[SBranson]

When, e.g., Kenny Garrett plays his specific alto sax in a room, with no mics, it's a very specific sound...
In a lot of ways this is all a giant 'Don't care'.

Well, you don’t think the musician cares, or the recording engineer? The years of perfecting their craft, choosing their instrument, choosing the reed (in this case), choosing the recording venue, mic’s etc, etc....
I have a friend who’s an electronic musician and goes through lots of pains to get the sound “right”... I guess you could argue that’s just for himself...

It’s certainly your prerogative to not care what the artists intended but that’s not how I listen and choose my equipment.

 

[fzman]

Well, you don’t think the musician cares, or the recording engineer? The years of perfecting their craft, choosing their instrument, choosing the reed (in this case), choosing the recording venue, mic’s etc, etc....
I have a friend who’s an electronic musician and goes through lots of pains to get the sound “right”... I guess you could argue that’s just for himself...

It’s certainly your prerogative to not care what the artists intended but that’s not how I listen and choose my equipment.

My Bad- that is not what I meant, but I said it poorly. The point I was trying to make was that lots of folks don;t care about any philosophical discussions about how to make sonic determinations about gear and/or recordings). The irony is that I agree with you.

I was not trying to say that the musicians or engineers do not care! Good catch-I appreciate the feedback (pun intended). I went back and edited my comment to be less misleading and clumsy.

 

[fzman]

I took that picture from my back porch. When I went out there and saw that shadow on the garage, the whole Plato's Cave' ideas is exactly and instantly what came into my mind.

 

[Rockwell75]

 

[Rockwell75]

Sorry, but I am not working in this "more treble, less bass, big soundstage etc" way. I can hear the difference, but if it is not completely bad, I pretty much only notice.
But what I really really focus on is the flow of the music. Does sad music make you feel the sadness and happy music the other way round. Can I easily follow the flow of the music or do I have to concentrate. Is the rhythm just catching me and my feet cannot stop. Stuff like that I can compare in a few seconds. In blind tests as well. I call it musicality. Others also use it sometimes. Sometimes I see "more emotions" which might be the same.
So in terms of pure hifi sound qualities (Soundstage, resolution ...) there was nothing wrong with the M15. But in terms of musicality I heard in 10 seconds that the M8 will stay and M15 will go. I gave it some more rounds with (quite) different music and headphones, but it was always the same result. M8 won hands down.
Payed full price for my M15 12 months before. Got around 60% back. Usage of M15 was way easier (be prepared). But I have no regrets having sold it (sorry FiiO).

I wanted to respond to this here too as it touches really deeply on something I think a lot about.

Brilliant post. This is something I've noticed more and more as I get on in this hobby-- when it comes to assessing IEMs, gear etc. I'm much less concerned with breaking everything down into its constituent parts (bass, treble, technicalities etc.) and really only interested in how the overall gestalt (IE., how the sound presents as a unity and how I respond to it internally). Sometimes all the individual aspects seem perfect, but something about the whole seems off, too pedestrian or otherwise unengaging...other times some things seem like they should be dealbreakers but taken in the broad view as whole everything just seems to work. Ultimately only our own ears and sensibilities can be the judge.

 

[Rockwell75]

@Verificateur Atlas is a beast but imho if you already have the Mest you may want to consider spending just a bit more to consider the Andromeda or Dorado 2020.

 

[mashuto]

I wanted to respond to this here too as it touches really deeply on something I think a lot about.

Brilliant post. This is something I've noticed more and more as I get on in this hobby-- when it comes to assessing IEMs, gear etc. I'm much less concerned with breaking everything down into its constituent parts (bass, treble, technicalities etc.) and really only interested in how the overall gestalt (IE., how the sound presents as a unity and how I respond to it internally). Sometimes all the individual aspects seem perfect, but something about the whole seems off, too pedestrian or otherwise unengaging...other times some things seem like they should be dealbreakers but taken in the broad view as whole everything just seems to work. Ultimately only our own ears and sensibilities can be the judge.

I definitely agree with what you both are saying. Sometimes I find it really hard to actually break down what individual components are contributing to my like or dislike of an IEM. But what I do know is that for me, when I connect most with a piece of gear is when I can actively stop trying to break it down and just get lost in the music. And on that criteria, many of my much cheaper IEMs compare quite favorably.

Unfortunately though, trying to describe sound is super difficult, especially given how subjective it is and how much things can differ from one person to next. So we are definitely stuck breaking it all down as I think we would find ourselves at a big disadvantage trying to more objectively describe what we hear without trying to describe those constituent parts. Even though that too gets real tough to wade through things as again we all hear everything differently.

 

[fzman]

LIke relartionships, the little things are often the deal-breakers. (I suppose that's because the big stuff was already dealt with pre-"purchase". You know you have found 'the one' when their quirks become irrelevant.

Same dealio with gear-- it's not the parts, it's the whole. Music is a gestault, not a bunch of bass, mids and treble.

That!

 

[Mehran]

I wanted to respond to this here too as it touches really deeply on something I think a lot about.

Brilliant post. This is something I've noticed more and more as I get on in this hobby-- when it comes to assessing IEMs, gear etc. I'm much less concerned with breaking everything down into its constituent parts (bass, treble, technicalities etc.) and really only interested in how the overall gestalt (IE., how the sound presents as a unity and how I respond to it internally). Sometimes all the individual aspects seem perfect, but something about the whole seems off, too pedestrian or otherwise unengaging...other times some things seem like they should be dealbreakers but taken in the broad view as whole everything just seems to work. Ultimately only our own ears and sensibilities can be the judge.

