[Jodiuh]

Peter White, huh? Ill have to check that out.

As for the cord, I just use a twisty tie.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

 

[seojuhwan]

Is the chord that long to possibly bother with the mobility or general usage of the headphones? 

 

[Zoom25]

My HE-500 and D2000 cords are also quite long, however the 8400 by far has the biggest tendency to go under my revolving chair. I turn my eyes away for a second and BAM, it's under my chair, just ready to be cut up. However, the cable itself is fine. Doesn't tangle a lot. Just loops a bit at times.
 

 

[tdockweiler]

KRK KNS-8400 BASS MOD:
 
(don't do this unless you want to risk pulling out wires and voiding your warranty)
 
Wasted 3 whole hours today trying to mod the KRK KNS-8400 to make it even better. In the end it was all worth it.
The KRKs are one of the most annoying headphones to mod.
 
First you have those pads that click in place with tabs. I haven't mastered getting them on in under 1 minute yet.
Inside the shell is another inner shell you have to unscrew. These screws are ultra tiny.
 
The whole driver in enclosed in it's own little shell. KRK has put felt over the entire magnet. Good job! The driver of the 6400 and 8400 have different markings, so probably different drivers. Same internal design. The magnet is enclosed in it's own little area and there is a hole in the inner shell where the magnet is.
 
I must have opened and closed both areas several dozen times. So annoying.
 
Here's a few things I heard or thought I heard:
 
Removed felt completely (reversible!):
 
Massive bass bloat, recessed mids. Severe loss of clarity. No kidding! Not as bad as the stock XB500

I was amused for a few seconds..
 
Less upper bass (I think), less "relaxed" mids. Mids now as forward (sounding) as the 6400:
 
3 holes covered with tape, Creatology foam over inner shell hole.
 
I almost stopped here and was going to switch back to stock. At first I didn't have the foam over the hole and it sounded like female vocals were distant sounding. Glad I went back and covered it. Surprised that changed the sound so much.
 
2nd to last try:
 
Dynamat over entire driver. Foam on back of plastic hole and without. The resulting sound was poop. Well, duh. I just wanted to see what this did.
 
Jackpot:
 
Much better mid-bass, fuller sounding. Now this is my idea of neutral or slightly above neutral bass. Feels like it has maybe a tiny bit less mid-bass than my DJ100 now. The DJ100 still has better sub-bass and less treble.
 
No felt over driver. Replaced this with just Bounty Paper Towel! No joke! Just a small square. Nothing on plastic shell "port". The paper towel sticks to the adhesive glue left under the felt.
 
So I guess it's a case of letting more air in. Too much air to the driver and the bass is bloated.
 
You can experiment with different materials. Maybe Viva or something else.
 
NOTE:
 
My KNS-8400 stock sounds like it has a slight tad less than neutral bass. There might be a slight hump in the upper bass somewhere, but I rarely ever notice it. It definitely has less mid/sub-bass than my DJ100 to my ears. IMO the DJ100 (and my modded HD-600) has very very slightly above neutral bass. Sometimes I just wish my 8400 had more mid-bass. I'm not in a studio though and DO hate mid-bass humps.
 
If your KRK sounds like it has perfectly good bass or too much, then don't bother modding. For months I just wish my 8400 had the bass quantity of my DJ100, HD-580 and Q701.
 
I tested a song I use for reference and it sounds pretty similar on both the DJ100, modded HD-600 and KRK KNS-8400!!
 
For now i'm leaving this mod in place for a week. Listened to it for an hour and am really liking it. A lot more fun to listen to now that's for sure. It also gives me the impression of smoother treble, but probably impossible. I've experienced this with other mods before too.
 
Oh yeah.. I tested all changes with a Sansa Clip+ (ruler flat I guess). This drives the 8400 well enough on Max volume.
 
EDIT: Last night I was listening to my AD300 and my KRK KNS-8400 and it sounded like my AD300 had more bass. Made me sad. Don't worry, the AD300 has a ton more bass than the AD700 IMO. The KNS-8400 actually has some sub-bass unlike the AD300 though.
 
All this is what made me want to try to mod the KRKs. AD300 is an impressive headphone for the price though. Makes me miss my ATH-AD2000 though.
 
