[ClieOS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by qusp /img/forum/go_quote.gif why would I realize that I was wrong just because of some promotional material from UE's own site??

Now I am confused.... It isn't just UE's website material, there are tons of review (including those jinx20001 posted earlier) that point out the dual receiver low freq. driver used in TF10 (and UE10, UE11). I am sure you mix up your info somewhere.

 

[qusp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClieOS /img/forum/go_quote.gif Now I am confused.... It isn't just UE's website material, there are tons of review (including those jinx20001 posted earlier) that point out the dual receiver low freq. driver used in TF10 (and UE10, UE11). I am sure you mix up your info somewhere.

yeah thats all id bothered to read at that point but I really douldn't find anything that said anything that made me think there was any 'three way action'

going on here. on anything but the UE11 of course the westone ES3 has had it for a while now bit not many people talk about them because they really are designed for the pro musician rather than the 'audiophile'

 

[qusp]

the thing is though that these are all articles that are written by magazines who have been given items to review. this doesn't bode well for objectivity. and as to 2 way and 3 way designs you dont have to talk about IEM's you can find real dictionary definitions more than likely if you look. but instead all tere has been is phaff. i found something on wikipedia just before to back my argument up, but I dont think of them as a legitimate source; I know my lecturers never did. so I didn't quote them word for word just used my own words backed up with the knowledge that I was correct. by reading that amongst other things through my years as an amateur music producer. I dont see whats so hard to understand. unless UE have all of a sudden changed their technology and kept quiet about it; even while westone is in the uncomfortable situation where if someone does do it before them while they have been in development for the last 18months they could be a bit discredited. if you were UE wouldn't you be making some noise about it?? even with the release of all the new range not a word of the change.

 

[jinx20001]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClieOS /img/forum/go_quote.gif Your argument about the crossover is really stretching too far. If a speaker has three transducer and one handles treble, one handles mid, while the last one handles bass, what will you call it? Three ways of course!!! .

ladies...really.

no this is where ultimate ears is pulling your leg. there are 2 bass speakers in the triple fi, just like the shure se530 allegidly...now what ultimate ears does infact tell us is that the midrange goes through the same driver as the bass. so you see the bass and the midrange is not seperate, even ultimate ears tells us this, so therfor the midrange does not have its own dedicated driver like say the ue11, so it is not 3 way.

anyway theres no point in me saying it over and over. heres an idea, why dont you just create a thread asking if the triple fi is 3 way or not?? dont take my word for it, 99% of head fi'ers will tell you just the same as me. i wont create a thread asking this question because im already 110% sure it isnt 3 way, but im sure head fi'ers will be happy to put your mind at rest lol.

i cant believe we are bickering about it, i thought everybody knew it was 2 way

 

[jinx20001]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClieOS /img/forum/go_quote.gif Now I am confused.... It isn't just UE's website material, there are tons of review (including those jinx20001 posted earlier) that point out the dual receiver low freq. driver used in TF10 (and UE10, UE11). I am sure you mix up your info somewhere.

the triple fi does indeed use dual low frequency drivers, the problem is those drivers handle midrange also, not low midrange, all of the midrange, this is why i keep saying the triple fi does not have dedicated low drivers like the shures, the shures do have dedicated low drivers because the midrange goes to the tweeter instead.

 

[Elluzion]

i think i need some comply foams to try with the tripples..... see what difference they make..

does anyone have an extra medium pair they are willing to let go for a starving college student (me) to try?

i'll pay shipping

 

[jinx20001]

Quote:

Originally Posted by qusp /img/forum/go_quote.gif if you were UE wouldn't you be making some noise about it?? even with the release of all the new range not a word of the change.

a very good point, if the triple fi were indeed 3 way, my gosh why dont UE just say these are 3 way earphones?? because thats one wicked selling point.

i mean everyone is hyped about the westone 3 exactly because they are boasting 3 way earphones

 

[hockeyb213]

wait lol so is the tf10's a 3 way or 2 way? I wish someone would just open them and look to end this discussion about it.....or just ask UE I would honestly not be surprised if they were but idk

 

[ClieOS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by qusp /img/forum/go_quote.gif ...you say its not a shure, UE, westone thing but you sure seem to be spending a lot of timne and effort trying to trawl through the interweb for 'facts' to prove that UE's is a 3 way design; ive had enough

Read back my posts, mate. I have never insisted in any of my post that TF10 MUST be three-ways - I am merely pointing out the the internal design of TF10 has the technical capability of being three-ways (and UE seems to claim so themselves). In fact, my first post (post #14, which replied to Jinx's comment, post #13) is more about the technical issue related to how you can split the sound over one dual receiver driver, and you can extend the same conclusion to SE530 (and a conclusion Jinx acknowledged himself, post #28).

The reason I seem to spend a lot of time crawling through the Internet is rather simple: I am interested in all thing IEM. If you haven't notice, I have spent quite a lot of time researching IEM related info. and wrote the only IEM guide in Head-fi (beside multiple IEM reviews). You might think I am being fanboy here, but that's just your opinion.


Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx20001 /img/forum/go_quote.gif anyway theres no point in me saying it over and over. heres an idea, why dont you just create a thread asking if the triple fi is 3 way or not?? dont take my word for it, 99% of head fi'ers will tell you just the same as me. i wont create a thread asking this question because im already 110% sure it isnt 3 way, but im sure head fi'ers will be happy to put your mind at rest lol.

A thread that draw public opinion won't help us find out the truth. The discussion here has nothing to do with public opinion, but more about science and the actual crossover circuit design. Unless those who commented has all cracked open their TF10 and studied the crossover, I doubt that personal impressions and opinions we gathered will make any difference.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx20001 /img/forum/go_quote.gif the triple fi does indeed use dual low frequency drivers, the problem is those drivers handle midrange also, not low midrange, all of the midrange, this is why i keep saying the triple fi does not have dedicated low drivers like the shures, the shures do have dedicated low drivers because the midrange goes to the tweeter instead.

We have been through this discussion before (post #13 to #28), Jinx. Is it possible to split the sound b/w dual receivers driver? Yes. Does UE claim that TF10 is three ways? Seem like it. Do any of us are expert enough to know the actual design of TF10's crossover? No.

You seem to be very sure about TF10 being a two ways, but you never did show us any direct proof besides your theory of how those BA drivers are / can be used. I am here to provide a bit of counter argument - to point out that your theory has its weaknesses (dual receiver drivers can be split, different way of crossover design beyond the circuit board).

Lets forget about TF10 for now and pretend the whole discussion is about Shure claiming SE530as three-ways on their website. If you should make the same argument using your theory to disprove SE530 for being three-ways, I will most certainly make the same counter argument agian - that it is technically feasible to do so and the company has make a point about it.

You conclusion about TF10 maybe true, but it is based on a fragile theory. It is the theory that I am interested in discussion, not the brand of the IEM in question.
Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx20001 /img/forum/go_quote.gif i mean everyone is hyped about the westone 3 exactly because they are boasting 3 way earphones

Everyone here is hyped about Westone 3 has more or less to do with the fact that Westone has always been very close to our forum (= the users), and we have been kept informed all the way since the first announcement two years ago (plus Ray's early impression certainly helps too). That is something UE, and a lot of other companies, have never being good at (keeping the users close, that is).

Quote:

Originally Posted by hockeyb213 /img/forum/go_quote.gif wait lol so is the tf10's a 3 way or 2 way? I wish someone would just open them and look to end this discussion about it.....or just ask UE I would honestly not be surprised if they were but idk

A valid suggestion, I must say.

 

[qusp]

this is schroedinger's cat all over again. why bother talking about the possibility of what something could do if indeed it was set up the way you theorize it to be? seems to waste an inordinate amount of time UNLESS you crack it open. I suggest you do so; in order to prove everyone here on head-fi that has written on the subject wrong, you do indeed need to provide some proof. That proof does not come in the way of cleverly worded promotional or advertorial matter, but rather independent sources for the moment though; i'm happy to agree to disagree. and without a 3way crossover it will never be a 3 way system, instead it could be a hybrid 2 way system, the same way they started using dual processors in computers. there were 2 processors there, but they weren't working in parallel, instead they were working together on the same problem/instructions. and sharing the same memory.

 

[ClieOS]

I suggest you do so instead: In order to prove everyone here on head-fi that has written on the subject right, some one does indeed need to provide some proof. I am sure in hell not rich enough to crack open mine, would you do the honor and find one to crack open?

Maybe we should choose the alternative and ask UE to answer the question once and for all, as suggested by hockeyb213 (or maybe UE is rich enough to crack one open for us? You never know....

)

 

[hockeyb213]

it would make a lot of sense to me why it sounds the way it does if the had it split 3 ways but idk what to say

 

[hockeyb213]

according to what UE has on their site I am calling them out on a 3 way crossover and if they don't they have a lie on their website then

I will post what it says on their page.

Housed within the universal body are three individual speakers and an integrated passive crossover circuit board that directs the low-end frequencies to a dedicated speaker for bass, the mid-range frequencies to a speaker for the vocals and the high frequencies to a speaker dedicated for treble.

The changeable ear tips provide -26dB of isolation and passive noise cancellation.

 

[jinx20001]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hockeyb213 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Housed within the universal body are three individual speakers and an integrated passive crossover circuit board that directs the low-end frequencies to a dedicated speaker for bass, the mid-range frequencies to a speaker for the vocals and the high frequencies to a speaker dedicated for treble. .

ok right lets settle this... read that paragraph back very very carefully. notice how it says they use a speaker that is dedicated to bass and a speaker that is dedicated to highs but they dont say the midrange has a dedicated speaker, they just say a speaker for mids, and this speaker is the bass speakers believe it or not.

and just to settle this im going to email ultimate ears and ask them exactly how it works, 2 way or 3 way. if i get an email i will post it here quoting who sent it to me from ultimate ears. last time i emailed them i never ever received a reply, im going to tell them im about to purchase them but want to know more about them.

 

[qusp]

also notice that it doesn't say it has an integrated 3 way passive crossover; but instead just an integrated passive crossover. that was the cleverly worded material I was talking about before when it was quoted. they stop just short of saying it has a 3 way crossover .... because it doesn't. They bother to say its a passive circuit but not how many ways; I bet you find on the UE11 page they do mention it though. unless they are trying to present it as a 4 way crossover