[nanaholic]

I accept that the properties of the chassis of a DAP can change the sound, but the anodized black color on the ZX300 will probaly make a very little difference in the resistance which would result in a inaudible change. I am totally fine with things getting explained properly and in a electronic way, but I have just had enough of like snake oil stuff in my life so I want like actually facts about stuff.

To me there's enough chemical/electrical workings here to say that perhaps an electrical difference is there and a test can probably be formulated to prove this hypothesis (chassis grounding is an accepted electrical circuit theory and practice, and anodizing causes a non-conducting layer of film to form on the material surface is also a chemical fact etc), so I won't say this is on the snake oil level of other things like green makers and quantum stickers.

 

[TenderTendon]

To further explain Sato-san's hypothesis that the colour coating makes a difference, they talked about the process of "alumite" in the video.
http://www.nacl.co.jp/en/alumite/

While the Japanese refers to this as alumite, the closest to our English understanding is the process of anodizing:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anodizing

TL;DR - it's a process which artificially increases the oxide ("rust" - if you must) film on the surface of the metal in order to protect the bare metal underneath. Metals such as aluminium has a natural oxide film on the surface but it is still common to anodize it further to increase this film to a thicker thickness to increase protection and/or to use the pores introduced in the process to inject colour (such as in the case of the black version). As said the anodizing process is literally introducing oxide ("rust") to surface of the metal and thus decreases its conductivity and purity, and in the case of the silver vs black of the ZX300 the anodizing in the black version is much thicker in order to take on the colour, thus with the internals being the same and the chassis ground property being different (the thicker oxide film of the black version causes the chassis ground to have a slightly higher resistance than the silver version, thus venturing off from the ideal ground that the chassis is suppose to provide), they speculate that is the cause of the sound difference.

If you believe in purity of copper cables affecting the sound (which many cable believer will buy into straight away - that's why they insist on OFC cables, no?), this doesn't seem like that far fetch of a hypothesis.

I think the 1A, 1Z and 300 are great players, but this is nothing but marketing BS in my opinion. The signal ground path is the ground plane on the circuit board. It is copper and has a much lower resistance than the aluminum chassis, raw or anodized. No signal current passes through the aluminum chassis or its anodic layer. There is no LOGICAL reason that the player would sound ANY different with the mainboard mounted in a black anodized chassis, a silver anodized chassis or removed from chassis and sitting on a rubber pad. Flame away....

 

[TenderTendon]

could be the letter A that makes the differences.

Yes, it was. They added it to the database. Changing the destination on the 300A only gets you more language options though, as high gain and remote control are already enabled.

 

[nanaholic]

I think the 1A, 1Z and 300 are great players, but this is nothing but marketing BS in my opinion. The signal ground path is the ground plane on the circuit board. It is copper and has a much lower resistance than the aluminum chassis, raw or anodized. No signal current passes through the aluminum chassis or its anodic layer. There is no LOGICAL reason that the player would sound ANY different with the mainboard mounted in a black anodized chassis, a silver anodized chassis or removed from chassis and sitting on a rubber pad. Flame away....

Again, you should start researching on chassis ground and grounding techniques first before making this statement.

Chassis grounding is actually a very important technique in circuit design - there is an entire school of electrical theory teaching how to properly ground equipment depending on the usage.

EDIT: you can start reading here regarding the difference between the signal ground and chassis ground in audio application. http://www.rane.com/note151.html

This is also a good read on fundamentals of grounding:
https://dce.mst.edu/media/extendedl...d How to Ground Electrical Systems Ground.pdf

 

[TenderTendon]

Again, you should start researching on chassis ground and grounding techniques first before making this statement.

Chassis grounding is actually a very important technique in circuit design - there is an entire school of electrical theory teaching how to properly ground equipment depending on the usage.

EDIT: you can start reading here regarding the difference between the signal ground and chassis ground in audio application. http://www.rane.com/note151.html

I know plenty about the subject. I have worked on a lot of modern audio equipment and find their performance exactly the same mounted in the chassis or removed on the bench. Almost all of this theory you speak of is related to isolating AC noise and consumer safety. I still build vacuum tube amps, and grounding is an art there. It has little to no effect on low voltage DC powered devices. Now if you are talking about shielding, that's an entirely different subject. Again, looking for some logic, not quotes from and links to people selling the oil.

 

[kms108]

Yes, it was. They added it to the database. Changing the destination on the 300A only gets you more language options though, as high gain and remote control are already enabled.

glad it works for you, i'm still wanting for my zx300 from japan, I will also need to change location, and when it comes to command on PC, i'm useless.

