[kumar402]

DSEE.....just....why?

$3k on a DAP and you use a lossy/ mp3 source? In the age of streaming and $200 terabyte 'thisonethatone' SD cards...

I think DSEE works for CD quality as well

 

[boodi]

Dsee was meant for mp3 and not for cd quality audio files : in the beginnings of its life.

Now that it has evolved ( there are different versions of it too) Sony says it may not mean a difference if applied to hi-res audio playback - I agree , I am not always able to hear the difference on an hi-res format file. I do for almost or nearly any 44.1khz I play though . The added dynamic range , instruments contour , vibrance and definition on a large majority of files in this format is welcome as a less linear option , I would guess many producer would hear it and eventually agree on a major engagement ( different flavor if you wish ) as a result -for many files and different music genres too. Of course one can prefer the 'raw' base 44.1khz sampling and switch to his preference..

 

[boodi]

- listening" Over , Humming and Mourning Air" a sequence from Portishead self titled album
hires 96khz/24bits , dsee on and off


first is a very simple tune with a synth/dirt mesh bass line that aims at recreating a gritty floor under a subtle thrill scare on which the singer' slowly walks on unwinding the lyrics
second track has similar mesh and effects and is a bit more dynamic and active , following the texts mood
third is a more intimate and more hopeful tune/lyr
in both first cases , background sounds blacker with dsee on ; in both cases the highs are cleaner with dsee on ; the claustrophic feeling is conveyed millimetrically better with dsee
but, in first song : the guitar at the end of the track sounds more open without dsee . not sure if it is a plus or a minus. but .

in the third track admittedly the blacker background makes still for a more intimate feeling , in this case I can't prefer this version to the very slightly airier and more open non-dsee version which is ultimately more emotive.. the dsee version is really not much different too .. but.

subtlities, but,
the choice is there .


disclaimers : my ears , ymmv , placebo brain adaptation etc

 

[boodi]

after last 2 weeks listenings with the updated 1.07 DSEE on , I'd say that it is more dynamic in contrasts , blacker , slightly more focused , it separates parts better then vanilla . it makes for a slightly less airy feeling at times too , It is not more natural but rather helps some tracks conveying their music sense faster : depending on recordings; the default ( dsee off ) is more relaxed ;dsee makes for a more easily engaging sound vs the flatter linear vanilla signature ; it is also because vocals and some solos are often more forward and center with it , which is quite good for many listenings and genres when volumes and gain are low enough i.e. .. ymmv .

while it's been on alltime lately I see myself switching it on or off depending on day mood needs and music

 

[boodi]

I installed the 1.08 Beta Firmware

Where / How?

 

[The1Signature]

Where / How?

he is just kidding - soundstage triples with every minor security update

 

[boodi]

Vamp (she) just kidding on Sony Walkmans'
Ah!, never going to habit

 

[Sonywalkmanuser]

Output Impedance:
WM1ZM2 Balanced: 1.2ohms
WM1ZM2 Single Ended: 0.6ohms
ZX707 Balanced: 2.4ohms
ZX707 Single Ended: 1.2ohms
ZX507 Balanced: 2.4ohms
ZX507 Single Ended: 1.2ohms
A306 Single Ended: 2.1ohms
A105 Single Ended: 2.1ohms

 

[Whitigir]

Output Impedance:
WM1ZM2 Balanced: 1.2ohms
WM1ZM2 Single Ended: 0.6ohms
ZX707 Balanced: 2.4ohms
ZX707 Single Ended: 1.2ohms
ZX507 Balanced: 2.4ohms
ZX507 Single Ended: 1.2ohms
A306 Single Ended: 2.1ohms
A105 Single Ended: 2.1ohms

Balanced is double of SE, due to the Full Bridge VS Half Bridge implementation of the amp architecture. Additionally, SE has it own dedicated amp circuitry which is not shared with Balanced out. Thanks for finding out the precise measurements

 

[Sonywalkmanuser]

DeepL AI Langauge Translation of the 2018 Vinyl Processor Article by Sony:
https://www.sony.jp/feature/products/vinyl/

Sony Video & Sound Products Corporation
V&S Division: Product Design Department
Takashi Kanai

Takashi Kanai, also known as Kanaimaru, a legend in the Sony and Japanese audio world, passed away on July 2, 2022

https://xtrend.nikkei.com/atcl/contents/18/00157/00140/


Digital reproduction of acoustic effects unique to analogue records Vinyl Processor" to feel the richness and expanse of sound.

