THE WATERCOOLER HEADPHONE EDITION – Headphones, Amps, DACs, and desktop/home audio related – a freewheeling discussion of gear, impressions, music, and musings.

[Tchoupitoulas]

When you buy a big ticket item, do you intend to keep it long term or do you cycle it out for another purchase. I'm curious if folks hold retain gear for longer periods (5 years or more)?

A bit of both as I've been a gear cycler en route to long term ownership. I've spent the past three years on a mission to check out as many appealing headphones as possible so as to be able to settle down with three favorites that, in having distinct presentations, should keep me happy and less inclined to upgrade over the long term.

Fortunately, I've been able to check out a lot of gear at CanJams, Audio46, and from loaner tours and borrowing headphones from friends. The headphones I've had to purchase to audition I bought used, so the loss from resale hasn't been too bad - just a kind of rental fee, like a few nice meals out per month. I can tell pretty quickly if I'm not fond of a pair of headphones, so after a bit of experimenting with different gear combinations to see if there are any synergies, I tend to move on from them fairly quickly, in a matter of months, usually.

With that said, I do tend to hang on to great items over the long term if they have a special place close to my heart or if they do something truly special, and I inherited this tendency from my father, so some of the following items have been in the family now for 2 generations:

LCD-R: my oldest current headphone, at 3 years of ownership
Apple iPod 5th Gen: coming up to 20 years!
Sony Minidisc player: 20+ years
Quad ESL 57 speakers: 30+ years
Thorens TD 166 mk II turntable: 35+ years
Quad 33/303 pre and power amps: ca 50 years
These Jim Rogers JR149 standmount speakers: ca 50 years

Let's see if my LCD-R, SR1a, and modded LCD-4z will keep me from cycling for the decades to come...

 

[TheAbyss2022]

If you think Audiophiles are crazy now, think again!

 

[EIOIO]

Can some one give a feedback about DUNU Arashi.I want to replace my broken lcd-x and I was wondering if they will be better for electro/edm . I am more leaning on the instrumental that voices ?

 

[Death_Block]

Last few pages have stacks of info on the arashi

 

[Sajid Amit]

Who here has a cute little robot that likes to pose for photos and sings to you when you connect it to headphones?

Its called the xDuoo DM-01 and it sounds incredible, and its only $279.

https://apos.audio/products/xduoo-dm-01-desktop-dac-amp

 

[normie610]

Its called the xDuoo DM-01 and it sounds incredible, and its only $279.

Better than MMT + AIC combo?

 

[Death_Block]

I think you might need a better dac

 

[Sajid Amit]

Better than MMT + AIC combo?

Lol no.

 

[Leto Dal]

Lol no.

We need a review with a thoughtful A/B.

 

[Doug2507]

Cross post from Immanis thread, had the new Rockna Wavedream Reference Signature on demo after the few glowing reviews that are out, had expected to end up buying it in all honesty and nearly did a blind buy but very glad I didn't as it didn't quite meet expectations. Also a bit of relief in neither K50 or M21 selling as they'll be here to stay now.

Reality check for myself for blind buys and it's also put me off getting an MPD-8, I won't be able to demo and I don't want to loose anything the system brings already. Regardless, it's still a win, very content with what I have now and won't be looking to change anything going forward apart from a usb cable upgrade I'd been putting off until making a call if M21 was staying or going.

My scribbled down notes...

Rockna WDRS VS Bricasti M21:

Source: Antipodes K50 (Roon / Squeeze)
Amp: Feliks Envy with Thomas Mayer TM300B
Cables: Custom IC (XLR) and same used for both M21 & WDRS, Intona Ref USB, Jorma AES, good quality CAT8.
Headphone: RAAL Immanis with 32ohm RCD / Star-8.
Music: All rock oriented. No classical, jazz, hippity hoppity etc. Used what I listen to most.

WDRS

Bass - Strong attack, leaner / tighter, not as bodied.

Mids - leaner (male vocal & guitar), strong attack (strikes on Tom's).

Treble - more prominent, slightly more ethereal / swish, strong attack / strike.

Stage - slightly further back mids, wider.

Layering - Very competent, doesn't struggle with busy passages, clear definition.

Timbre - Not typical R2R. Lacking some emotive connection.

