[Deezel177]

One thing I’m beginning to notice in the audio world:
Sometimes people’s perceptions of gear is directly correlated to price, and not necessarily performance.

Why do you think brands try to out-price each other? I brought this up a while ago (and it's something multiple brands have told me in conversation), a large majority of a product's pricing is the perception of performance. So, regardless of material costs and/or R&D, if a brand wants to suggest/imply their product is better-performing than product X, they basically have to price it higher than product X. It's an unfortunately effective strategy, and it isn't difficult to see why. I remember a story a Hong Kong dealer told on Nic's thread, where customers would audition IEMs A and B and preferred IEM A sonically, only to purchase IEM B when they found out it was the pricier of the two.

By the same token, it's also a great opportunity to subvert expectations, like when Piotr from Custom Art conducted his FIBAE Black test. Basically, he sent reviewers this mystery IEM, then asked us to post impressions, guess its price and guess its driver config. It had several sound bores, which suggested a multi-driver design. A lot of us guessed something along the lines of 3-6 drivers and a $1000 price tag. 'Turns out, all it had inside was a tricked-out BA, and it retailed for $500. Obviously, that drove a lot of hype for the IEM when it came out. So, there are scenarios where the phenomenon is actually pro-consumer. But, more often than not, it will benefit the brand more than it will the buyer.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that I, myself, will be testing the theory when I audition the Aroma Audio Ace in Singapore this June (fingers crossed). I remember it being in the Anole VX/U18t/VE8/Zeus sort-of bracket in terms of performance. But, now I've realized that it's actually priced above stuff like the PHoNIX and EXT, and someone here likened it to the ODIN in technical performance as well. So, we'll see whether or not I change my mind, now that I have the knowledge of its MSRP.

 

[Frankie D]

But emi and other types of interference can and do affect cables signature even though bits are the same.

For an analogue cable I agree with you. I am not so sure about a digital cable. Especially one that is 4”. Could there be something else at play causing a difference in sound? Was everything else truly the same?

 

[Precogvision]

Hey everyone, I wanted to share content from my trip to Singapore - one of the premiere hubs of the audio world! This is probably one of the coolest trips I've taken, especially because this was my first time traveling out of the country on my own. I got to meet in-person so many people I've been chatting with online and binge out on equal parts good food and audio gear. There's coverage of hanging out with Crinacle, checking out Zeppelin & Co (probably the coolest audio store I've visited), and much more. It took a while to get this content out, but I'm super eager to share more about what the experience was like!

Written article: https://www.headphones.com/community/reviews-learning-and-news/audiophile-in-singapore

CanJam SG 2022 coverage (in case you missed it): Day 1 IEMs, Day 2 HPs

Video re-cap:

 

[RTodd]

For an analogue cable so agree with you. I am not so sure about a digital cable. Especially one that is 4”. Could there be something else at play causing a difference in sound? Was everything else truly the same?

Has to be some kind of placebo effect going on here, causing us to think it sounds better with the more expensive cable.

Signal noise can interfere with both analog and digital signals; however, the amount of noise necessary to affect a digital signal is much higher. It does not seem plausible that we would normally experience noise at that high of a level.

Digital signals are one of two values, and are usually between 0V and VCC (1.8V, 3.3V, or 5V). This would make it very unlikely that something like normal household interference could take some of those VCC bits to 0V or even more unlikely raise some of them to the VCC level.

 

[F700]

Bringing the M2 and the C9 together implies to drive the M2 via Line Pre modus via the C9, right?

 

[hAbIrAbI]

Has to be some kind of placebo effect going on here, causing us to think it sounds better with the more expensive cable.

Signal noise can interfere with both analog and digital signals; however, the amount of noise necessary to affect a digital signal is much higher. It does not seem plausible that we would normally experience noise at that high of a level.

Digital signals are one of two values, and are usually between 0V and VCC (1.8V, 3.3V, or 5V). This would make it very unlikely that something like normal household interference could take some of those VCC bits to 0V or even more unlikely raise some of them to the VCC level.

Also digital connections have error correction to fix any flipped bits. The only way the signal would be affected is if the interference was so strong that the amount of correct signals to get through was less than the buffer size. That would cause artifacts or an interruption in audio.