UPDATE:
 
I just did this with my 6400 also. I did in fact notice ONE internal difference. The 6400 has a thin fabric filter/screen on the "vent" outside the driver's plastic shell. This could explain a few of the small differences in sound. On the 8400 there is none.
 
The 6400 still sounds like it has more forward sounding mids compared to my MY 8400. Weird right? Maybe due to having less bass. I did compare them once and did feel that the 6400 had more mid-bass at one point.
 
This mod on the 6400 didn't seem to increase bass, but it now sounds even clearer. Huh?!
 
Comparing the 6400 to the 8400 is annoying. Right now with both modded the same way, the 8400 clearerly has more bass. Both really impress me in most areas.
 
Here's a track that's good for testing changes or the differences between the 6400 and 8400:
 

(have this cd in FLAC)
 
On the 6400 I can clearly here some ultra subtle voice at 2:10 or so. On the 8400 it's incredibly hard to spot. If you can actually hear what's being said you have golden ears! Can you hear it on your DT-48e or HD-800?
 
With this song the Clip+ needs to be maxed. On most other songs it's around 95%.
 
There's some low bass on this song(!) that the KRKs can barely pick up. Very warm headphones make this CD sound terrible. It hates the HD-650 IMO. Really good on the ATH-AD2000.
 
Both of these are now going to be some SERIOUS competition for my DJ100. Uh oh. We'll see..
 
I swear that a fully charged Clip+ with 8400 doesn't last more than 2 hours!! The 8400 seems to suck the power right out of the Clip+ super fast.

 

[tdockweiler]

Now on day two with this mod. I was sitting here and listening to some female vocals and thinking to myself "Wow, why do these sound much more distant?" First thing that popped in my head is that maybe the mod isn't as good as I thought. Turns out the vocals are just placed a step back and not right up front. You can switch to other female vocals and they're VERY up-front if it's actually recorded that way. There's some stuff from my favorite Japanese artist and it sounds recorded in a cave. This thing about the placement of vocals wasn't as obvious before. Like now, it's as if you can pinpoint the distance between the vocals and mic. The distant vocals were 100% the recording and the headphone is just being true to the recording.
 
I think now it's much more apparent how bad some recordings are. Some randomly sound muffled (the recording..seriously). Reminds me of the DT-880. Songs vary so much in quality and I don't mean bitrate. Un-modded this isn't as obvious. Wonder why?
 
I think the bass now is very, very accurate now. Just where it should be. When i'm listening to the STOCK KNS-8400 the bass in songs i've memorized seems to be reduced a tad in some areas compared to what it should be like. They're not bass light though.
 
When looking at the Headroom graphs they're just absolutely jaw-dropping bizarre. If mine sounded like that i'd throw them off my head in disgust. Past the bass areas it seems OK.
 
Here is where things get weird. Is it my imagination or what? Songs now sound much more accurate than before. Even the imaging seems better. Ears playing tricks on me? I don't know. I wonder if it's possible if you reduce the upper bass in a headphone to give your brain an impression of a more accurate soundstage or better imaging. I've always found too that some really warm headphones with lots of bass have a much worse soundstage. My guess is that I got more mid-bass and reduced the upper bass a tad. The sub-bass still is not very present. Similar to the HD-600, Q701, but a little better maybe. My DJ100 still has it beat in low bass.
 
I'm trying to figure out which areas have changed. I think the treble sounds much smoother (bad songs still sound bad). You'd think that if I got an impression of a tad less treble the soundstage would be WORSE and not better.
 
I think maybe with modding it's all a balancing act. If you boost some area, another area may change slightly. On my HD-600 this didn't occur, but maybe it's due to being open.
 
My guess right now is that when I boosted the mid-bass (no mid-bass hump!!), the upper bass dropped a tad and it may have smoothed out the treble. Of course i'm no sound engineer and don't have golden ears. Maybe i'm way off. The treble and bass now is much, much better.
 
I think there was once a dip in the lower mids somewhere, but it sounds a bit better perhaps.
 
I hate to see what this now sounds like with the Headroom Micro Amp and ODAC. Probably will make my Q701 look bad.
 
Seems pretty flat now. Actually more balanced than before. I think that sounds weird since i've boosted the mid-bass slightly.
 
