[AustinValentine]

Using the Frequency Response chart from InnerFidelity to illustrate this: 
 

 
If you look at the raw curves (the five grey curves), you can see just how much the sub-bass response of the DT250-250 varies based on positioning and fit - especially at 40hz and below. Fit and seal are especially finicky with the type of velour pads used by this headphone. The unique shape of the side of each person's skull and mandibular socket alone means that the subjective experience of sub-bass presence with this headphone is going to vary pretty wildly from user to user. 

 

[Mjolnir125]

  I heard tight punchy mid-bass on the 250Ohm version amped. Subass? No.

To me the DT250 has pretty strong sub bass, but I guess it depends what you are comparing it to. Also, different batches of these headphones sound incredibly different; the first pair I got had much different treble and sounded a bit more V shaped overall.

 

[headwhacker]

 
To me the DT250 has pretty strong sub bass, but I guess it depends what you are comparing it to. Also, different batches of these headphones sound incredibly different; the first pair I got had much different treble and sounded a bit more V shaped overall.

 
True, compared to a T1 or HE-400i the DT250 has weak sub bass. 

 

[Hairspray]

   
True, compared to a T1 or HE-400i the DT250 has weak sub bass. 

 
the 250-250 has neither strong nor weak sub-bass, mid-bass, or what else..
it is neutral
not the "most" neutral (that wouldn't make sense)
just neutral
neither fun nor boring
it's a totally underrated headphone of the very highest calibre

 

[markanini]

Neutral can mean different things to different people on this forum. Some still associate the term with lean bass and forward mids, based on how headphones with such characteristics measured flat on a diffuse field graph. This however has nothing to do with perceptual neutrality, as reserch by Sean Olive has shown. Current leaders in neutrality, such as Focal Spirit Pro, do in fact have more bass, in quantity and depth, than DT250-250.

 

[AustinValentine]

  Neutral can mean different things to different people on this forum. Some still associate the term with lean bass and forward mids, based on how headphones with such characteristics measured flat on a diffuse field graph. This however has nothing to do with perceptual neutrality, as reserch by Sean Olive has shown. Current leaders in neutrality, such as Focal Spirit Pro, do in fact have more bass, in quantity and depth, than DT250-250.

 
Debating the nature of neutrality is pretty elliptical. Even for all of it's "neutrality", even the FSP has a slightly forward presence region. In that way, the FSP and DT250-250 are more similar than alike. The DT250-250 has a slight mid-forward tilt and a low bass roll off, which is part of what makes the bass seem thin at times. 
 
That's all just frequency response though. The FSP does a few other things slightly better than the DT250-250 too - speed and timbre in particular. The Beyer also sounds slightly grainy compared to the FSP. 
 
Now, if only the FSP had as the DT250-250's build quality...

 

[Hairspray]

  Current leaders in neutrality, such as Focal Spirit Pro, do in fact have more bass, in quantity and depth, than DT250-250.

 
current leaders? who can improve neutrality?
 
anyway, if you compare speakers (flatness) with headphones (neutrality), the HP's FR could in fact be improved

 

[markanini]

   
current leaders? who can improve neutrality?
 
anyway, if you compare speakers (flatness) with headphones (neutrality), the HP's FR could in fact be improved

Its not as simple as that. Speakers are flat in an anechoic room. A pair of headphones that targeted that wouldn't be pleasant sounding. Neutral phones should sound like a real listening environment. 

 

[NoOneLt]

Hi everyone!
 
Read 50 pages of the thread and placed an order for DT-250-250, need some closed can's at work. It seems to have around 85% positive response here, and seems to have no competition at this price point.
 
Hope this is true

 

[markanini]

Many headphones have a similar percentage of favourable review. These do a warm overall signature, mid-bumped and rolled-off lows. If that's what you like you're in luck, if not you're ****ed.

 

[NoOneLt]

All of this hi-fi stuff is a route of trials and errors... From what i've read here i want to try them at least.
 
Anyway they will either impress me either.. I don't think it could be so bad

 

[bias]

I just purchased a slightly used pair of these based on this thread and other reviews from the web as well as anectodal admiration from other sound engineers and I agree, these are the real deal. The FR from octave to octave is so smooth and the mid-range so uncolored that I think it's safe to say that they can be used as a reference point from which to gauge other transducers or amps, DACs.

Absolutely the best deal in headphones currently as far as I'm concerned. They just don't do anything all that wrong, which is an incredible accomplishment for a headphone design...at any price. But at $170? Total steal.

What's almost more amazing than it's lack of coloration for a set of headphones (it's easier to get non-colored, smooth reference FR sound from loudspeakers which is why there isn't as much difference from pair to pair as there is with regards to headphones) is the sense of space that these cans provide to the listener. I don't know how this is accomplished (very rigrous driver to driver pairing along with a non-resonant earcup?), but they sound more "speaker-like" as if the sound is emanating from drivers further away from your ears. In this regard they best my HD-600s which is still the typical headphone reference for mixing or mastering engineers. They are also less colored than the HD-600s.

If you're addicted to buying headphones and are ready to get help, buy a pair. It'll be your last. Then sell your inventory and buy an Eames lounge chair and consider yourself cured. And lucky to have found this thread.

 

[AustinValentine]

I just purchased a slightly used pair of these based on this thread and other reviews from the web as well as anectodal admiration from other sound engineers and I agree, these are the real deal. The FR from octave to octave is so smooth and the mid-range so uncolored that I think it's safe to say that they can be used as a reference point from which to gauge other transducers or amps, DACs.

Absolutely the best deal in headphones currently as far as I'm concerned. They just don't do anything all that wrong, which is an incredible accomplishment for a headphone design...at any price. But at $170? Total steal.

What's almost more amazing than it's lack of coloration for a set of headphones (it's easier to get non-colored, smooth reference FR sound from loudspeakers which is why there isn't as much difference from pair to pair as there is with regards to headphones) is the sense of space that these cans provide to the listener. I don't know how this is accomplished (very rigrous driver to driver pairing along with a non-resonant earcup?), but they sound more "speaker-like" as if the sound is emanating from drivers further away from your ears. In this regard they best my HD-600s which is still the typical headphone reference for mixing or mastering engineers. They are also less colored than the HD-600s.

If you're addicted to buying headphones and are ready to get help, buy a pair. It'll be your last. Then sell your inventory and buy an Eames lounge chair and consider yourself cured. And lucky to have found this thread.

 
Glad that you like them! 

 

 

[bias]

Very much, thanks again Mr. V!

 

[CJG888]

I believe their main professional role is the monitoring of voice broadcasts - hence the mid-centric focus.

If you like LS3/5As, you should like these.

Another advantage is that they can be used with OTL tube amps (250 ohm version).