But a change in the output is simply put impossible with a digital signal. There are only 1s and 0s.

 

[xenithon]

How are the cooler gang with N8ii’s finding it with full size headphones? In particular, anyone tried it with the Meze Elite?

Off the topic of gear and onto some music, easing into the weekend with the new release from one of my favorite artists, Karen Elson, titled Green.

A little bit disjointed, sounds more like a collection of songs than an end-to-end album. Nonetheless, not analyzing too much, just kicking back and enjoying.

 

[fiascogarcia]

Bringing the M2 and the C9 together implies to drive the M2 via Line Pre modus via the C9, right?

Probably best to try it both ways, but to me the OG sounds a little better using the C9 pre-mode, ie., improved clarity, tighter bass, slightly wider soundstage, and a touch greater difference switching between the SS and tube options. IMO

 

[Ojisan]

Also digital connections have error correction to fix any flipped bits. The only way the signal would be affected is if the interference was so strong that the amount of correct signals to get through was less than the buffer size. That would cause artifacts or an interruption in audio.

But a change in the output is simply put impossible with a digital signal. There are only 1s and 0s.

One way the digital cable "can" affect the sound quality is when you have a noisy source and the cable ties the ground from source to the receiving end, thus transferring the noise from one device to the other. Furthermore, the noise will manifest if, at the receiving end, there is a path from digital ground to the analog ground which you listen to. This is, of course, more of a source and/or receive device issue than a cable issue, unless the expensive cable has a secret noise blocker built into it

 

[hAbIrAbI]

This would imply that your very expensive source, target device and cable are all not well designed and missing measures to mitigate.

Also wouldn't that mean the target device has electromagnetic leakage which would make the entire device a waste of money?

 

[endless402]

i would say don't knock it till you try it yourself. I doubt it has anything to do with the 0 and 1's, but rather the EMI and other noise that's leaking in, especially if it carries power.

having tried a ton of different usb cables, they're all different. and expensive doesn't mean it's better.

wait till you get into clocks / reclockers....

 

[hAbIrAbI]

Oh there are differences. Mostly because a lot of cables don't strictly completely adhere to standards. Which explains why some cables have difficulties establishing connections and so on. Or the device manufacturers don't abide by the standards on their ends.

But neither should have an impact on the digital payload.

 

[gLer]

I’m listening at roughly 55/120 in high gain and they sound just as spacious, controlled, layered etc.

I should probably start listening at lower volumes, though my liking 75/120 for the Z1R could be more to do with mild hearing loss rather than favouring louder volumes.

Bringing the M2 and the C9 together implies to drive the M2 via Line Pre modus via the C9, right?

Probably best to try it both ways, but to me the OG sounds a little better using the C9 pre-mode, ie., improved clarity, tighter bass, slightly wider soundstage, and a touch greater difference switching between the SS and tube options. IMO

Yes, C9 was 'designed' to pair with WM1Z in Pre mode according to Andy Kong. I found the benefits of the C9 with the 1Z along the same lines as above, which is to say not enough to justify the cost of a C9 just for the 1Z. The difference was far greater, in favour of the C9, when paired with the HiBy RS6.

 

[Ojisan]

This would imply that your very expensive source, target device and cable are all not well designed and missing measures to mitigate.

Also wouldn't that mean the target device has electromagnetic leakage which would make the entire device a waste of money?

I think it happens more often than we like with portable sources where the real estate needed for isolation (and additional components vs real benefit for majority users) may not be available. Not something to blindly accept or deny based on price…

 

[solstice15]

As I catch up this morning with the threads listening to music, I have a feeling of satisfaction and at the same time a building curiosity in the else.
Now I read that the Jewell I spent four hours with and than proceeded to watch people listen to at CJNY22 may have not been a true representative unit. The set sounded amazing to me, I was not looking for that kind of sound, now back to the drawing board

I think I met you there! Wasn't posting much here at that time. I first listened to the Jewel that had a fancy cable on it (I think chiron?), then I asked to try the stock cable and Andrew grabbed a second set entirely with the stock cable on it. I preferred the one with the stock cable, but now I'm not sure if that was due to unit variance or the cables, or some mix of the two. The only thing I recall was the first one sounded "warmer" and a bit less spacious, not night and day though.