Sennheiser HD650 & Massdrop HD6XX Impressions Thread
Aug 2, 2015 at 1:21 AM Post #27,646 of 46,533
For anyone else using a tube amp: Do you sometimes get this weird buzzing sound? I've been having these recently. Not sure if it's the amp, headphones, or DAC. Pretty sure it's either the tubes or the DAC, the DAC is quite old. 

Which tube amp are you using?
It can be dirty pins on the tubes, interference from various radio frequency emitting sources, interference from power supplies, ground loops, bad tubes in general, etc.

To give you an example, the Woo WA7 will hum if the power supply is too close to the amp. Also my Woo WA2 and Eddie Current Zana Deux both pick up faint clicking/distortion sounds from my wireless router if they're in close proximity.

Try moving the amp somewhere else, different tubes, etc. The DAC should be ok if it just goes through RCA cables, and is a couple inches away from the amp. Tubes just pick up radio frequency emissions solid state gear might not have any issues with.

Just some ideas.
 
Aug 2, 2015 at 1:27 AM Post #27,647 of 46,533
Amps are normally rated at a power output in watts for a certain resistance value.

The HD-650's are around 300 ohms of impedance, which you could correlate with the amps power output. Also try this site:
http://www.audiobot9000.com

lol magni hd650 damping factor is 3000 while crack is 3.5
 
Aug 2, 2015 at 3:55 AM Post #27,649 of 46,533
Anybody painted their HD600/650's like these? I would like to know any suggestions you have for disassembly/reassemply, paint choices and methods, etc.

 
Aug 2, 2015 at 6:19 AM Post #27,650 of 46,533
  Vocals at its best 
biggrin.gif

 

Very nice set-up....that should sound wonderful.....I spy a 5998 in your BHC  
smile.gif
 
 
Here is a little some thing that should put a smile on your face, for all of you electric guitar fans

 
Aug 2, 2015 at 10:27 AM Post #27,651 of 46,533
About my headphone buzz, it's not the DAC or the tubes, I switched out the tubes and when I unplugged the DAC I could hear the noise for a few seconds after. Any clue how to fix this?
 
Aug 2, 2015 at 11:42 AM Post #27,653 of 46,533
About my headphone buzz, it's not the DAC or the tubes, I switched out the tubes and when I unplugged the DAC I could hear the noise for a few seconds after. Any clue how to fix this?


Do you hear the buzz with other headphones?
 
Aug 2, 2015 at 11:50 AM Post #27,654 of 46,533
About my headphone buzz, it's not the DAC or the tubes, I switched out the tubes and when I unplugged the DAC I could hear the noise for a few seconds after. Any clue how to fix this?

I have made a post on another thread with 5 ways to fix buzzing from a tube amp, including noisy tubes, linear power supplies, volume limiters, grounding, etc. that should be very useful. Link:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/702826/project-ember-tube-rolling/645#post_11798426
 
Aug 2, 2015 at 12:34 PM Post #27,655 of 46,533
i totally don't know how to read this if an amp spec is put in front of me with a hd650

 
here is the most simple way I can think of to get concrete information for your hd650: 
I think I kept it relativelly understandable and simple, it's long because I explain and repeat stuff several times not to lose people on the way, but there is no rocket science involved at any point in this post(I'm myself just a noob with a few tricks).
 
I pray the god of all calculators that I didn't mess up somewhere. the science is solid, but the human doing it is rather weak in the fingers when typing numbers ^_^.
 
 
 
 
 when you want to know if your headphone will be well driven, you need the impedance of the headphone of course, and how loud you want it to sound! this is very important, because the louder you may go, the more power you'll need. for super quiet listening a sansa clip can drive almost anything. so loudness is very important and subjective opinions not helping at all because you never know how loud the guy is going to listen compared to you.
 