In recent years, not only old-time audiophiles but also younger fans of the digital generation have begun to hear that "analogue records sound good too". In this context, Sony products began to incorporate the Vinyl Processor in autumn 2018, which scientifically reproduces the acoustic phenomenon of analogue record playback that makes music sound more pleasing to the ear. A veteran Sony engineer, who has been dealing with 'sound' for a long time, talks about its true high sound quality, which is not mere nostalgia.

More and more people are saying that analogue records sound good these days: ......
Why is that?

First of all, can you tell us what a 'vinyl processor' is?
Kanai: "Analogue record reproduction has a unique acoustic phenomenon that makes music sound enjoyable and good, which is reproduced using DSP technology". Analogue records are made from the original digital data or analogue master tapes, but there is always physical deterioration in the process. Specifically, for example, a typical analogue record may not have a playback bandwidth of 20 kHz. Relatively loud noise and needle noise are added, and left-right separation is not good. Various distortions such as tracking and tracing errors also occur.
Digital music reproduction does not have these degradations. That's why people say 'digital has a better sound'. Recently, however, more and more people are asking, "Don't analogue records sound good too?" However, an increasing number of people are asking: "Aren't analogue records also good sounding? Why is that?

Well, it can only be assumed that "something good" is happening when analogue records are played back. Physically, it is no longer the same as the source, but musically, the change is not necessarily a deterioration, and there is a secret to making the music more enjoyable to listen to.
One thing that has always been clear is that it's because the cartridge is behaving and sounding like a musical instrument. But I believe that is only one of many reasons. Cartridges do footnote music, but that's not the essence of it.
With the Vinyl Processor, I have focused on and reproduced three more fundamental acoustic phenomena that I have seen as prevailing throughout my years of design.

Can you tell us more about these three acoustic phenomena?

KANAI: Yes, the first is low-frequency resonance in the tone arm (tone arm resonance). The tone arm of a record player rides on the record disc via the needle, but it is not firmly fixed in place because of the rubber between the needle and the arm. The rubber acts like a spring, so the tone arm resonates up and down throughout playback, and its minute vibration waveforms are included in the playback waveform. This frequency band is around 10 Hz. The sound is inaudible to the human ear, but the speaker responds well. The level is small, but it's pulling back and forth.

Resonance occurs in the tone arm with the rubber supporting the needle tip as a spring. The resonance frequency is low at around 10 Hz, but the level is relatively high at around -30 dB (upper right diagram). However, as shown in the diagram below right, the frequency is so low that it is usually neither visible nor audible.

What happens when this happens?
KANAI: Like in speakers and headphone units, edges and dampers are held in static friction when there is no sound. It is not easy for them to move even when minute sounds enter them. Not only at the beginning of movement, but also when the musical signal is small, movement is generally poor. The performance of this ease of movement at the beginning of movement is called 'initial sensitivity', and high-end speakers spend a lot of money to improve this.

However, when the arm's low-frequency resonance is introduced, the unit is constantly moving. The initial response area is lost. It's called 'wobbling' and is a technical element that was once used to improve the accuracy of CD player servos, but it has the effect of increasing initial sensitivity without spending a lot of money. So, first of all, it improves the rise of sound and bass extension. It also improves the ability to express low-level indirect sound components, which gives a richer sense of spaciousness.

I see. So there is no preliminary movement of the unit for digital playback?
Kanai: Yes. This phenomenon improves the dynamic characteristics of the unit to such an extent that no amount of money can be spent. It is one of the main secrets of good sound with analogue record playback.

Then what is the second?
KANAI: The second is minute surface noise and scratch noise. It has been said that CDs sound good because there is no noise, but in fact noise is useful. The secret lies in the level and shape (frequency distribution) of the noise.

Is it that dusty or crackling noise?
Kanai: No, that is too loud and interrupts the music. Also, most of it is caused by dust, so in fact, if you clean it, it almost disappears. Scratches, though, can't be helped. What we focused on with the vinyl processor is a bit different noise.

The first noise on an analogue record is a circling sound. It is called surface noise. If you analyse the frequency of this noise, it has a very unique distribution: the lower the frequency, the more it rises in the lower mid-range, around 1kHz, and the higher the mid-range, the flatter it is. This is a very 'typical' noise pattern that can only be found on analogue records.