In my experience, since getting more into this hobby, I find it harder and harder to get to that place of connecting in a deeper way to lusic unfortunately. Between reading reviews, impressions and getting familiar with audiophile terminology on one hand, and owing several IEMs and wondering how music sounds on each of them, it's difficult to get lost in the music like before. When the mind is shaped in a certain form it's hard to go back and lose the patterns. Maybe a time off can help , but until now it's been ironic for me.

 

[Rockwell75]

Unfortunately though, trying to describe sound is super difficult, especially given how subjective it is and how much things can differ from one person to next. So we are definitely stuck breaking it all down as I think we would find ourselves at a big disadvantage trying to more objectively describe what we hear without trying to describe those constituent parts. Even though that too gets real tough to wade through things as again we all hear everything differently.

Indeed-- the best I can really do is describe what I'm hearing and how I feel in a way that is meaningful to me...if it resonates with others great, if not oh well.

LIke relartionships, the little things are often the deal-breakers. (I suppose that's because the big stuff was already dealt with pre-"purchase". You know you have found 'the one' when their quirks become irrelevant.

Same dealio with gear-- it's not the parts, it's the whole. Music is a gestault, not a bunch of bass, mids and treble.

That!

Well said!

In my experience, since getting more into this hobby, I find it harder and harder to get to that place of connecting in a deeper way to lusic unfortunately. Between reading reviews, impressions and getting familiar with audiophile terminology on one hand, and owing several IEMs and wondering how music sounds on each of them, it's difficult to get lost in the music like before. When the mind is shaped in a certain form it's hard to go back and lose the patterns. Maybe a time off can help , but until now it's been ironic for me.

I know what you mean. I have found that the greater the extent I follow my own inclinations and perceptions and not have the water muddied by the conflicting opinions of others...then the greater will be my satisfaction in this hobby. I find that I tend to consistently connect with certain companies (Campfire, VE, Sony) whose overall philosophy/way of doing things seems to resonate most with my own preferences.

 

[Verificateur]

@Verificateur Atlas is a beast but imho if you already have the Mest you may want to consider spending just a bit more to consider the Andromeda or Dorado 2020.

Thank you. The Mest Mk2 are my one “universal” IEMs....for me, they work really well with all of my library... and I love the sound.
So I am at a bit of a crossroads... on the one hand, I may want a “backup” IEM for on-the-go when I don’t want to take the MEST with me, on the other hand I may not want that “backup” to be as expensive and to the point it starts ‘competing’ with MEST for my attention, as it would defeat the purpose of what I am trying to achieve.

So, given this... perhaps I should just get the Comet? I am also open to other options and would appreciate any thoughts. Cheers!

 

[chickenmcnug]

All good I was just curious what you meant by "artificially created genre".



I would 100% rec the Atlas over the Comet (I owned both...and actually the jump from the Comet to the Atlas was what kicked off my "audio journey" into full gear).

Our starts were pretty much the same.

Comet -> Atlas -> Solaris OG

You can pinpoint the exact moment the wallet dies oof.

Thank you. The Mest Mk2 are my one “universal” IEMs....for me, they work really well with all of my library... and I love the sound.
So I am at a bit of a crossroads... on the one hand, I may want a “backup” IEM for on-the-go when I don’t want to take the MEST with me, on the other hand I may not want that “backup” to be as expensive and to the point it starts ‘competing’ with MEST for my attention, as it would defeat the purpose of what I am trying to achieve.

So, given this... perhaps I should just get the Comet? I am also open to other options and would appreciate any thoughts. Cheers!

You have 2 options:

a) Get Comet and be satisfied with what you have and never need to visit HF again (a lot of us here can’t lol)

b) Go for something complementary around the same price, visit HF more often, find more IEMs that interest you, maybe a 3rd one is now on your radar, now you have 8 IEMs and a sad wallet.

 

[Rockwell75]

b) Go for something complementary around the same price, visit HF more often, find more IEMs that interest you, maybe a 3rd one is now on your radar, now you have 8 IEMs and a sad wallet.

This right here. To @Verificateur If you're looking at the Campfire lineup the Mest is closest to the Solaris so I would consider the Dorado or Andromeda depending on your tastes. Having a few different flavors at roughly the same tier is rather nice and and can give you enough variety to satisfy your fancy for a while...unless you're like me, @8481 and many others who can't seem to stop coming to Head Fi. I tried to once then wound up starting this thread the next day. That said I'm doing ok at the moment because I've tried most of the notable IEMs at the $1-2K price tier I play on and there doesn't seem to be too much coming out in the near future that I'm interested in.

 

[chickenmcnug]

Tbh @Rockwell75, your constant praise of the Dorado has gotten me interested in a new IEM again, I thought I was done..

 

[Mehran]

So after a couple of days with the Elysium I want to share some of my thoughts.
Right now the only fault I can think of , as many have stated before, is that the stage width could be better. It's noticeable when you compare it to Solaris, Mest and Semper . But also these IEMs all are great in that aspect. Maybe the M8 will help with that.
Where they excel at is in tuning . It's been done so masterfully that they sound great with everything in my library, and I listen to a lot of different genres with all kinds of recordings.
The instruments and vocals sound so natural with the right tonality and timbre IMO. I don't know why a lot IEMs mess the vocals so much and nobody cares. Almost all the IEMs I've tried sound high pitched and off to various degrees.
For me a lot of beauty lies in the tone of a singers voice and vocals are the main focus when listening to music, at least for me.
Anyway I'm quite happy with them. Hoping for the M8 to make the M8 even more enjoyable.
On another note I had to cancel my Dorado unfortunately as I found a good deal on a Tia Fourte. I had too many bassy IEMs so I wanted to go for something different.