Dynamics - Not lacking.

Decay - fast (?) . Missing reverb on bass / mids, possibly because attack / strike is so prominent. Doesn't have the natural reverb that M21 has, eg, drum skin or post bass pluck.

Source - network really good, better than digi from K50 (AES, USB, I2S (but with generic HD I cable) , K50 server / WDRS rendered.

Technically very good but didn't get full engagement. Maybe better paired with stereotypical "tubey" amp to fill mids out in particular. Little bit of fatigue setting in due to energy. Definitely not stereotypical R2R. Attack and treble detail stood out.

Really well built, great UI, touch screen and remote both seemless, ability to change I2S pin is a great feature, network play was really good and as a one box solution, that's great to hear. Didn't try with PC direct as I've not got the PC setup as server due to having K50 but server only from K50 sounded rather good.

Would be nice to hear this with speakers on the end but I think the same would apply, maybe not an ideal pairing for speakers (or amps) than have focus / intensity up top, particularly the speaker.

M21 (DS - closer fight)

Bass - Better textured, less kick, more body, weightier.

Mids - better textured, more bodied, tonally richer.

Treble - Not as forward, smoother, fuller notes.

Stage - not as wide, mids more forward, greater note weight / size.

Layering - No issues either, all clearly defined despite bigger notes.

Decay - slower than WDRS, excellent reverb but remains clean within passage.

Timbre - very good, textured. M21 in ladder mode is quite a bit more texturally rich (especially in mids) than WDRS, DS brings it closer.

Dynamics - Not lacking

Source - usb from K50. (server / renderer)

More engaging listen, fuller bass / mids, better texture / decay. Non fatiguing (definitely less attack!). Treble softer vs WDRS. Bass / mids strong points. Also exactly why I've put XA30.8 in the system, hits hard, wider stage, touch less diffused treble.

Edit 2: Apparently only around 50hrs in the WDRS and recommended putting a good 300hrs on it for break in. Take my thoughts with a pinch of salt as all critiques are what I think would be indicitave of a new unit.

 

[goldwerger]

Cross post from Immanis thread, had the new Rockna Wavedream Reference Signature on demo after the few glowing reviews that are out, had expected to end up buying it in all honesty and nearly did a blind buy but very glad I didn't as it didn't quite meet expectations. Also a bit of relief in neither K50 or M21 selling as they'll be here to stay now.

Reality check for myself for blind buys and it's also put me off getting an MPD-8, I won't be able to demo and I don't want to loose anything the system brings already. Regardless, it's still a win, very content with what I have now and won't be looking to change anything going forward apart from a usb cable upgrade I'd been putting off until making a call if M21 was staying or going.

My scribbled down notes...

Rockna WDRS VS Bricasti M21:

Source: Antipodes K50 (Roon / Squeeze)
Amp: Feliks Envy with Thomas Mayer TM300B
Cables: Custom IC (XLR) and same used for both M21 & WDRS, Intona Ref USB, Jorma AES, good quality CAT8.
Headphone: RAAL Immanis with 32ohm RCD / Star-8.
Music: All rock oriented. No classical, jazz, hippity hoppity etc. Used what I listen to most.

WDRS

Bass - Strong attack, leaner / tighter, not as bodied.

Mids - leaner (male vocal & guitar), strong attack (strikes on Tom's).

Treble - more prominent, slightly more ethereal / swish, strong attack / strike.

Stage - slightly further back mids, wider.

Layering - Very competent, doesn't struggle with busy passages, clear definition.

Timbre - Not typical R2R. Lacking some emotive connection.

Dynamics - Not lacking.

Decay - fast (?) . Missing reverb on bass / mids, possibly because attack / strike is so prominent. Doesn't have the natural reverb that M21 has, eg, drum skin or post bass pluck.

Source - network really good, better than digi from K50 (AES, USB, I2S (but with generic HD I cable) , K50 server / WDRS rendered.

Technically very good but didn't get full engagement. Maybe better paired with stereotypical "tubey" amp to fill mids out in particular. Little bit of fatigue setting in due to energy. Definitely not stereotypical R2R. Attack and treble detail stood out.