 
 
 
the hd650 is given by sennheiser with those specs:
*     impedance 300ohm (it actually goes higher, but not lower, so using 300ohm is fine here)
 
*     103db @1v @1khz
meaning that if you send a signal of 1khz reaching 1volt RMS into the hd650, it will create a 1khz sound 103db loud. simple stuff really, in fact that's how they measured it. so you see loudness and volts are directly related.
 
the threshold of pain in the medium frequencies is about 115db, so if your amp can drive the hd650 that loud at 1khz, you can claim that it can drive it well for any non masochist usage. ^_^
that's one of the reasons why I aim for 115db when I make estimates to be sure it's always good(but realistically 110db is more than enough for loud listening of most albums).
 
so 1volt gives 103db into the hd650, and we want an amp that's able to push it to 115db. meaning we want to go 115-103=12db louder.
use http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-gainloss.htm  for a gain in decibel of 12db it tells you to multiply your voltage by 3.98. so 3.98*1=3.98v I'm so cool I didn't use the calculator here!
biggrin.gif

 
now you can face 3 situations:
situation 1:
when amp specs give you a voltage into 300ohm like the project ember of our buddy Zorro, the website gives
Max Output voltage: 15.7Vrms at 300Ohm
we determined that we need up to 3.98v for the hd650 so obviously the ember has more than enough to drive it.
 
situation 2:
the most common situation, the amp sepcs give you a power value in watt or milliwatt into a given load(impedance of the headphone).
P=U²/Z (it is, just trust me)
P being the power, U the voltage and Z the impedance. how cool is that? we already know the hd650's impedance is 300ohm, and we have decided that we needed a voltage of 3.98v
so P=3.98²/300= 0.0528w  or 52.8mw. we want an amp that does at least this much, so now we go look for amp specs.
 
for example the shiit magni2 gives
Maximum Power, 300 ohms: 260mW RMS per channel
 
so once again you know that you'll have more than enough.
 
situation 3:
the manufacturer doesn't give a power output into exactly the impedance value of the headphone.
for example the O2 gives
Max Output (150 Ohms)355 mW
Max Output (600 Ohms)88 mW
there you don't know because you don't have the right impedance.
but because you can see you'll have enough power in both cases surrounding the 300ohm of the hd650, at least here you can be confident that it more than ok.
 
in fact if you look a little into it, thanks to all the data nwavguy gave, you can learn that the O2 reaches about the same maximum voltage from 80ohm to 600ohm and that's around 7v. so with our desired 3.98v to get 115db out of the hd650, we're now in situation 1 and we know for sure that we're good.
 
 
to recap:
specifically for the hd650, you want an amp that can do at least 3.98v or 52mw into 300ohm. you don't need to know more but I thought it would be nice to explain why those values instead of throwing them at your face.
 
hope this can help.
 
 
edit: some syntax typos etc. /me spik angrish very good
 
Aug 2, 2015 at 12:42 PM Post #27,656 of 46,533
  Very nice set-up....that should sound wonderful.....I spy a 5998 in your BHC  
smile.gif
 
 
Here is a little some thing that should put a smile on your face, for all of you electric guitar fans

Hi Whirlwind,
 
Thank you very much! My setup really does sound absolutely wonderful, especially when it comes to Vocals, Jazz, Acoustic or other slow music.
 
You're correct about the 5998. I'm using a 5998 and the "Holy Grail" 12AU7 - the Amperex 7316 early 50's long plate "D" getter in place of input tube.
 
Cheers,
Kratos.
 
Aug 3, 2015 at 4:48 AM Post #27,657 of 46,533
I feel like i've gone full circle here.
 
I've meandered through head fi's latest and greatest but ended up with a pair of HD650 again.
 
I may have found my journeys end, but this is certainly not in the way I expected.
 
Aug 3, 2015 at 5:28 AM Post #27,658 of 46,533
@Cakensaur that's interesting you chose the HD 650 after the latest and greatest. I find if to be superior than about 90% of all headphones out there - but IMO, those other 10%-ish beat the HD 650 hands down, namely HE-6, Stax SR 09 (& maybe 07), MDR R10, some of the Audeze's, and maybe AKG K712. Do you have any experience comparing to those? That would be neat to hear about it.
 
Aug 3, 2015 at 6:36 AM Post #27,659 of 46,533
Its emotional more than technical, my hd800/T1/LCD-2 all sounded better from a technical perspective, but frankly its more of a feeling that i got from the HD650 than anything else.
Put it this way, i've really liked a lot of headphones, but i've always missed the HD650's when listening to the higher tier cans, the only pair that didn't make me feel that way were my LCD-2's, and i needed to sell them because i was in a bit of financial trouble, so i've repurchased the HD650.
 
Sorry for not being very descriptive in this, by the way
 
Aug 3, 2015 at 7:41 AM Post #27,660 of 46,533
  I feel like i've gone full circle here.
 
I've meandered through head fi's latest and greatest but ended up with a pair of HD650 again.
 
I may have found my journeys end, but this is certainly not in the way I expected.


Willkommen in der Dunklen Seite!
 

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