The Watercooler -- Impressions, philosophical discussion and general banter. Index on first page. All welcome.
Oct 1, 2022 at 7:47 PM Post #36,946 of 89,889
If I may answer, it's not about listening levels but about getting a consistent level in REW (measurement software) that allows the whole FR range to graph properly without clipping. Too low and the bass won't graph properly or you'll see ripples in the bass FR. Too high and the sound will clip. I like to keep my levels averaging around -18dBFS to -12dBFS for measurement. REW advises similarly. Once the FR graph is measured, you can then adjust the graph's level and align the SPL to whatever you want manually. I align mine to 1kHz at 60Hz (just because I like it there) but you don't really need to. Alex doesn't. Technically, if you're getting good levels as per the software with decent headroom and no clipping, it doesn't matter what SPL you graph at, the FR will be the same.

See the graph below. I adjusted the FR to match 1kHz at 60dB. Originally it was around 1kHz @ 95dB.

Hope I've explained it decently enough. :D

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Thank you. If I understood your summary, you simply adjusted the graph down manually. The IEM may not actually graph the same way if the measurements were actually taken at that db level, correct? Where I am going with this is: is it possible for the tested IEM to graph differently at different db levels? Thank you.
 
Oct 1, 2022 at 7:51 PM Post #36,947 of 89,889
Haha, very diverse. A large portion of it is different sub genres of electronic music, which takes up most of my listening. In any given listening session I can bounce from Dr Dre, Michael Jackson, Mariah Carey, video game soundtracks, Linkin Park, Breaking Benjamin, Seven Lions, Illenium, the Weeknd… it just depends what mood I’m in for. 🤷🏽‍♂️
I don’t have any jazz, classical, or orchestra stuff unless it’s from a video game.
Oh you reminded me of Breaking Benjamin! Haven't heard them in years! I used to cover their songs Diary of Jane and So Cold with one of my bands in college. Need to check what they've been upto. Thanks, I'm going to run through their whole discography now. :D
 
Oct 1, 2022 at 7:56 PM Post #36,948 of 89,889
Oh you reminded me of Breaking Benjamin! Haven't heard them in years! I used to cover their songs Diary of Jane and So Cold with one of my bands in college. Need to check what they've been upto. Thanks, I'm going to run through their whole discography now. :D

I still jam out to Diary of Jane, love it in the gym haha. It’s sort of become one of my go-to test tracks also.
 
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Oct 1, 2022 at 8:08 PM Post #36,949 of 89,889
Hi everyone,


Haven’t had as much time for the past few days to listen to music with iems at home after work, as work kept me mostly busy on the go and back to back with deliveries and orders this week (and most of my listening time was spent w/ Airpods pro 2nd gen and iPhone 14 pro max, for streaming music on Tidal on the go at work).

However, earlier this past Tuesday (9/27), I made some time to listen and get a feel for the sound and presentation of iBasso DX170 (paired with Campfire Audio Supermoon ciem w/ Plus Sound 8-wire spc cable in 4.4 balanced), and went through different tracks from classical and jazz to classic rock and vocals on Tidal. With about three hours of listening done, along with a bit of noticeable sheen picked up from listening to some classical and vocal tracks (on Tidal, w/ DX170 in high gain, 4.4 & Supermoon ciem), I’ll go in further details on more of my thoughts and impressions of the DX170 (and pairing with Supermoon ciem) in another post. But, what I can say in short is the DX170 is a well performing ‘all-rounder’ delivering above its price point with its compact pocketable size and lightweight ergonomic form factor, giving decent amount of rich textured and impactful low end, pleasantly detailed midrange while retaining and presenting enough clarity in detail (albeit slightly lean bodied, but with some added warmth in weight of note & feel in tone of sound) and subtly smooth & natural-like tonality of vocals and instruments (especially piano and percussion instruments), and subtly smoothened but well-defined treble (sounds adequately fine with most contemporary jazz songs and solo piano & flute tracks that go into higher registers).
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iBasso DX170 (in black trim, Tuesday, 9/27).


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Campfire Audio Supermoon ciem (audiophile-fit) w/ Plus Sound 8-wire spc cable in 4.4 & iBasso DX170 (in 4.4, high gain).


More notably though, imaging isn’t a particular strong standout, yet there is enough amount of space and air among and around placement of subjects, vocals and instruments, to get a sense and feel for where things are positioned and moving about in most tracks, and also faring more than decent in separation, control and speed in some of the more complex/busy passages of songs (involving multiple instruments or vocalists performing as a group/ensemble at moderate to fast tempo).

Soundstage is fairly spacious and reaches wider and further towards the sides than it extends low or high in lower/vertical reach. Presence of subjects, instruments and vocals remain discernibly present and hold together its surface detail & form fairly well most of the way through from panning and positioning left to right, towards center, low to high, and slightly off towards the back side, creating a slight spherical effect in stage.