 

[TenderTendon]

EDIT: you can start reading here regarding the difference between the signal ground and chassis ground in audio application. http://www.rane.com/note151.html

This is also a good read on fundamentals of grounding:
https://dce.mst.edu/media/extendedlearning/dce/documents/facetofacecourses/Why and How to Ground Electrical Systems Ground.pdf

Both of these links are focused on grounding practices for isolating AC supplies and safety. Has nothing to do with what we are discussing.

 

[psikey]

Can't wait till you try the balanced out, but you're making me glad I ordered one. Of course I ordered black so it might not sound as good And removing the cap and setting to high gain will definitely add more power not just volume which will add more headroom and improve sound overall.

And a lot of people are calling the SE output warm, is it like x5iii warm? Because the bass and mids are prominent on a35 but overall I don't think it sounds warm.

X5iii sounded warmer to me but suppose it's also down to synergy with ear/headphones. Sounds excellent to me with my SE846's even without burn-in or balanced so should only get better.

Just seems to work perfectly as DAC unlike Fiio.

 

[psikey]

To me there's enough chemical/electrical workings here to say that perhaps an electrical difference is there and a test can probably be formulated to prove this hypothesis (chassis grounding is an accepted electrical circuit theory and practice, and anodizing causes a non-conducting layer of film to form on the material surface is also a chemical fact etc), so I won't say this is on the snake oil level of other things like green makers and quantum stickers.

If it's that critical to micron thickness anodising then it's going to have big change between sweaty or dry hands!! Sounds not correct to me.

 

[Raketen]

*edit**snark filter engaged*politeness mode=1

 

[abitdeef]

*edit**snark filter engaged*

 

[Partlys4int]

To further explain Sato-san's hypothesis that the colour coating makes a difference, they talked about the process of "alumite" in the video.
http://www.nacl.co.jp/en/alumite/

While the Japanese refers to this as alumite, the closest to our English understanding is the process of anodizing:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anodizing

TL;DR - it's a process which artificially increases the oxide ("rust" - if you must) film on the surface of the metal in order to protect the bare metal underneath. Metals such as aluminium has a natural oxide film on the surface but it is still common to anodize it further to increase this film to a thicker thickness to increase protection and/or to use the pores introduced in the process to inject colour (such as in the case of the black version). As said the anodizing process is literally introducing oxide ("rust") to surface of the metal and thus decreases its conductivity and purity, and in the case of the silver vs black of the ZX300 the anodizing in the black version is much thicker in order to take on the colour, thus with the internals being the same and the chassis ground property being different (the thicker oxide film of the black version causes the chassis ground to have a slightly higher resistance than the silver version, thus venturing off from the ideal ground that the chassis is suppose to provide), they speculate that is the cause of the sound difference.

If you believe in purity of copper cables affecting the sound (which many cable believer will buy into straight away - that's why they insist on OFC cables, no?), this doesn't seem like that far fetch of a hypothesis.

So, in other words: the WM1-A also has slightly lesser sound than could have been achieved if it were silver?

 

[abitdeef]

So, in other words: the WM1-A also has slightly lesser sound than could have been achieved if it were silver?

The electrons in the silver aluminum atoms excite more thus giving you a brighter and more exciting sound. That's my theory and I'm sticking to it.

I want what Sony's engineers are smoking.

 

[Mathieulh]

The electrons in the silver aluminum atoms excite more thus giving you a brighter and more exciting sound. That's my theory and I'm sticking to it.

I want what Sony's engineers are smoking.

I have a much better and likely snake oil theory!

I believe that because darker surfaces absorb more infrared (non ionizing) radiations (heat), the black version gets slightly warmer, this in turn because of the materials expansion phenomena will cause temporary distortions (of at least a couple of nanometers!) to the aluminum chassis which will in turn cause a different sound signature!
(well technically it would cause more changes to the sound signature than the few extra nanoohms (yes, not even microohms) of added resistance to the chassis that come out of the increased anodizing on the black version, that said so would your hands, your jacket pocket, casing, moisture/sweat....)
Of course I never mentioned how great or (in)significant these changes (or lackthereof) are.

 

[Thesonofkrypton]

Just got my silver zx300 from Amazon. Liked what I heard on a quick listen, although as others have stated, volume needed to be cranked up for the SE output I tried. Will have to uncap it tomorrow and listen again. At first, I thought the system/touchscreen was a bit slow, but I guess coming from using an iPhone touchscreen, it's not going to compare. Do like the silver finish and buttons, it's the perfect size and weight to carry about. Sits in the palm comfortably and that matte screen is gorgeous. Will need to shop about for a nice set of over ear headphones to go with it.