lot more layered and spacious than anything EE so far.

Mind you, many tips did make Odyssey sound a touch too warm for my liking but with Epros (my fave for all EE iems) the treble opens up and and presentation becomes very spacious too. So tip rolling is a must. What i liked a lot about treble though, was how lower/mid treble was tuned. It gives enough bite but does not bit too hard.. string instruments like violins, cellos sounded very sweet and natural to me.

Mids are now going be a relief to those who swore at Odin or even EVO. A lot more natural but still quite spacious.
It does not sound lean but its also not a mush like on EXT for example.

Bass is more like EVO's in texture but in less quantity. So a bit fuller than Odins subbass focused presentation.

Tuning is really well done, and is the best EE and A&K tuning so far.

Staging size is noticeably bigger than Odin's now. And while its not as big as Elysian X or Anima fir instance. What it really does exceptionally well is that sharp accurate spatial placement of instruments. And how layered everything sounds. The depth is superb.
It sound so effortless. Resolution is top notch, great dynamics too.

I feel it still works better with more neutral source and as mentioned tip rolling is a must.

VS Anima...
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Ok it will be biased, i still think Anima is the best overall package i have heard.
There are some things that some iems do better but overall it ticks most of the boxes for me. For now...😜

Anima is a bit more focused on highlighting technical performance and more revealing tuning in comparison.
Bass is more subbass focused and gives more space for mids.
Upper mids are more forward, so overall a bit leaner.
The treble is more of a show off but its done so well not to become too sharp and the EST implementation is just amazing.
Odyssey's treble sounds more natural. Its neither lacking, not its trying to show itself off. Its a bit more lower treble focused it seems but i cannot pick up any peaks or dips.
I really like both treble tunings for different reasons.
Odyssey's bass is also a bit fuller and bigger. more midbass presence for sure
Mids are also noticably warmer but not congested at all.

Anima's staging is bigger than Odyssey's, everything has a bit more space between notes. In fact after some comparisons on different occasions i the only iems that have bigger staging than Anima were XE6 with red module, Elysian X by a small margin but imaging is better on Anima. and i could see Traillii being a touch wider but it would struggle at height and depth. Oh and Obravo C Cu Ra.
I really want to revisit GT600 because i remember it was very spacious sounding. And i also have not heard Jewel or the UM rip offs like Halo and La Jardin...

So even if Odyssey staging a bit less expanded it does not mean its congested. Where it really shines is imaging and layering.
Anima sound a bit more forward and energetic so while it stretches wider and taller. Odyssey with its more natural treble and mids has amazing Depth and is so nicely layered. Also the accuracy of imaging on it is so precise and well defined. I bet this is something to do with BCD.

Resolution is fantastic on both and i dont think there is much to add here. Any iem past 3k has brilliant resolution and it will just be a matter perception based on tuning i think. Anima for instance has more sparkle and you more defined tiny details. But the difference is not significant. And if you happen to be sensitive to that kind of treble it might be just the contrary and you could find it too compressed.
But again i dont think either of these iems have offensive treble. Surely not Odyssey.

Now here is the thing. All the above i had written up before seeing and comparing graph of Odyssey and comparing it against Animas one.
graph (13).png

So it seems like it should be quite warm and bassy. Possibly bassier than EVO in fact, due to mids pushed back. But it did not come off like this at all. I did find it too warm on some tips but EPros were keeping bass in check without gutting it.
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Sp3000 was excellent pairing with Odyssey due to being reference sounding. Gryphon worked better with Anima for instance.
But yeh, analysing difference between graphs and what i have written would probably make more sense if i did this:
graph (16).png

This is more how i hear the tonal differences between Anima and Odyssey. Odyssey has more Midbass, less forward upper mids, and tamer mid/upper treble.

So yeh, thats sound done.
Now the fit. The shells are big on both but the Odyssey has much smaller nozzle and it will definitely fit more people than Anima. If you dont have issues with EVO and Odin you should not have any with Odyssey either.
Anima luckily fits me well with most tips. And i have no issue commuting with it and moving around even given the size of the stock cable. However it is not small ear friendly. Blind buy is not recommended.

While Anima still my stays No1 iem at this point. Odyssey is definitely in top 3 with its natural mids and treble combined with meaty EE bass and top imaging and layering.
 
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