My only criticism (but mostly minor), however, is the fairly low amount of headroom (when listened on high gain) with some distortion filling in from the edges giving a slight compressed kind of feel and congested sound when the volume is increased any further from mid-40 and up, as this is noticeable for most older recorded tracks that need to be played and listened to at higher than normal volume levels. On a more minor note, I’ve found starting up Tidal app (and Mango player) and its response time in starting and pausing playback of tracks on Tidal to lag a little with a slight delay. Although this isn’t something I’d be overly annoyed with (as I do plan to transfer and upsample more tracks from CDs through JRiver Media to the DX170, and do most of my music listening with offline upsampled CD tracks), it’s something that I find to be an inconvenience when going through and listening to new songs & albums on-the-go and having to deal with hardware/software slowdowns, and then end up going back to listening to the same playlist of upsampled CD tracks.

Aside from its minor downsides, I feel much of what the DX170 offers in solidly versatile performance and natural-like focused presentation of dynamic sound in a solid, compact & lightweight design (w/ a fairly responsive user interface) greatly outweighs its shortcomings, as well as its cost of upkeep & maintenance over time from its more inexpensive price point, as the DX170 offers a tasteful side of flagship-like sound reminiscent of the quality of sound (in musicality and performance) found in higher end iBasso daps (such as DX300 and its predecessor DX220) with a pleasant balance of subtly smooth musicality with impressive dynamics & engaging presentation (for its price point) and natural-like detailed sound.



Moving on forward to Thursday (9/29, National Coffee Day), while I got off a little earlier from work and headed my way back home, another thought occurred to me in how I could get the most out of my DX170 and A12t (my 2nd ciem is still in build progress) for work use. This was mainly due to finding out from 64 Audio just recently that the A12t is best suited to be used with a cable that has 0.75 2-pin connectors, and that 0.78 2-pin connectors would stretch and wear out the sockets and let in moisture and particles, which would later end up in having the sockets to be repaired and/or replaced on a more frequent basis. With this in mind, I just couldn’t settle for a third-party cable of a lesser quality & price point with 0.75 2-pin connectors and in 4.4 balanced.

As I made my usual stop by a coffee shop before going back home, I took my mind off audio gear for a moment, to relax and get a cup of coffee and pastry at a place in Pasadena I’ve been meaning to go and try. When I ordered ahead from the app (by phone) and got there, at first sight of the front entrance, there was a beautifully warm array of flowers, adorned in roses of red alongside some roses in white and violet, gently grouped and perched atop green foliage plants above the entrance and neatly cuddled alongside the opened door giving a pleasantly warm inviting feel for the senses.

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Coffee and Plants (Pasadena, California, 9/29).


Once inside, I was calmly greeted by one of the owners when I asked about a pick-up order I placed over the phone a moment ago. Shortly after I picked up my order and turned towards my right to make my way out, I noticed a dazzling display of fern, ivy and green foliage from a variety of plants cradled around roses and carnations in a subtly poetic way, along with several other flowers of the lesser shown variety such as daisies, camellia, gardenia, and lilac. Alongside the inner area of the upper center displayed the words ‘Coffee and Plants,’ in soft white neon lighting, for a fun & casual approach in a narrative-centered tone.

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Coffee and Plants (inside by entrance of cafe, Pasadena, California, 9/29).


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Cold brew coffee (take-out, from Coffee and Plants, Pasadena, California, 9/29).
Fragrant caressing notes of mellow berry and floral flavors giving off a sensually smooth blend of deep rounded fruity-caramel sweetness with a hint of pungent spice ending in a subtly soft musky aromatic finish.


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Blueberry pie (take-out @ Coffee and Plants, Pasadena, California, 9/29).
Although not a standout in flavor and texture, the pie was overall decent in the different flavors it gave with enough tartness and moistly rich roundness of subtly sweet with a bit of sour bite, while keeping the flavor profiles fairly balanced with a hint of herbal spice and buttery flavors from the crust.


When I got home, I had the urge to go back and re-read the recent e-mail I got from 64 Audio, and in the last two sentences, they mentioned a cable brand/company I was familiar with that can make the cable with 0.75mm 2-pin connectors and in 4.4 balanced.

The next morning (9/30), after a fairly brief search on the cable that met my preferences and use case (for listening on the go at work), I came across a cable that I felt best met my needs for mostly daily listening and use in the outer elements while moving orders and stocking merchandise around and about from work to warehouse and back (at work six days a week).