BTW Sigur Ros's "Gong" is kind of a bad recording with lots of peaks everywhere it seems like. Probably just as bad on the Q701.
 
EDIT: After listening to these for another hour today it does feel very very picky about recordings. Do you remember how the DT-880 is and how some other headphones seem to make all stuff sound equally good? This is now like the DT-880 in that way. No NOT the sound signature. It's still fun when you have great recordings. I had this same experience on the DT-880.
 
I guess in a week if the mod is still in place i'll open them up again and take pictures.
 
It's strange how the 6400 didn't change a lot with this mod. It just became much clearer sounding in the mids. The sound of the 8400 is so addicting now and just sounds right. Stock it is, but just doesn't sound nearly as "musical". Yeah it's musical and still well balanced!

 

[Beagle]

Quote:

 
One album I recommend is Peter White's "Here We Go."

 
Is this the same Peter White who played on Al Stewart's Time Passages and Year Of The Cat? If so, great acoustic player...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tdockweiler /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
Here is where things get weird. Is it my imagination or what? Songs now sound much more accurate than before. Even the imaging seems better. Ears playing tricks on me? I don't know. I wonder if it's possible if you reduce the upper bass in a headphone to give your brain an impression of a more accurate soundstage or better imaging. I've always found too that some really warm headphones with lots of bass have a much worse soundstage. My guess is that I got more mid-bass and reduced the upper bass a tad.

 
This sounds about right. If you clear some of the fog away, everything else would likely be clearer and more precise.
 
 

I think maybe with modding it's all a balancing act. If you boost some area, another area may change slightly.

 
Right. Same as EQ'ing. I remember years ago when I had a 24 band EQ (with 3 fine-tuning settings for each band), I drove myself nuts. You'd inevitably "fix" one problem and create another one somewhere else, where it was already OK. When I found a setting I liked, I'd usually go back halfway to compromise because I knew something would eventually bother me.
 
Anyway, thanks for sharing and keep us informed of how things sound after a few days and which of your mods is your "final answer".

 

[tdockweiler]

Pretty convinced now the 6400 and 8400 don't share the same drivers.
 
I modded the 6400 today with the EXACT same mod as the 8400. The bass mid-bass was more bloated than the modded 8400 by far. Basically too much for me, but so close. Strangely the treble was a bit piercing, but the mids were still OK?! I would say the mids were more fatiguing than stock. Very strange.
 
With the bounty on the driver magnet and then the fabric covering on the vent the sound is pretty good. The soundstage is super huge for a closed headphone. The bass was actually lacking more in some areas than stock 8400. I think upper bass. The sound was crystal clear.
 
I wish I didn't remove that stock fabric/screen on the vent. Big mistake. I replaced it with a small piece of toilet paper (not used) and it sounded similar but a tad more bass. Amazing such a tiny thing could cause such a difference. Now it's pretty close to the 8400 modded sound, but not quite. Maybe a little bit less bass than the modded 8400. Perhaps more treble than modded 8400, but not by much.
 
I was thinking that my 8400 sounds pretty close to my Q701 in portable form. Stock the 8400 seems more trebly than MY Q701.
 
Man you don't know how glad I am to get some more (and better) bass from these. They had enough for me, but a tad more would have perfected the sound. The smoother treble was a nice unexpected bonus too.
 
BTW I noticed with identical mods in place the 6400 needed more volume from my Clip+.
 
These things do sound perfect with a Clip+ but obviously benefit from a good computer DAC/Amp.
 
On my next day off I need to compare them both in Skyrim, which is a good test for them. Previously the 6400 couldn't compete with the 8400 in Skyrim..at all.
 
I'm surprised there's not many impressions of the 6400 vs the 8400. Stock it's a fairly tough one at times. Sometimes they sound the same and other times they're much different. The 6400 ALWAYS sounded like it had more forward mids.
 
NOTE: forgot to mention that i'm using memory foam pads on the 6400 and 8400. I think they should sound the same as the stock 6400 pads which are pleather.

 

[tdockweiler]

Spent all night listening to these again. Was up until 3am and didn't want to sleep. The modded version just sounds so good and it might be some serious competition for my Q701 and DJ100.
While I was listening to them I tried to modify the 6400 even further. Despite trying many different things, I couldn't get the 6400 to have the bass of the 8400. It seems impossible.
 