Really well built, great UI, touch screen and remote both seemless, ability to change I2S pin is a great feature, network play was really good and as a one box solution, that's great to hear. Didn't try with PC direct as I've not got the PC setup as server due to having K50 but server only from K50 sounded rather good.

Would be nice to hear this with speakers on the end but I think the same would apply, maybe not an ideal pairing for speakers (or amps) than have focus / intensity up top, particularly the speaker.

M21 (DS - closer fight)

Bass - Better textured, less kick, more body, weightier.

Mids - better textured, more bodied, tonally richer.

Treble - Not as forward, smoother, fuller notes.

Stage - not as wide, mids more forward, greater note weight / size.

Layering - No issues either, all clearly defined despite bigger notes.

Decay - slower than WDRS, excellent reverb but remains clean within passage.

Timbre - very good, textured. M21 in ladder mode is quite a bit more texturally rich (especially in mids) than WDRS, DS brings it closer.

Dynamics - Not lacking

Source - usb from K50. (server / renderer)

More engaging listen, fuller bass / mids, better texture / decay. Non fatiguing (definitely less attack!). Treble softer vs WDRS. Bass / mids strong points. Also exactly why I've put XA30.8 in the system, hits hard, wider stage, touch less diffused treble.

Thanks for the very helpful write up.

I’m starting to think about getting the M21 + M19 for my system. No rush, but pretty sure that would be my next step. I do love the Bricasti sound for exactly the reasons you describe, and I’m curious what the next step up would be like. For now, it’s mostly about real estate management. Some components will have to go to make room..

 

[Doug2507]

Thanks for the very helpful write up.

I’m starting to think about getting the M21 + M19 for my system. No rush, but pretty sure that would be my next step. I do love the Bricasti sound for exactly the reasons you describe, and I’m curious what the next step up would be like. For now, it’s mostly about real estate management. Some components will have to go to make room..

Not insignificant from M3 tbh.

Size wize, M21 is still reasonably compact tbh, WDRS has a massive foot print in comparison.

Would love to hear your thoughts on M19 if you ever get to hear it on demo vs streamer / server hooked up to M21. Similar ilk to MPT-8, but nobody has really answered if theres a notable difference from the same ripped file from server vs disc. I'm very curious about that one..

 

[ThanatosVI]

We need a review with a thoughtful A/B.

Since I have neither of these amps, I asked my friend ChatGPT. Here is his review:

Battle of the Boxes: Riviera AIC10 vs xDuoo DM-01

Let’s get this out of the way: the Riviera AIC10 is a sonic masterpiece. It sings, it whispers, it massages your eardrums with the grace of an Italian tenor seducing your soul through vacuum tubes. But, oh dear God, does it look like a Soviet toaster had an affair with a microwave from 1973. It's the kind of amp you hide in a cabinet and pretend is a backup generator.

Enter the xDuoo DM-01. Is it sonically comparable to the Riviera? Absolutely not. Does it matter? Absolutely not. Because look at it — this thing looks like a cyberpunk artifact smuggled out of a Blade Runner set. It's sleek, it's menacing, it glows like it knows your playlist before you do. If James Bond had a headphone amp, this would be it. The Riviera, by contrast, is what Bond’s accountant might use while calculating tube replacement costs.

Sure, the Riviera gives you creamy mids and airy highs that’ll make you cry over songs you didn’t even like. But when it comes to aesthetics, the xDuoo DM-01 rolls in like a nightclub bouncer and kicks the Riviera straight off the shelf.

In conclusion:
Sound: Riviera wins.
Looks: xDuoo wins so hard it files for visual custody of your desk.

 

[Leto Dal]

Cross post from Immanis thread, had the new Rockna Wavedream Reference Signature on demo after the few glowing reviews that are out, had expected to end up buying it in all honesty and nearly did a blind buy but very glad I didn't as it didn't quite meet expectations. Also a bit of relief in neither K50 or M21 selling as they'll be here to stay now.

Reality check for myself for blind buys and it's also put me off getting an MPD-8, I won't be able to demo and I don't want to loose anything the system brings already. Regardless, it's still a win, very content with what I have now and won't be looking to change anything going forward apart from a usb cable upgrade I'd been putting off until making a call if M21 was staying or going.

My scribbled down notes...

