[ufospls2]

I was considering purchasing a WA5 from Woo, but the responses from customer service (mike sadly, as he seems like a nice enough guy in his non woo duties) were borderline obtuse, and full of old school audio myths (EQ is bad etc....) I am far from an objectivist, but mike repeatedly avoided questions, and acted as a salesman, rather than being helpful and actually answering my questions.

Also, some of the answers from CS (agan, mike) when I owned the WA8 were again, obtuse, and unhelpful.

All in all I can't recommend Woo Audio overall.

It is a shame, as they make beautiful looking products. They are however overpriced, and I fear lack proper support. I wouldn't feel comfortable purchasing another product from Woo.

 

[cantsleep]

Aww.. what a nightmare..

 

[ra990]

So what's the actual deal with the special cable needing extra grounding or whatever? Is that really needed for the WA11? If not, then this is a problem. When we have issues with our Woo products, it's frustrating enough to try and explain what is going on after having done all the obvious self-diagnosis that we can. We don't need to be sent on a wild goose chase about cables that work with every other device we have. Each time, in my case and OP's, we were told there was something wrong with our, otherwise perfect, cables - and we had to indulge them and rule them out before anything else was considered. It just wastes time. If your product requires such unique cable designs, then maybe reconsider the design of the products. Just my two cents.

Also, I want to stress that Mike is a perfectly nice guy to deal with. I even love all his other content. He's enthusiastic about all the products I've talked to him about. He's knowledgeable about them as well. I just think it's time to stop blaming cables so much! The Woo Audio WA8 is one of my favorite pieces of hifi equipment I've ever owned...I never heard the Utopias sound better. But, it sucked that I had to send my unit in like 3 times for the same issue and each time I was told to try a different cable. I even bought a super high end cable that was completely unnecessary, and sent it in to them for inspection just to rule it out as the likely cause. For no reason. It was the unit's power supply the whole time.

And, let's stop pretending that the Woo gear isn't top notch and sounds sublime. This is a rather minor customer service issue that they can correct overnight. This forum is a good place for this kind of feedback and for manufacturers to hear honestly from their customers.

 

[Jeozer]

So what's the actual deal with the special cable needing extra grounding or whatever? Is that really needed for the WA11? If not, then this is a problem. When we have issues with our Woo products, it's frustrating enough to try and explain what is going on after having done all the obvious self-diagnosis that we can. We don't need to be sent on a wild goose chase about cables that work with every other device we have. Each time, in my case and OP's, we were told there was something wrong with our, otherwise perfect, cables - and we had to indulge them and rule them out before anything else was considered. It just wastes time. If your product requires such unique cable designs, then maybe reconsider the design of the products. Just my two cents.

Also, I want to stress that Mike is a perfectly nice guy to deal with. I even love all his other content. He's enthusiastic about all the products I've talked to him about. He's knowledgeable about them as well. I just think it's time to stop blaming cables so much! The Woo Audio WA8 is one of my favorite pieces of hifi equipment I've ever owned...I never heard the Utopias sound better. But, it sucked that I had to send my unit in like 3 times for the same issue and each time I was told to try a different cable. I even bought a super high end cable that was completely unnecessary, and sent it in to them for inspection just to rule it out as the likely cause. For no reason. It was the unit's power supply the whole time.

And guys, let's stop pretending that the Woo gear isn't top notch and sounds sublime. This is a rather minor issue that they can correct overnight. So let's not swear them off like some are doing. This forum is a good place for this kind of feedback and for manufacturers to hear honestly from their customers.

You are not even the second guys who I heard that had ‘cable issue’ with woo, the thing is sometime when there’s no conflict of interest, people are perfectly fine with each other, but when there is, they will come up with thousand excuses just to avoid spending money, they have to be better at their job because their competitors are not trash in this particular department, a person who spent money on wa11 may consider a wa33 in the future, that’s very possible, but this type of activities will stop them from doing so and saddest part is woo hasn’t realized the aftermath.
I honestly believe woo is probably my least favorite brand among hiend headphone amp regime. For portable amp, wa11 may have its place, but when it comes to desktop, there are way too many better choices sound just as good and better that doesn’t mess around with their customers. So why should I choose woo?