Another thing that is reproduced is a small level of scratch noise. This occurs even when the dust is cleaned, and can be heard as a 'click, crackle' when amplified, but it is usually present at a level that is not audible.

Surface noise is the sound of the surface condition of the record disc. The fine irregularities are unique depending on the condition of the record disc and other factors, but the overall tendency is for the low frequencies to rise around the mid-range and the high frequencies to be generally flat. This is a form unique to analogue records.


However, noise is noise, right?　What positive effect does that have on sound quality?
Kanai: Yes, noise is indeed noise. However, it is not just noise. First of all, it has a unique frequency distribution, but it is a really well-designed noise, which is probably the result of the ingenuity of many of our predecessors since the birth of analogue records, when they created the standard characteristics of PVC materials and amplifiers. The level is also important. If the level is too high, it is noisy and disturbing. But sometimes it is better to have it in moderation.

The vinyl processor is based on the noise that actually occurs in analogue playback, so the frequency distribution is very similar. There is also a small amount of scratchiness mixed in. But the amount of noise is lower than that of a standard vinyl record. The noise level of vinyl records differs depending on the age of the vinyl record, but the vinyl processor uses a low-noise, high-quality vinyl record made for test recordings as its standard, and sets the noise level slightly lower than that. Even so, you can still get the quality that is typical of analogue record reproduction.

How does reproducing noise affect the sound quality?
Kanai: Yes. First of all, as with tone arm resonance, the initial sensitivity of the screener and tweeter can be improved due to the minute noise components. Even in full-range units such as headphones, the initial sensitivity to the high frequency range will increase. This makes it easier to hear music components in the mid-range and high frequency range.

In fact, during the prototyping of the vinyl processor, I used it in the city and it became easier to hear vocals and cymbals in noisy environments. Music was also easier to hear even in the rushing wind noise when the air conditioning was turned on. Is it actually just the initial sensitivity, or could there be something more? Personally, I would like to do more research.

I see. ....... It is indeed strange because when I actually listen to the audios, I feel sounds that I had not noticed before. The third and final acoustic phenomenon is also of interest to me.
Kanai: The last one is record disc resonance. Record discs and record players are vibrating due to the sound pressure from the music that the music makes on the speakers. Do you think this vibration is harmful or beneficial?

Is it not harmful?
Kanai: I'm sorry to hear that. It is beneficial. Of course the vibration of a bad player is bad, but the board vibration created on a well-made player is very beneficial. The level of this vibration is actually higher than you might imagine. And it has a complex shape with a lot of peak dip. Musicality is hidden in this.

In fact, I have been helping to tune the sound of analogue players for the past few years, and the PS-HX500 player has a function for recording performances. So here's another question. When recording, do you think it's better to have sound coming out of the speakers or not? Which do you think?

Oh, you think it's better to let it out?
KANAI: That's right. Actually, we did this comparison as an afterthought when we had a certain critic listen to the PS-HX500, and he said, "I was surprised. He seemed surprised and said, "Unlike what I imagined, it's better to leave the sound on. In fact, the vibrations of the record disc created by the sound pressure have an effect similar to that of preparing food. If you were a woman, it would be like applying make-up.
In other words, the record player, the speakers and the listening room where the sound is coming from are doing the final touches to the music played on analogue records. This gives the vocals a unique emotional quality that is unique to analogue records. It also creates a kind of oneness with the performance.

Incidentally, the best playback level when recording with this player was the volume at which the player was tuned.

The vinyl record and the player that supports it vibrate under the sound pressure of the speakers. Analogue record playback is therefore listening to this vibration sound together with the musical sound.
The diagram above shows the music component output from the speaker. The volume is normal. Below is an actual recording of the output of the cartridge (i.e. the vibration of the disc) with the record disc stopped rotating (black) and reproduced by a vinyl processor (red), while the sound is played on another player.

But replacing mechanical resonance with signal processing sounds like a challenge.
Kanai: Yes. First of all, we basically adopt the sound of the board obtained from actual measurements as the teacher. In this case, we adopted the sound of the disc produced in a listening room managed by an old colleague who agreed with the function and helped us develop it. That room is driven by a 38 cm woofer, and its authentic sound is the benchmark for music reproduction for many people.