Whenever I got the bass boosted slightly on the 6400 the mids were very recessed and the treble too fatiguing.
 
I seriously think that when modded, the 8400 probably has the best soundstage and imaging of any closed headphone i've heard. You wouldn't believe how much smoother the treble is now.
Like the Q701, it's only an issue when the recording is bad. These are song i've listened to before that have really weird treble peaks everywhere IN the recording.
 
So all it took was replacing the thick felt with Bounty! Costs you almost nothing. It probably has to be Bounty though. Not sure. I didn't even need to tape it in place. Totally reversible.
 
Pretty soon I want to give them the ultimate test and do A/B comparisons with the DJ100, Q701 and modded HD-600. The DJ100 still has slightly more bass than the modded 8400.
Closest match to the modded 8400 is the Q701, but the 8400 now might sounded clearer than the Q701, but yet still has more bass! Not that much more.
 
I do think the 8400 has some fairly decent low bass extension. Probably better than the HD-600 and Q701, but not the DJ100(!).
 
Right now I would say the modded HD-600 and modded 8400 are the flattest and most balanced headphones i've heard yet. Q701 is too my ears, but has a slight treble boost. Less so than stock 8400!
 
You know what's interesting..is that a similar mod on the HD-600 reduces the upper (and mid-bass perhaps) bass too, but seems to not change much else in the signature. Just make it clearer and even more neutral.
To my ears the HD-600 would be very neutral if it had less bass (slightly) and a tad more treble. It's pretty close without mods, but the HD-580 sounds closer to neutral to me. The one I have at least..
 
BTW I think this is the first headphone where it felt like things were going on in a good recording outside my head and even behind me. Huh

I haven't experienced anything quite like this since I had the K501, but that's bass light and open.
It just makes no sense how you get smoother treble and even better soundstaging.
 
The 6400 with just bounty and stock fabric vent cover has a larger soundstage perhaps, but not enough bass. Perhaps less warm and more forward mids though. I'm kicking myself for destroying it's fabric vent cover of the internal driver shell.
 
Have to point out again, this is the clearest sounding headphone i've heard now. And that's just with a Clip+! It's not just due to any of that extra treble non-sense and still has good bass, including sub-bass. That dip in the mids somewhere is gone too.
 
The Clip+ seems almost made for the 8400. No external amp required, but volume needs to be at 95-100%. Could probably drain the battery in under a few hours!

 

[Angular Mo]

Custom Cable Replacements ?
 
Can one replace the cables with standard 3.5mm cable, or a fancy custome-made one?
 
The locking mechanism concerns me, and I am not sure whether I want to be locked into KRK KNS as the exclusive cable replacement supplier.
 
I am also considering these for portable use, commuting via train.

 

[tdockweiler]

Quote:

Custom Cable Replacements ?
 
Can one replace the cables with standard 3.5mm cable, or a fancy custome-made one?
 
The locking mechanism concerns me, and I am not sure whether I want to be locked into KRK KNS as the exclusive cable replacement supplier.
 
I am also considering these for portable use, commuting via train.

 
Unfortunately it's a 2.5mm cable on the end that locks in place. You could make one with this connection and it might work, but I doubt it.
The only option is to solder a new cable directly to the headphone drivers and make it dual entry.

 

[bearmann]

Hey hey,
 
could u guys do me a favor and try some dubstep on those KRKs?
 
Like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KDqg7y2iEo
 
How good are they in reproducing the low end? Is there still punch in the (sub) bass?
 
Thanks a lot!
 
bearmann

 

[tdockweiler]

Quote:

Hey hey,
 
could u guys do me a favor and try some dubstep on those KRKs?
 
Like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KDqg7y2iEo
 
How good are they in reproducing the low end? Is there still punch in the (sub) bass?
 
Thanks a lot!
 
bearmann

 
Yes, but not much. Listening to dubstep on the KRK KNS-8400 would just make me sad. The mid-bass has no major hump and almost seems less present than the sub-bass.
It's all there, but it's sub-bass isn't as present as on my DJ100. Maybe recessed slightly. The DJ100 definitely has better sub-bass and more bass impact compared to my 8400.
Strangely this song makes my KRK seem almost like an open headphone.
 