 

[Giru]

You are not even the second guys who I heard that had ‘cable issue’ with woo, the thing is sometime when there’s no conflict of interest, people are perfectly fine with each other, but when there is, they will come up with thousand excuses just to avoid spending money, they have to be better at their job because their competitors are not trash in this particular department, a person who spent money on wa11 may consider a wa33 in the future, that’s very possible, but this type of activities will stop them from doing so and saddest part is woo hasn’t realized the aftermath.
I honestly believe woo is probably my least favorite brand among hiend headphone amp regime. For portable amp, wa11 may have its place, but when it comes to desktop, there are way too many better choices sound just as good and better that doesn’t mess around with their customers. So why should I choose woo?

Exactly. They price their products on a very high tier and if the customer still has to run from pillar to post to find support for his/her device then it reflects very poorly on the company.
Why should a potential customer not spend his/her money elsewhere? Whats the use of "better" sound when you have to send the unit for repairs so often?

 

[Currawong]

Just came across this thread. Something I want to suggest is: Be careful with headphone jacks when you plug them in, either as an interconnect or on headphones, as it can sometimes happen that they aren't inserted all the way, and they will short the connections. While this happens briefly on every insertion, and is not harmful for that fraction of a second that it occurs, if it is left shorted for some seconds, with some circuits it is possible to cause permanent damage. In my experience, when this happens, you damage one channel. Noting that I have no idea how the WA11 is designed, I just wanted to offer the possibility that this could have happened.

 

[JohnZS]

So what's the actual deal with the special cable needing extra grounding or whatever? Is that really needed for the WA11? If not, then this is a problem. When we have issues with our Woo products, it's frustrating enough to try and explain what is going on after having done all the obvious self-diagnosis that we can. We don't need to be sent on a wild goose chase about cables that work with every other device we have. Each time, in my case and OP's, we were told there was something wrong with our, otherwise perfect, cables - and we had to indulge them and rule them out before anything else was considered. It just wastes time. If your product requires such unique cable designs, then maybe reconsider the design of the products. Just my two cents.

Also, I want to stress that Mike is a perfectly nice guy to deal with. I even love all his other content. He's enthusiastic about all the products I've talked to him about. He's knowledgeable about them as well. I just think it's time to stop blaming cables so much! The Woo Audio WA8 is one of my favorite pieces of hifi equipment I've ever owned...I never heard the Utopias sound better. But, it sucked that I had to send my unit in like 3 times for the same issue and each time I was told to try a different cable. I even bought a super high end cable that was completely unnecessary, and sent it in to them for inspection just to rule it out as the likely cause. For no reason. It was the unit's power supply the whole time.

And, let's stop pretending that the Woo gear isn't top notch and sounds sublime. This is a rather minor customer service issue that they can correct overnight. This forum is a good place for this kind of feedback and for manufacturers to hear honestly from their customers.

I see you are a very very nice person by calling someone 'knowledgeable' and 'perfectly nice guy to deal with' when he BSed you so much, you had to send in an item for repair 3 times?! And he keeps using the same kind of BS excuse over and over again for a broad range of issues. Sounds like you wasted so much time, energy, and ALOT of unnecessary $$$, frustrated trying to make it work, but the real issue is Woo's product. And you are the one who finally found the true cause of the issue.
OMG, you are nice on your feedback about Mike, but you also gave the story which sounds like a nightmare dealing with him and Woo.
I feel bad for you just running around wasting time and money, believed whatever Mike told you was the issue.

Sir(I assume), your positivity, patience and $$$ earned my respect.

Thanks for your thoughts, I would mostly agree with your feedback about Mike until less than 2 weeks ago. He does sound like a nice guy until you have anything that might cost them money. Then he will start endlessly blaming the cables, going into technical details and tell you their theories that won't help the case(but you can't say anything else since you can't effectively disprove them). Then putting the customer who is having a problem with their device on a self-diagnose, not realizing why the customer contacted them in the first place.
In my case, he even lied to me about the free services/repair once I get it back to them.

I know I'm not the first person who had said experience with Mike. In fact, a friend of mine who just had some obvious problem with stuff bought from Woo a week ago. He came to me and told me that Mike pissed him off by shoving some weird technical theory, finding excuses, doesn't believe my friend is having a real issue with the item, overall no help but wasting his time and pissed him off. Then still told my friend to do more self-diagnose. Luckily my friend has the option of contacting the manufacturer, and he did. While Mike is still blaming some weird software stuff, my friend got the RA and has shipped the item for repair.