Rockna WDRS VS Bricasti M21:

Source: Antipodes K50 (Roon / Squeeze)
Amp: Feliks Envy with Thomas Mayer TM300B
Cables: Custom IC (XLR) and same used for both M21 & WDRS, Intona Ref USB, Jorma AES, good quality CAT8.
Headphone: RAAL Immanis with 32ohm RCD / Star-8.
Music: All rock oriented. No classical, jazz, hippity hoppity etc. Used what I listen to most.

WDRS

Bass - Strong attack, leaner / tighter, not as bodied.

Mids - leaner (male vocal & guitar), strong attack (strikes on Tom's).

Treble - more prominent, slightly more ethereal / swish, strong attack / strike.

Stage - slightly further back mids, wider.

Layering - Very competent, doesn't struggle with busy passages, clear definition.

Timbre - Not typical R2R. Lacking some emotive connection.

Dynamics - Not lacking.

Decay - fast (?) . Missing reverb on bass / mids, possibly because attack / strike is so prominent. Doesn't have the natural reverb that M21 has, eg, drum skin or post bass pluck.

Source - network really good, better than digi from K50 (AES, USB, I2S (but with generic HD I cable) , K50 server / WDRS rendered.

Technically very good but didn't get full engagement. Maybe better paired with stereotypical "tubey" amp to fill mids out in particular. Little bit of fatigue setting in due to energy. Definitely not stereotypical R2R. Attack and treble detail stood out.

Really well built, great UI, touch screen and remote both seemless, ability to change I2S pin is a great feature, network play was really good and as a one box solution, that's great to hear. Didn't try with PC direct as I've not got the PC setup as server due to having K50 but server only from K50 sounded rather good.

Would be nice to hear this with speakers on the end but I think the same would apply, maybe not an ideal pairing for speakers (or amps) than have focus / intensity up top, particularly the speaker.

M21 (DS - closer fight)

Bass - Better textured, less kick, more body, weightier.

Mids - better textured, more bodied, tonally richer.

Treble - Not as forward, smoother, fuller notes.

Stage - not as wide, mids more forward, greater note weight / size.

Layering - No issues either, all clearly defined despite bigger notes.

Decay - slower than WDRS, excellent reverb but remains clean within passage.

Timbre - very good, textured. M21 in ladder mode is quite a bit more texturally rich (especially in mids) than WDRS, DS brings it closer.

Dynamics - Not lacking

Source - usb from K50. (server / renderer)

More engaging listen, fuller bass / mids, better texture / decay. Non fatiguing (definitely less attack!). Treble softer vs WDRS. Bass / mids strong points. Also exactly why I've put XA30.8 in the system, hits hard, wider stage, touch less diffused treble.

Thx for the insights, was on the verge of getting it blindly at some point, glad I didnt pulled the trigger I guess.


@ThanatosVI Chat GPT is super fun when it comes to audio gear, some of the most fun evaluations is, when you ask it to roast your audio purchases ;D

 

[OneEyedHito]

Since I have neither of these amps, I asked my friend ChatGPT. Here is his review:

Battle of the Boxes: Riviera AIC10 vs xDuoo DM-01

Let’s get this out of the way: the Riviera AIC10 is a sonic masterpiece. It sings, it whispers, it massages your eardrums with the grace of an Italian tenor seducing your soul through vacuum tubes. But, oh dear God, does it look like a Soviet toaster had an affair with a microwave from 1973. It's the kind of amp you hide in a cabinet and pretend is a backup generator.

Enter the xDuoo DM-01. Is it sonically comparable to the Riviera? Absolutely not. Does it matter? Absolutely not. Because look at it — this thing looks like a cyberpunk artifact smuggled out of a Blade Runner set. It's sleek, it's menacing, it glows like it knows your playlist before you do. If James Bond had a headphone amp, this would be it. The Riviera, by contrast, is what Bond’s accountant might use while calculating tube replacement costs.

Sure, the Riviera gives you creamy mids and airy highs that’ll make you cry over songs you didn’t even like. But when it comes to aesthetics, the xDuoo DM-01 rolls in like a nightclub bouncer and kicks the Riviera straight off the shelf.

In conclusion:
Sound: Riviera wins.
Looks: xDuoo wins so hard it files for visual custody of your desk.

You hit the button for the Snarky GPT model, love it!