Now the thing to figure out is which headphone is more accurate for this song...i'm going to say the KRK. Not sure if you need accuracy.
 
Unrelated note:
 
It's seems the Clip+ is a tad warmer sounding than my ODAC > Headroom Micro Amp. Didn't realize this until I used my KRKs with it. Love the 8400 with the Clip+ for some reason.

 

[tdockweiler]

Someone want to take one for the team and do the felt removal mod? Maybe perhaps if you're one that doesn't use it much and wish it had a bit more bass? No it doesn't make them bass heavy! Closer to my idea of neutral.
 
All it takes is removal of the felt on the back of the driver with a tiny square of bounty. The entire magnet. I think this is what holds back the bass and the sound.
 
It's much less thin, a lot clearer and with a better soundstage (no idea how). Even the treble is smoothed out. Maybe it was over-dampened to begin with? I'm sure KRK knew about every little thing inside and what it did to the sound.
Right now it seems flatter than my modded HD-600, Q701 and DJ100. I would say it's probably close in sound to my modded HD-600! Just ignore the idea of what the HD-600 sounds like or you'll get the wrong impression

The modded 8400 sounds like a much fuller sounding Q701 with slightly smoother treble. The soundstage sounds like a semi-open headphone with the right music.
I actually think the modded 8400 is even more detailed and clearer than the Q701. Maybe even better bass.
 
You ever have a headphone you listen to so much and keep telling yourself you can't believe how good it sounds? That only happened with me for two headphones so far.
I get that with my Q701 sometimes. Maybe with the modded HD-580. With my DJ100 it's every time I listen to it

It's usually when my ears are telling my brain the headphones signature is perfect.
 
I think someone really needs to measure these modded and compare them with something more high end like the the SRH-1840 or whatever.
I was thinking of sending a pair to Purrin or Tyll if they're interested in measuring them. I swear that if they don't measure flat or close, then i'll retire from all this non-sense because my ears are no good.
I think the treble now would even be OK for someone sensitive to treble. Previously they were more treble happy than the Q701, but not now. About the same or a little less.
 
I think with a stupid simple 5 minute mod the issues some people have with them can be fixed. I just don't know if people will like the resulting sound as much as I do.
 
BTW they sound very similar with my Headroom Micro Amp and ODAC as they do with my Clip+. The Clip+ makes them a tad warmer it seems, which is perfect. Not a huge difference. Obviously the ODAC improves them in a few other areas, but very minor differences.
 
Oh yeah...the KRK KNS-8400 is not analytical at all now. Very balanced and still musical.
 
OK off to try these with Skyrim..

 

[msz87]

tdock, how do you like your 240Studio? I see some very cheap, I've always wanted a pair of 240s's. at $115 I dont think I can go wrong, sorry to sidetrack, was just looking at your headphones.


Im a bit surprised these krk headphones are good, would you say they give out a neutral uncolored sound? Or are they hyped in some way. ?

 

[tdockweiler]

Quote:

tdock, how do you like your 240Studio? I see some very cheap, I've always wanted a pair of 240s's. at $115 I dont think I can go wrong, sorry to sidetrack, was just looking at your headphones.


Im a bit surprised these krk headphones are good, would you say they give out a neutral uncolored sound? Or are they hyped in some way. ?

 
I haven't listened to the K240 Studio in maybe a year or more for more than 10 minutes. I always loved them and they have very good mids. They were a bit bassy out of the box, but not so much now. They still do have a mid-bass hump which is nice sometimes.
They still get my vote as one of the best headphones under $100. They're close to being dark I think.
 
The KRK 8400 is very good, but some think they're too thin or analytical. What kept me from using them more than 50% of the time is just that. My DJ100 and Q701 are much fuller sounding. Mine was quite close to being bass light without a tad bit too much treble.
The mids on my 8400 were a bit laid back somewhat in comparison to the 6400.
 
BTW I just used a test tone generator on my 8400 and I swear I felt 3hz. Impossible right? My DJ100 was even better yet the specifications show them to be 10-25,000
On my Q701 my drivers were sounding like they were moving or something, but the bass didn't seem to kick in until 10hz.