The experience my friend told me has a very similar pattern to my case, coincidence? I don't believe so.
Your story tells me that you dealt with a case even worse than mine, and Woo not only lacks in morality, customer service, product quality, but also technology(as they didn't even find the true issue)

Bottom line: If the design/quality of a product isn't there, and the aftersale is trash(at the best). Then combined with the price, it makes a very expensive piece of trash that will cost you a lot more unnecessary money, time, frustration, and get you pissed in the process.
The product/service which you spent all this money, which you should have been enjoying in the first place.

 

[JohnZS]

Just came across this thread. Something I want to suggest is: Be careful with headphone jacks when you plug them in, either as an interconnect or on headphones, as it can sometimes happen that they aren't inserted all the way, and they will short the connections. While this happens briefly on every insertion, and is not harmful for that fraction of a second that it occurs, if it is left shorted for some seconds, with some circuits it is possible to cause permanent damage. In my experience, when this happens, you damage one channel. Noting that I have no idea how the WA11 is designed, I just wanted to offer the possibility that this could have happened.

Thanks for pointing that out, I'm aware of that as a friend warned me a LONG time ago. I try to at least zero the volume whenever I move the jacks.
Judging from Woo's theory and blame, I think this issue is probably more complicated than that.
Also, this issue first happened in the middle of a listening session when I was just enjoying the music, Diana Phi is the only headphone I have in hand(not this moment of course), so it's not like I unplug it from WA11 often at all...

 

[soundblast75]

Just came across this thread. Something I want to suggest is: Be careful with headphone jacks when you plug them in, either as an interconnect or on headphones, as it can sometimes happen that they aren't inserted all the way, and they will short the connections. While this happens briefly on every insertion, and is not harmful for that fraction of a second that it occurs, if it is left shorted for some seconds, with some circuits it is possible to cause permanent damage. In my experience, when this happens, you damage one channel. Noting that I have no idea how the WA11 is designed, I just wanted to offer the possibility that this could have happened.

The point is you're outside let's say, what do you do, unit is off

 

[HiFiGuy528]

today is the first time I am seeing this thread.

I find @JohnZS posts to share private email communications on a public forum without letting me or anyone at Woo Audio know to be very unprofessional. I've had no chance to respond to his posts until many others have seen it and commented on his one-sided story. @warrenpchi @jude @AnakChan (moderator).

I've tried to help John with his concerns on WA11 via many emails and phone calls PRIOR to him sending the WA11 to us for an inspection. Up until our inspection of his WA11, we did not know what was going on with the unit other than his explanation of the problems. In troubleshooting, there are many possible causes when it comes to noise concerns. Because I cannot see or inspect the system chain, I can only make recommendations based on what is shared with me verbally.

Long story short, I explained to JohnZs that we designed WA11 topaz's 4.4mm input to the official Pentaconn specs (5-pole). And in order for the analog input to function properly, all 5-poles must be connected. JohnZs told me he was using a Moon Audio made 2.5mm cable to 4.4mm from his A&K player as the source. According to AK website, the 2.5mm output is "only 4-poles supported". I told John, for this reason the cable is not recommended for use with WA11's 4.4mm input which is 5-pole. I never once said that the Moon-Audio cable was the cause to the problems he was having with WA11. I simply explained the tech behind 4.4mm Pentaconn.

The communication between me and John ceased when he emailed Moon-Audio stating I said the Moon-Audio cable caused the damage to his WA11. As you can see in the many posts JohnZs shared in this thread, some are personal attacks and unprofessional. I don't appreciate that nor would take the conversation further and escalate the situation so I looped in Jack Wu (owner of Woo Audio) to further assist JohnZs.

JohnZs WA11 is out of warranty. Jack offered JohnZs a discount on the repair. The out of pocket cost for the repair is $150 which includes parts, labor, and return shipping.

 

[creeper62]

Ah! Cables! As a former WA11 owner, I can’t be more familiar with this. When my WA11’s dac module failed, the first thing I was told was that I used the wrong USB cable. On what a world can an USB cable possibly damage dac? Plus I have been using the stock type c USB for the whole time. And guess what? When I sent it in for repair, it was some internal power issue that caused dac to fail. Luckily it was still within warranty and I sold it as soon I got it back. After looking things up online, I found I am not the only one having such issue. WA11 is a great sounding machine but has significant engineering flaws.