Without a slight doubt in this decision, I went ahead in completing the checkout of my order. With no regrets, I’m happy to say that a Plus Sound Verse sleeved 4-wire silver plated copper cable (w/ 0.75mm 2-pin connectors and in 4.4 balanced) will be made and on its way within the next 2-3 weeks. I really look forward to seeing how this cable is going to pair and perform with my A12t (currently in build progress), and how it will hold up in a dynamic work environment, as well as with the outer elements on the go and around & at work over time. =)

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Plus Sound Verse 4-wire sleeved spc cable in 4.4 balanced, w/ 0.75mm 2-pin connectors (ordered from Plus Sound, 9/30).


-Daniel.
This is the reason I have (and use frequently) the DX160, even though I also have the DX300.

And I agree about the small annoyances, though the DX170 is a much-improved WiFi and BT experience, it still has the same 2GB of RAM which makes using streaming apps a bit laggy to begin with. Thankfully, most of my library is local, so I don't really have much lag issues overall.

As for sound quality (it might be a tad different on the DX170) I have not heard a mid-tier DAP that sounds as good and find that while it DOES lag behind the DX300 (to my ears), it isn't night and day and for much less money. Either way, I think that iBasso continues to hit it out of the park.

Congrats on your new shiny! :)
 
Oct 1, 2022 at 8:30 PM Post #36,951 of 89,889
Thank you. If I understood your summary, you simply adjusted the graph down manually. The IEM may not actually graph the same way if the measurements were actually taken at that db level, correct? Where I am going with this is: is it possible for the tested IEM to graph differently at different db levels? Thank you.
No no! The FR does not change if you measure high or low. It is just advised to keep the measuring levels between -18dBFS and -12dBFS in the software to have good strong signal that isn't too low and also has good headroom to graph properly and that generally results in final graphs coming out between 1kHz @ 80-110dB SPL roughly. Measuring at lower or higher levels than -18 to -12 dBFS (~80-110 SPL) 'may' introduce artefacts like ripples in the graph line or clipping but the actual FR won't change with change in levels.

I'm guessing you're trying to correlate graph measurement levels to Fletcher-Munson curve theory but the FM theory shows how 'our' human ear responds to and hears different frequencies at different levels. The IEM plays the same FR but it sounds a bit different with change in volume because our ears hear the frequencies differently at different levels.
 
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Oct 1, 2022 at 8:47 PM Post #36,952 of 89,889
I still jam out to Diary of Jane, love it in the gym haha. It’s sort of become one of my go-to test tracks also.
Oh it's a really good track with excellent production and mix! No surprises there because it had David Bendeth as the producer and Chris Lord Alge as the mix engineer. 👌🏼
 
Oct 1, 2022 at 9:31 PM Post #36,953 of 89,889
I think we need a UM tour kit. What do you say @UniqueMelody ? :wink:
 
Oct 1, 2022 at 11:51 PM Post #36,956 of 89,889
I still jam out to Diary of Jane, love it in the gym haha. It’s sort of become one of my go-to test tracks also.
I rediscovered this song again last week on Amazon music and started listening again
 
Oct 2, 2022 at 12:21 AM Post #36,957 of 89,889
Haha, very diverse. A large portion of it is different sub genres of electronic music, which takes up most of my listening. In any given listening session I can bounce from Dr Dre, Michael Jackson, Mariah Carey, video game soundtracks, Linkin Park, Breaking Benjamin, Seven Lions, Illenium, the Weeknd… it just depends what mood I’m in for. 🤷🏽‍♂️
I don’t have any jazz, classical, or orchestra stuff unless it’s from a

Some of my list too except no MJ and Carey. No jazz, classical, orchestra either except Hans zimmer

I started listening to JRock again recently
 
Oct 2, 2022 at 12:28 AM Post #36,958 of 89,889
Not sure if this is the right thread for this topic (please let me know if not), but is there a Paypal alternative? Their upcoming policy is a doozy...

Link

None that are as reliable unfortunately. Long time no see-- what are you listening to these days?
 
Oct 2, 2022 at 12:42 AM Post #36,959 of 89,889
I think we need a UM tour kit. What do you say @UniqueMelody ? :wink:
I would love to get in on this. I really want to hear the Multiverse again. It was one of my top 3 IEM highlights coming out of CanJam.
 
Oct 2, 2022 at 3:25 AM Post #36,960 of 89,889
None that are as reliable unfortunately. Long time no see-- what are you listening to these days?

Yeah, been trying to be responsible and all that so I've steered clear of here to avoid temptation. But I can't resist the occasional lurk...

I've been listening to the Hiby RS2 + Dunu Zen Pro. There's great synergy with that pairing and it's the best I've heard the DZP by a decent margin. The RS2 improves on the slight hard/metallic upper mids of the DZP, and adds a bit of extension too. The pairing is super physical, even by DD standards. Both macro and micro dynamics are very convincing. This track for example sounds really good. The vibration of the baritone (?) sax at the beginning is lifelike. Then later the female voice is delicate yet bodied, and never a bit hard/metallic, like it was with the DZP even on the R2R based RU6.

 
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