And then we replace the actual phenomenon with a transfer function, and in no time at all we had seven stages of second-order parametric equalisation. I really wanted a high Q, so much so that I asked the development department to write a new equaliser program. I then adjusted the level and Q of each parametric equaliser, which was very interesting because this process was exactly the same as tuning a record player.

PS-HX500, which has been helping with sound tuning for the past few years.

 

[denis1976]

Just look at how much more informative(at a glance) this WM1ZM2 site looks:
https://www.sonystyle.com.cn/products/media_player/nw_wm1zm2/nw_wm1zm2_feature.html

And to compare to this(how many clicks must I do?):
https://www.sony.com.sg/electronics/walkman/nw-wm1zm2

Thats why i love Sony and love the 1Zm2 , and i am absolutly sure that if it was other brand without the resources of Sony making it ,it was even much more expensive , so 5k, 7k dont scares the 1zm2 in pure SQ

 

[Sonywalkmanuser]

after this last 2 weeks listenings with the updated 1.07 DSEE on , I'd say that it is more dynamic in contrasts , blacker , slightly more focused , it separates parts better then vanilla . it makes for a slightly less airy feeling at times too , It is not more natural but rather helps some tracks conveying their music sense faster : depending on recordings; the default ( dsee off ) is more relaxed .
After passing 2 weeks with 1.07 / dsee , I would say it makes for a more easily engaging sound vs the flatter vanilla signature ; it is also because vocals and some solos are often more forward and center with it , which is quite good for many listenings and genres when volumes and gain are low enough i.e. .. ymmv .

while it's been on alltime lately I see myself switching it on or off depending on day mood needs and music

Sony designers have given us quite a lot of flexibility when it comes to sound processing options. They certainly understood that listening preferences and mood will change.

DSEE Ultimate gives engagement but isn't a good choice if you want to listen to music while studying, writing or resting etc.

DSD Remastering + slow roll off is a good choice when you want to listen to music on the walkman with a smoother sounding, non-aggressive dynamics that's free from the digital glare.

 

[CarinTorment]

Sony designers have given us quite a lot of flexibility when it comes to sound processing options. They certainly understood that listening preferences and mood will change.

DSEE Ultimate gives engagement but isn't a good choice if you want to listen to music while studying, writing or resting etc.

DSD Remastering + slow roll off is a good choice when you want to listen to music on the walkman with a smoother sounding, non-aggressive dynamics that's free from the digital glare.

Thank you very much for all the information you provide us, I love your publications, I have learned a lot from them, I hope that Google Translate does its job well, I am from Mexico and I have the wm1a and wm1am2, also the ierm7 and mdr-z7m2, and the genres I listen to are metal and rock, greetings and thank you again.

 

[Sonywalkmanuser]

Thank you very much for all the information you provide us, I love your publications, I have learned a lot from them, I hope that Google Translate does its job well, I am from Mexico and I have the wm1a and wm1am2, also the ierm7 and mdr-z7m2, and the genres I listen to are metal and rock, greetings and thank you again.

Since you own Sony headphones and Iems, have you followed my recommendation to use the Sony Headphone App to add your wired headphone and IEM profile and also to do the ear photo upload?

You have to switch profile in headphone app when you are switching between using the headphone and iem.

In my own experience, this should improve the spatial sounds, especially if you use DSEE Ultimate with High-Res Streaming On.

 

[Sonywalkmanuser]

@boodi

Words from Sony researcher, on how their AI Audio research & development is applied:

https://www.sony.com/en/SonyInfo/sony_ai/audio.html

Audio source separation further increases the value of recorded audio​

Even though it is called "audio source separation", the actual purpose is not to separate sounds; it is to remix sounds after they are separated. For example, old recordings that no longer have a master tape can be multitracked to enable processing into 5.1 ch and other formats. The technology can be used in many other ways as well. An obvious example is orchestra recordings, which are not multitracked but all the instrument will be recorded together, simultaneously. Audio source separation technology separates and rearranges the audio of each instrument. With this technology, listeners can feel as though they are standing in the middle of the stage where the orchestra is performing. If they move closer to the flute player, the flute sounds louder to them. In addition, they can remove the vocals from their favorite tunes to enjoy genuine backing for their karaoke performances. This will eventually support the business of musicians as well.