 

[Teaster]

today is the first time I am seeing this thread.

I find @JohnZS posts to share private email communications on a public forum without letting me or anyone at Woo Audio know to be very unprofessional. I've had no chance to respond to his posts until many others have seen it and commented on his one-sided story. @AnakChan (moderator).

I've tried to help John with his concerns on WA11 via many emails and phone calls PRIOR to him sending the WA11 to us for an inspection. Up until our inspection of his WA11, we did not know what was going on with the unit other than his explanation of the problems. In troubleshooting, there are many possible causes when it comes to noise concerns. Because I cannot see or inspect the system chain, I can only make recommendations based on what is shared with me verbally.

Long story short, I explained to JohnZs that we designed WA11 topaz's 4.4mm input to the official Pentaconn specs (5-pole). And in order for the analog input to function properly, all 5-poles must be connected. JohnZs told me he was using a Moon Audio made 2.5mm cable to 4.4mm from his A&K player as the source. According to AK website, the 2.5mm output is "only 4-poles supported". I told John, for this reason the cable is not recommended for use with WA11's 4.4mm input which is 5-pole. I never once said that the Moon-Audio cable was the cause to the problems he was having with WA11. I simply explained the tech behind 4.4mm Pentaconn.

The communication between me and John ceased when he emailed Moon-Audio stating I said the Moon-Audio cable caused the damage to his WA11. As you can see in the many posts JohnZs shared in this thread, some are personal attacks and unprofessional. I don't appreciate that nor would take the conversation further and escalate the situation so I looped in Jack Wu (owner of Woo Audio) to further assist JohnZs.

JohnZs WA11 is out of warranty. Jack offered JohnZs a discount on the repair.

I did not think John did anything wrong, but I think the way you treated your customers is really unprofessional.

 

[seamon]

I find @JohnZS posts to share private email communications on a public forum without letting me or anyone at Woo Audio know to be very unprofessional. I've had no chance to respond to his posts until many others have seen it and commented on his one-sided story. @warrenpchi @jude @AnakChan (moderator).

This is irrelevant imo. The burden of professionalism falls on the Vendor and never the consumer. It's not uncommon for consumers to share emails on the Internet. That is the reason why companies are advised to be professional when dealing with After Sales Support. OP did nothing wrong in sharing his emails.

 

[Guidostrunk]

WOW! I will never consider another one of their products! EVER!

 

[andyli900]

today is the first time I am seeing this thread.

I find @JohnZS posts to share private email communications on a public forum without letting me or anyone at Woo Audio know to be very unprofessional. I've had no chance to respond to his posts until many others have seen it and commented on his one-sided story. @AnakChan (moderator).

I've tried to help John with his concerns on WA11 via many emails and phone calls PRIOR to him sending the WA11 to us for an inspection. Up until our inspection of his WA11, we did not know what was going on with the unit other than his explanation of the problems. In troubleshooting, there are many possible causes when it comes to noise concerns. Because I cannot see or inspect the system chain, I can only make recommendations based on what is shared with me verbally.

Long story short, I explained to JohnZs that we designed WA11 topaz's 4.4mm input to the official Pentaconn specs (5-pole). And in order for the analog input to function properly, all 5-poles must be connected. JohnZs told me he was using a Moon Audio made 2.5mm cable to 4.4mm from his A&K player as the source. According to AK website, the 2.5mm output is "only 4-poles supported". I told John, for this reason the cable is not recommended for use with WA11's 4.4mm input which is 5-pole. I never once said that the Moon-Audio cable was the cause to the problems he was having with WA11. I simply explained the tech behind 4.4mm Pentaconn.

The communication between me and John ceased when he emailed Moon-Audio stating I said the Moon-Audio cable caused the damage to his WA11. As you can see in the many posts JohnZs shared in this thread, some are personal attacks and unprofessional. I don't appreciate that nor would take the conversation further and escalate the situation so I looped in Jack Wu (owner of Woo Audio) to further assist JohnZs.

JohnZs WA11 is out of warranty. Jack offered JohnZs a discount on the repair.

As for me, an unbiased opinion, what you just said are very unprofessional as a customer service rep. I only see you keep attacking John about being unprofessional. In this case, he's the customer, his role doesn't require him to be professional. Just saying man, woo really need someone that knows how to work with people to work with people. Finding scapegoats and personal attacks aren't the way out of this.